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JonnasN from Porto, Portugal Since: Jul, 2012
#16551: Dec 12th 2015 at 12:28:38 PM

I'm rather surprised Bojack hasn't been on the list yet. It shares the same flaws as Tree of Might and Android 13.

Also, I was hoping Lord Slug would be higher on the list. I like that one.

Lionheart0 Since: Oct, 2009 Relationship Status: I'm just a hunk-a, hunk-a burnin' love
#16552: Dec 12th 2015 at 12:30:46 PM

Calling someone a 'weeaboo' is extremely derogatory, the anime fan equivalent of the N word so yeah it would be.

Yeah, let's not make comparisons like that.

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#16553: Dec 12th 2015 at 12:31:19 PM

I was hoping Lord Slug and Cooler 1 would be higher. Yeah their stories are kinda rehashes, but they were at least better than the nonsensical or dull stuff that's still up there.

If Trunks isn't number 1, we riot.

BaffleBlend Hey there! Having fun? from Somewhere Since: Dec, 2012 Relationship Status: LET'S HAVE A ZILLION BABIES
Hey there! Having fun?
#16554: Dec 12th 2015 at 12:35:41 PM

I'm willing to bet DBcember '16 is gonna be the Top 24 Games. Just as a wild guess.

"It's liberating, realizing you never need to be competent." — Ultimatepheer
Lionheart0 Since: Oct, 2009 Relationship Status: I'm just a hunk-a, hunk-a burnin' love
#16555: Dec 12th 2015 at 12:35:46 PM

I'm expecting the top 5 to be Bardock, History of Trunks, World's Strongest, Fusion Reborn, and Battle of Gods.

Memers Since: Aug, 2013
#16556: Dec 12th 2015 at 12:44:13 PM

[up]x6 Bojack actually has a lot going for it, the tournament at the start was actually pretty good and some really funny Krillin moments in it.

[up]x5 It is offensive and derogatory...

edited 12th Dec '15 12:49:32 PM by Memers

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#16557: Dec 12th 2015 at 12:57:35 PM

I expect Wrath of the Dragon to be in the top 5, it's pretty cool. I'd put it higher than Bardock, at least.

edited 12th Dec '15 12:58:03 PM by Anomalocaris20

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#16558: Dec 12th 2015 at 1:18:26 PM

edited 12th Dec '15 1:18:36 PM by VeryMelon

BaconManiac5000 Since: Nov, 2013 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
#16559: Dec 12th 2015 at 2:00:06 PM

I'm surprised no one has picked up on the pun in my title yet....

what do you mean I didn't win, I ate more wet t-shirts than anyone else
Zelenal The Cat Knows Where It's At from Purrgatory Since: Jul, 2009 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
The Cat Knows Where It's At
#16560: Dec 12th 2015 at 2:01:06 PM

I noticed it. I just didn't care to comment.

Let the joy of love give you an answer! Check out my book!
wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#16561: Dec 12th 2015 at 2:01:06 PM

[up][up][up][up][up]Degree is important. Consider calling someone a "silly goose", or intentionally ridiculing one of the from-birth features they have had as a human being. See the difference? A name often used with knowing jest isn't the equivalent of something with a centuries-old history of hatred and dehumanization.

[up][up]I didn't see it until you pointed it out. I tend not to read or notice the forum bonuses, unless it's someone I've seen and gotten familiar with over a long time who changes up something that surprises me.
It's also subtle enough that since I don't read some things that closely on here, I probably wouldn't have noticed. Clever, though. Maybe a holiday Buu or Bee would've been funnier?

edited 12th Dec '15 2:26:06 PM by wanderlustwarrior

BaconManiac5000 Since: Nov, 2013 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
#16562: Dec 12th 2015 at 2:19:45 PM

Oh, okay. :/

what do you mean I didn't win, I ate more wet t-shirts than anyone else
JonnasN from Porto, Portugal Since: Jul, 2012
#16563: Dec 12th 2015 at 3:04:41 PM

For what it's worth, I noticed it (and liked it), I just don't tend to comment on people's signatures and/or avatars much.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#16564: Dec 12th 2015 at 3:05:40 PM

The "Satan's Little Helper" thing? Yeah, I get it.

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
KarkatTheDalek Not as angry as the name would suggest. from Somwhere in Time/Space Since: Mar, 2012 Relationship Status: You're a beautiful woman, probably
Not as angry as the name would suggest.
#16565: Dec 12th 2015 at 3:42:27 PM

It is offensive and derogatory...

It might be a little mean, but I wouldn't equate it with a slur that has centuries of oppression behind it.

Oh God! Natural light!
VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#16566: Dec 12th 2015 at 6:04:09 PM

I never looked at Bacon's avatar sig until just now. I get the joke.

BaconManiac5000 Since: Nov, 2013 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
#16567: Dec 12th 2015 at 6:16:16 PM

You know, I feel like I should put less effort into my profile.

what do you mean I didn't win, I ate more wet t-shirts than anyone else
Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#16568: Dec 12th 2015 at 6:20:12 PM

ONCE MORE, I HAVE BEEN SUMMONED... waaaaay later that I was called upon. Look it takes like an hour to get a pizza delivered from a store 2kms away, it's just how Australians operate.

[[quoteblock]Also I think you all make way too big a deal of those afterlife mechanics. So Toei fudged how some of the rules work, it's not like it really matters all that much.[[/quoteblock]]

I agree with Heatth's point about the consistency, but it's also more that just fudging the rules. The changes they make are pretty major and I find their version to be way less nuanced and interesting as Toriyama's afterlife, which had a clearly defined set of rules that were kept consistent and worked well with the story, while avoiding the Fridge Logic fans point out when they don't understand the differences (not knocking the fans, just showing that Toriyama actually thought it through pretty well - his version holds up to scrutiny). And, uh, not everything Toriyama writes DOES hold up to scrutiny so losing the things that do kind of sucks.

[[quoteblock]...Or he could have teleported there. Because he learned that too.

Even if he couldn't sense anyone on Earth he could have done the thing where he used King Kai as a stopping point.

I guess Goku forgetting he can do that is actually a thing.[[/quoteblock]]

That's not why he did it. He didn't know where New Namek was, so he asked Kaio to point him in the right direction. He doesn't mention needing to improve his range.

Also we don't know how long he was actually in transit for. After finishing his training, he may have felt that the distance was short enough to wait it out. The attack ball spaceships are incredibly fast, since one took Goku from Earth to Namek in six days.

[[quoteblock]Toriyama only started saying "screw it" and having the Earth Dragonballs bring people back infinite times on as many people as you want in the Buu Saga, right?[[/quoteblock]]

Skimming the thread I think this was already addressed but the Earth Dragon Balls were never upgraded to allow multiple revivals of an individual and Toriyama remained consistent on this. Consequently, Goku could not be revived after the Cell Games unless someone was able to get to New Namek (easiest way would be for Goku to use up his one day return for it).

[[quoteblock]I am very curious where you guys got that. That wasn't the case at all in the translation I've read. I mean, Earth's Dragon Balls have always been able to do mass revivals and that never ate 2 wishes (else it wouldn't work before Dende).[[/quoteblock]]

Mass revivals working before Dende is the only weird thing here, and it isn't addressed directly. I would explain it as a mass revival used all of the previous Shenron's entire wishing power. Dende's Shenron is upgraded, meaning it has more overall wishing power which can be split among three wishes. That doesn't mean each individual wish was as powerful as the previous iteration.

Personally, I find it annoying when people use "Freeza" and "Ten" instead of "Tien" and "Frieza", but, I cope. That's just the way the English dub did it.

With most animes I don't bother, but with DB specifically, the English version gained more than just a niche following, and it generally means a lot more to fans than the Japanese version. That's pretty widely agreed, and insisting on the Japanese names despite that doesn't reflect well on the person who does it. If anything, it just makes people look like they're in denial, like how in-universe Vegeta refuses to accept that Goku Kakarot changed his name.

I just can't understand this at all. Genuinely cannot understand this idea.

The Funimation Z English dub is not absolute. Notice how I needed that many qualifiers to even describe it accurately. Not everyone was exposed to it as their main source for this series, not everyone continues to watch it, and I just don't see why it should hold sway over people who don't deal with it.

Generally means a lot more to which fans? And why is that worth anything? Popularity isn't a measure of quality. I don't need to change my use of terms to appease other people, that's fucking ridiculous.

It's got nothing to do with denial. I can't even understand why you'd think that, unless you're thinking that dub is waaaay more important to the franchise than it really is. It isn't important at all. Funimation's dubbing has no impact on anything other than Funimation's dubbing. To think otherwise would be denial.

God, what is so abhorrent about people using the terms they're most comfortable with? I don't have any problem with people using dub names if that's what they wish, it's not that hard to put up with.

And it's not at all comparable to Goku changing his name because his new name actually has meaning. He grew up as Goku, he has nothing to do with the Saiyans that named him Kakarot. Whereas the English dub is not the primary source of Dragon Ball, even if it's the one some fans have the most exposure to.

I kind of get "Ten", Tien-shinhan and Ten-shinhan can sound more or less the same. Also kind of cool is that Cell calls him "Tien" while Chiaotzu says "Tenshinhan".

Ten doesn't come from Tien. It's an actual nickname for him in the original (for instance, Chaozu refers to him exclusively as "Ten-san" in the manga).

also the official spelling, as seen in Namek saga

[[quoteblock]I find it weird to, but it is how it is written in the original.[[/quoteblock]]

This is ignoring that Toriyama is notoriously inconsistent with English spellings, changing them frequently (for Bulma/Goku at least). He also doesn't know English and frequently fucks it up (writing WELL COME in place of "welcome", for instance).

Anything he spells in English should be taken with a grain of salt, and not as a sign of his authoritative intent. He has no fucking idea what he's doing with English.

I know it's filler, but how the heck did the Ginyu's managed to maintain their bodies anyway? Kami had to specifically pull some strings to make it happen for Goku.

Because Toei cares nothing for consistency.

In Toei's Hell, everyone has their bodies. There's tons of filler with bodied characters in Hell. The most egregious would be that time that Frieza and Cell broke out of Hell, forcing Goku and Filler-Character Pikkon to have to go put them back down.

This answer is not entirely accurate. Until the Ginyu Force showed up, we didn't see any other villain keep their bodies, and Kaio said he arranged the Ginyu Force coming to his planet to serve as sparring partners. While not directly stated, them being returned to their bodies would logically be part of that deal.

It's after that point that villains start keeping their bodies without explanation, including the Ginyus now that they no longer need them for Kaio's sparring. I'm guessing this could have been a simple matter of oversight (seeing that the Ginyu Force kept their bodies, other filler writers began writing for similar scenarios without knowing the circumstance) or deliberately ignoring this because going back to dead characters makes for good filler.

The part about the Ginyu bodies still being on Namek is a total Toei fuck-up, though.

In Abridged, King Kai just tosses the Ginyu force off his planet.

The Ginyu who are supposed to be stronger than Vegeta (though that did change).

Vegeta, who, alongside Nappa, was stronger than King Kai.

As already answered, abridged Kaio is simply much stronger than manga Kaio ever was.

This was one change I really liked. For starters it was hilarious and unexpected, but I also felt that Kaio's original strength was a victim of not planning far enough ahead. The reason he was weaker than Nappa originally was entirely to build up for the coming Saiyans, and show that Goku would have to surpass even this incredible master to be able to stand up to them. But it also makes Kaio way less of an incredible master even in his own introduction, and the power escalation of the following arc then makes him look kind of pathetic.

This is normal for the series, and Gods were originally portrayed as not being uniquely powerful, but I would have appreciated some forward thinking so that Kaio being surpassed is actually impressive when it happens. He's in a position where he could afford to remain unsurpassed for a while and it wouldn't hurt the story (unlike God, who reached the point where he was willing to step in himself and therefore would solve too many problems if he were stronger).

And it completely eliminated the terrible fight with the Earthlings.

Moth13 Since: Sep, 2010
#16569: Dec 12th 2015 at 6:27:56 PM

The changes they make are pretty major

Yeah but the ramification on the plot aren't, which is why I find it weird that people harp on it so much.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#16570: Dec 12th 2015 at 8:08:52 PM

I would've preferred it if Kaio's Power Level was in the tens of millions. Establish that, as a god, he is WAY above the mortal plane but also having Freeza be stronger than him would be good to hype him up.

Guy01 Since: Mar, 2015
#16571: Dec 12th 2015 at 8:10:06 PM

[up]Going by that, how powerful should Supreme Kai have been?

Ok, who let Light Yagami in here?
BaconManiac5000 Since: Nov, 2013 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
#16572: Dec 12th 2015 at 8:11:27 PM

Yeah, I find it weird that in Dragon Ball, frikkin gods are relatively low on the galactic scale of badassery.

Even before the main cast became comparatively ridiculously strong.

what do you mean I didn't win, I ate more wet t-shirts than anyone else
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#16573: Dec 12th 2015 at 8:12:14 PM

Yeah, I can agree with that. Toriyama burned the "More powerful than even Kaio-sama" awe on Nappa when it would have been more appropriate for Frieza. He just didn't think that far ahead because Frieza wasn't a thing yet.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Guy01 Since: Mar, 2015
#16574: Dec 12th 2015 at 8:13:20 PM

[up][up]And then Beerus showed up. [lol]

Ok, who let Light Yagami in here?
BaconManiac5000 Since: Nov, 2013 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
#16575: Dec 12th 2015 at 8:15:56 PM

Yeah, but isn't it weird how most gods are like weaker than the average punk who worked for Freeza and then Beerus showed up and could Saitama Majin Buu if he wanted?

edited 12th Dec '15 8:18:22 PM by BaconManiac5000

what do you mean I didn't win, I ate more wet t-shirts than anyone else

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