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TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#12126: Jun 2nd 2015 at 9:52:19 AM

Tien tends to be a spectator when he's not just absent entirely. This was the highlight of his career post-Raditz.

edited 2nd Jun '15 9:52:50 AM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#12127: Jun 2nd 2015 at 10:20:20 AM

The highlight of Tien's career is getting you guys to talk about him at length decades after his moment in the spotlight.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#12128: Jun 2nd 2015 at 10:32:13 AM

That's not a highlight, we talk about everyone at length decades afterwards.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#12129: Jun 2nd 2015 at 11:55:30 AM

I totally agree that Tien's actions shouldn't be considered irrelevant due to actions outside of his control.

We don't know what Cell would have done if he'd gone perfect before Trunks and Vegeta got out of the room of time and spirit, but we do know that he would have been perfect.

Trunks and Vegeta would have arrived in time to be stomped, and what happens from there is unknown, but I'm going on the assumption it would have been pretty bad.

Tien's actions gave the group the time they needed. Because of that Cell became interested in seeing if anyone could give him a good fight, gave the Z Warriors time to train for the Cell games ( and by default, Goku and Gohan time to finish their own training) which is why Goku was able to find out that Gohan could surpass him and rofl-stomp Cell. I get that some of you dislike trying to make certain characters more important than they really are, but now it seems you're going in the opposite direction: taking one of the few accomplishments of a non-Saiyan character and downplaying it to keep him a loser.

Tien is a loser, but that loser had his day, and it should not be shat upon.

Handsome Rob wins. Debate Fatality.

One Strip! One Strip!
wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#12130: Jun 2nd 2015 at 12:02:22 PM

Hmm. When you think about it, they were almost at full strength after this, and then got destroyed in short order by Nappa. Maybe if they worked better as a team, they could've done more against him.

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#12131: Jun 2nd 2015 at 12:03:32 PM

[up][up] Well, you've certainly managed to convince me that everything Tien did was completely meaningless.

edited 2nd Jun '15 12:03:38 PM by unnoun

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#12132: Jun 2nd 2015 at 12:04:53 PM

[up]......

What?

Shit. Not my intention.

I need you to take the blame for this Unnoun. Other wise, I have to take responsibility for my mistakes.

edited 2nd Jun '15 12:06:15 PM by HandsomeRob

One Strip! One Strip!
unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#12133: Jun 2nd 2015 at 12:13:10 PM

I think you managed the debate equivalent of an own goal.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#12134: Jun 2nd 2015 at 12:20:17 PM

Tien created a possibility that Vegeta and Trunks would destroy Cell before he achieved his Perfect Form. Without him, that possibility never would have existed in the first place.

It should not be overstated; Tien was not pivotal to the defeat of Cell. The opportunity he created was thoroughly wasted by Vegeta and Krillin's choices. In the end, it came to naught. The protagonists lost this fight.

But it should also not be understated. Tien's contribution was no less than Piccolo buying time for Goku to complete the Spirit Bomb that didn't kill Frieza, or Android 16 sacrificing his life so that Gohan could become a Super Saiyan 2 and not kill Cell, or Goku and Piccolo teaching Goten and Trunks the Fusion Dance so that Gotenks could not defeat Majin Buu. To say that Tien's contribution meant nothing is to say that the only part of a conflict that has any value is the final blow delivered to the villain.

edited 2nd Jun '15 12:21:34 PM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#12135: Jun 2nd 2015 at 12:21:49 PM

[up]

Yes.

You did a much better job of saying that then I did. I wanted to say something like that, but oddly enough couldn't think of any good examples.

Just because nothing came out of it, doesn't make it completely meaningless.

One Strip! One Strip!
HextarVigar That guy from The Big House Since: Feb, 2015
That guy
#12136: Jun 2nd 2015 at 12:24:01 PM

Yeah, Tien's kind of like Yamcha.

Except, y'know, actually useful.

Your momma's so dumb she thinks oral sex means talking dirty.
Enlong Court Dragon from The Underground Facility Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: is commanded to— WANK!
Court Dragon
#12137: Jun 2nd 2015 at 1:38:35 PM

So not at all like Yamcha.

I have a message from another time...
LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#12139: Jun 2nd 2015 at 1:59:04 PM

[up][up]He's like Yamcha most of the time in Z except here. Everyone is actually.

940131 Since: Feb, 2014
#12140: Jun 2nd 2015 at 3:07:33 PM

Pretty much everyone in Z becomes Yamcha at some point. Jokes aside, I've always liked Yamcha. He lost most of his fights, lost his girlfriend to Vegeta and ended the series wandering the desert with his cat. He never had a wife or kids and IIRC, that was the main reason Krillin and Yamcha became martial artists.

edited 2nd Jun '15 3:12:30 PM by 940131

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#12141: Jun 2nd 2015 at 3:31:44 PM

It was the main reason Krillin did. Yamcha got his initial skills as a bandit, then kept at it just because. He enjoyed fighting and adventuring with Goku.

Yamcha did initially want to use the Dragon Balls to overcome his crippling fear of women, but that was a separate issue unrelated to his fighting. He fought because it was enjoyable. He stopped because it wasn't fun anymore.

Unlike Tien, Yamcha and Krillin were always Goku's friends first and foremost, fighters second. They fell out of combat roles when more capable fighters became available, but never fell out of being Goku's friends.

edited 2nd Jun '15 3:33:25 PM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Eriorguez Since: Jun, 2009
#12142: Jun 2nd 2015 at 3:35:38 PM

Tien is Can't Catch Up and Weak, but Skilled. Or, in other words, serious Krillin who is not a main character. Yamcha, meanwhile, started out as Innefectual Sympathetic Villian, and then became a jobber.

What he did in the Cell saga was to create an opportunity. The kind of stuff Krillin usually does, and Yamcha didn't do since Pilaf.

And now I am kinda wondering how both bald humans end up as the hermits of their respective schools... Hoping Super is a bit more than "Goku and Vegeta do insane stuff again".

Enlong Court Dragon from The Underground Facility Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: is commanded to— WANK!
Court Dragon
#12143: Jun 2nd 2015 at 4:27:49 PM

I get the feeling that the only way Super could be anything other than that is if it was a reboot instead of a sequel. The power creep is just too huge to revert in any other way.

I have a message from another time...
LeGarcon Blowout soon fellow Stalker from Skadovsk Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
#12144: Jun 2nd 2015 at 4:31:15 PM

Goku and Vegeta fall down some stairs. This forces the rest of the characters to be relevant.

Oh really when?
unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#12145: Jun 2nd 2015 at 5:09:54 PM

I mean, if there were less overtly action-based elements it would probably work.

If there was action based around things other than fighting.

Like.

...Dammit I'm imagining the Para Para Brothers making Goku and Vegeta dance forever.

But, like. A dance-off.

Corporate intrigue involving Capsule Corp.

A crime noir starring Krillin.

Poachers in a park being ranged by 17. Having to figure out where they're sending the captured animals.

Someone's threatening to expose Mr. Satan and Chichi's panicking because they need that money.

The Paozu Tuna are going extinct because of Goku and they don't have anything to eat anymore but Oolong.

WillKeaton from Alberta, Canada Since: Jun, 2010
#12146: Jun 2nd 2015 at 5:16:33 PM

Or they could do the story line where a monster is attacking a village and wants pretty lady sacrifices, and the good guys try to stop it by having a guy dress up as a woman. You know, for the 4th time.

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#12148: Jun 2nd 2015 at 5:18:21 PM

Can it be Piccolo who dresses as a woman this time?

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#12149: Jun 2nd 2015 at 5:20:03 PM

But then it wouldn't technically be a guy dressing up as a woman. That's way too much original thought. Comes way too close to destabilizing the status quo the entire joke is based on.

edited 2nd Jun '15 5:21:48 PM by unnoun

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#12150: Jun 2nd 2015 at 5:21:02 PM

Hmm, just have Oolong shapeshift into one then. He probably does that all the time when he's alone.

edited 2nd Jun '15 5:21:28 PM by Anomalocaris20

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!

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