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TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#9176: Jan 15th 2015 at 12:30:50 PM

Looking forward to this.

Also readily anticipating the first Broly Abridged movie. There is just so much material for lampooning in Broly.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
alekos23 Since: Mar, 2013
Lionheart0 Since: Oct, 2009 Relationship Status: I'm just a hunk-a, hunk-a burnin' love
#9178: Jan 15th 2015 at 12:33:19 PM

And I don't know why he's so cool. Is it the one arm? Is it the face scar?

It's the badass Kirk Summation he gives.

edited 15th Jan '15 12:33:55 PM by Lionheart0

SonOfSharknado Love is Love is Love Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
FOFD Since: Apr, 2013
#9180: Jan 15th 2015 at 12:41:58 PM

It's the Yamcha look.

Everyone bashes him to hide the fact that he probably has the coolest character design, at least among the humans.

Enlong Court Dragon from The Underground Facility Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: is commanded to— WANK!
Court Dragon
#9181: Jan 15th 2015 at 12:42:25 PM

Oh man, Broly Abridged would be great. Wimp Vegeta is perhaps the most unintentionally funny moment in the series.

I have a message from another time...
LordofLore Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Consider his love an honor
#9182: Jan 15th 2015 at 12:42:29 PM

You know you can't win! You can't destroy what I really am! Even if you manage to kill this body, someone even stronger would surface and take my place! Not one death will go unaccounted for, not one!
This one or something else?

edited 15th Jan '15 12:42:47 PM by LordofLore

SonOfSharknado Love is Love is Love Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Love is Love is Love
#9183: Jan 15th 2015 at 12:43:25 PM

Kinda falls on its face when Trunks got his ass hilariously beat.

My various fanfics.
LordofLore Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Consider his love an honor
#9184: Jan 15th 2015 at 12:44:58 PM

Well yeah, it takes a trip to the past when he is around Future Gohans level to reach the power to kill them.

Lionheart0 Since: Oct, 2009 Relationship Status: I'm just a hunk-a, hunk-a burnin' love
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#9186: Jan 15th 2015 at 12:46:48 PM

I still want to know why nobody in Trunks's Bad Future ever thought of using the Dragon Balls to bring everyone back.

Like, I know that Earth's Dragon Balls are gone because Piccolo was killed by the Androids, but there is a perfectly good set on New Namek, and Bulma knows this. Not being able to find the place isn't much of an excuse either, because where do you think Dead Goku is if not chilling with Kaio-sama?

Trunks's timeline requires the cast to conveniently forgot about the series' favorite Plot Device for the purpose of drama. History of Trunks is still a pretty cool special, but seriously, that bugs me.

edited 15th Jan '15 12:48:42 PM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
SonOfSharknado Love is Love is Love Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Love is Love is Love
#9187: Jan 15th 2015 at 12:49:50 PM

Probably because they figured it would be useless, given how easily they'd been murdered.

My various fanfics.
FOFD Since: Apr, 2013
#9188: Jan 15th 2015 at 12:51:10 PM

Androids blew up most of the world, preventing any space ships from being built (also, IIRC, the Earthlings initially had to use Kami's old spaceship for space travel). IIRC we see Capsule Corps in ruins, so Bulma couldn't build anything there. She built the time machine underground and only managed to build one in the time that she had.

Dead Goku was only able to interfere in the Bojack film. I don't imagine him using IT to sucker-punch one of the Androids would've done much good anyway. And I've heard it rationalized that the reason Goku can't do something convenient post-mortem is due to the Androids not being a cosmic-level threat; they were content to just destroy the Earth.

Even with the Saiyans and Frieza, Yemma never sent Olibu or Pikkon down to deal with the threat, and Goku wasn't allowed to come back until the wish to revive him was made.

edited 15th Jan '15 12:53:22 PM by FOFD

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#9189: Jan 15th 2015 at 12:54:21 PM

Dead people have interfered a lot throughout the series via Kaio-sama's telepathy; I'm not talking about using IT to sucker-punch the androids, I'm talking about giving Bulma the information on where to find New Namek, thus eliminating the need to know where it is. And while they did have to take God's ship to get to Namek the first time, the ship that Goku took to reach Namek was reverse-engineered from a Saiyan pod.

Also, Frieza and King Cold still came to Earth in this timeline. Even ignoring the fact that Bulma should have plenty of data on how to build one from scratch, there is a perfectly good ship just waiting to be picked apart. Given what Bulma and her father were able to make out of the decrepit artifact that was God's ship and the remains of Goku's pod, a fully-functional ship capable of transporting an army should be Candyland.

Goku's had a decade and a half of doing what Goku does: hardcore intensive training in the Other World. Between him, a revived Gohan who actually put up a really good fight against the Androids despite having only one arm and there being two of them, and Trunks, I think they could make short work of the Androids.

edited 15th Jan '15 12:58:08 PM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Lionheart0 Since: Oct, 2009 Relationship Status: I'm just a hunk-a, hunk-a burnin' love
#9190: Jan 15th 2015 at 1:01:36 PM

I still want to know why nobody in Trunks's Bad Future ever thought of using the Dragon Balls to bring everyone back.

Because Plot Hole.

FOFD Since: Apr, 2013
#9191: Jan 15th 2015 at 1:02:34 PM

Shrug.

Dead people have interfered a lot throughout the series via Kaio-sama's telepathy, and while they did have to take God's ship to get to Namek the first time, the ship that Goku took to reach Namek was reverse-engineered from a Saiyan pod.

But that's telepathy; that doesn't help them reach Namek any faster, which took them awhile to reach the first time.

The ship that took Goku to Namek was reverse-engineered, but did they use the pod itself, or build a new one from scratch; I forget. Assuming they did and they did have the data, this is Hand Wave'd by the ruined Capsule Corp building we see in the Trunks special.

The Androids destroyed a good percentage of the Earth and the Z-Warriors didn't react fast enough to start Plan B. Any data and resources they might've had were probably destroyed, and if they weren't, the time it would've taken Bulma and a staff to put together a ship with the Androids destroying cities at random would probably have gotten them, and Baby Trunks, killed. Note, Roshi and Oolong hid a few miles away from their island inside of a submarine.

At least that's what I made of it. She didn't have time. So when you run out of time, you make a time machine.

Also, Frieza and King Cold still came to Earth in this timeline. Even ignoring the fact that Bulma should have plenty of data on how to build one from scratch, there is a perfectly good ship just waiting to be picked apart.

Assuming Goku didn't blow it up. If he didn't, the Androids might have. If they didn't, maybe Bulma couldn't reach it. If she could have, maybe she couldn't pilot it (as I remember, Goku couldn't make it work by pounding buttons). Assuming she figured it out, maybe she didn't want to take her infant son into deep space, hoping that they weren't smashed to pieces in an asteroid field trying to navigate back to Namek (even with King Kai's assistance, and he didn't help them the first time IIRC).

Lots of variables. But if all of those things fell into place, then maybe Bulma and infant Trunks could've made it to Namek, wished the gang back to life (or wished to go back in time to warn them). Then the Z-Fighters would have 3 years to train, or stalk Gero.

WillKeaton from Alberta, Canada Since: Jun, 2010
#9192: Jan 15th 2015 at 1:09:35 PM

Everyone who comes from a post apocalyptic future is cool regardless.

FOFD Since: Apr, 2013
#9193: Jan 15th 2015 at 1:10:45 PM

When they look and dress like Yamcha.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#9194: Jan 15th 2015 at 1:12:19 PM

Who said anything about infant Trunks? I'm talking about any point in the timeline.

Also: Bulma built a fully-functioning time machine entirely from scratch, which makes even less sense than a spaceship to reach New Namek, especially with Capsule Corp's history of building spaceships and Frieza's ship lying around; even if Goku blew it up, there would then be pieces of a spaceship lying around.

Getting to New Namek requires her to pull off something she's done before. Getting Trunks into the past requires her to invent time travel from scratch with absolutely no precedent to work from.

edited 15th Jan '15 1:13:11 PM by TobiasDrake

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FOFD Since: Apr, 2013
#9195: Jan 15th 2015 at 1:30:50 PM

Infant Trunks was born around the time that the Z-Fighters went off to fight the Androids.

It's not perfect, there's no precedent for time travel, sure.

But still, even if she did make it to Namek and brought everyone back, how much good would that really do? At any point in the timeline? The longer she waits, say until Trunks is 14-15, the more cities the Androids blow up, and the fewer chances there are to salvage and actually build a ship to get to Namek. It seems like, the closer to the Trunks special we get, the less ability she'd of had to switch gears and start on a spaceship.

Going to Namek hinges on these things:

  • Bulma being willing to go.
  • Having directions.
  • Having a ship, or time to build a ship.

Bulma has Trunks to worry about, and going to Namek isn't a safe venture. She's not going to leave him on Earth, so then she has to think about the risks of going into space: what if the Androids are around and they shoot us out of the sky, what if we don't even make it out of orbit, what if we run into hazards, how long will it take us to get there and do we have enough food, etc? That's reason number 1 not to go.

King Kai isn't likely to give her specific directions, and you can't say they would have kept the coordinates from the God-ship since that ship didn't make it back to Earth, or that the Briefs would keep those coordinates on file, or that those files even still exist. Frieza's ship isn't guaranteed to have those coordinates either. For all they know, it might be rigged to explode.

Frieza's ship might've been useful for spare parts, but how would Bulma transport those parts? If she did, would she be able to build the ship herself, since Dr. Brief was the one who reverse-engineered the Saiyan pod. If she could, how? Brief built a ship in relative peace. Bulma's living in post-apocalypse Earth, with terror in the streets, nuclear explosions every week, and an infant in her care. This is reason 3. Do they have the ability and time to make a spacecraft? Yes, she did build a time machine in her spare time, but the time machine was smaller, more covert, and even building it in secret, they still didn't have a lot of power for it.

And I'm forgetting the most obvious question: do these ships need fuel? I don't think that was ever touched upon. God's ship might not, but human-made ships? Dr. Brief would have time to find fuel. Bulma wouldn't.

edited 15th Jan '15 1:53:32 PM by FOFD

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#9196: Jan 15th 2015 at 4:02:43 PM

I'm glad Krillin's playing Alien Isolation again. It's kinda my favorite game of 2014.

edited 15th Jan '15 4:06:25 PM by unnoun

JonnasN from Porto, Portugal Since: Jul, 2012
#9197: Jan 15th 2015 at 5:03:12 PM

Forget about going to New Namek: Goku could just ask the Namekians telepathically to revive Piccolo/Kami. Heck, even if they couldn't revive Piccolo like that for some reason, Goku could've just said "Hey, Gohan, go to Kami's lookout and ask Mr.Popo about this mystical room... Have fun training Trunks!"

Of course, if dying from natural causes somehow prevents him from doing this, at least it's justified.

I'd say that a biggest plot hole in the Android saga was that the necessary tools to defeat them (ROSAT, the blueprints) ended up being surprisingly easy to obtain on Earth. Bulma herself could've told Trunks about Gero's lab, and Popo could've said something about the ROSAT (unless the Androids destroyed the palace or something). Toriyama kinda forgot just how resourceful his characters had gotten, when he created the bad future.

Despite these plotholes, the Trunks special is really good. I guess Future Gohan is popular for the same reason Bardock is popular: they're fighting odds they can't possibly beat, but they still face their opponents with dignity. It's something that doesn't happen often in Dragon Ball, where stories with happy endings are the norm.

edited 15th Jan '15 5:04:52 PM by JonnasN

Zeromaeus Since: May, 2010
#9198: Jan 15th 2015 at 5:09:37 PM

Didn't the androids attack three years after Frieza and Cold landed? I find it hard to believe they'd leave Cold's ship unmolested that long. Especially since they believed they were in a time of peace.

Briefs built Goku's pod in a ridiculously short amount of time. They likely had one sitting around by the time 17 and 18 started their rigamaroll. Of course, if I were Gero, I'd have set them so that their first targets would be Kame House and Capsule Corp...

Speaking of Gero, it kinda sucks that he just flat dies in every scenario. I liked him as a villain, short-lived as his run was.

[up] Bardock handled Chilled pretty well...
Heh

edited 15th Jan '15 5:11:41 PM by Zeromaeus

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#9199: Jan 15th 2015 at 5:22:16 PM

[up][up]The amount of things you're thinking the characters from the bad future can do is too much.

Goku is dead in the bad future, he was the 1st to die. So pretty much everything that you said should happen is basically shot down, nothing could be done about it.

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Gilphon (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#9200: Jan 15th 2015 at 5:37:00 PM

[up]If by 'everything he said should happen' you mean 'the one paragraph of things he wrote before acknowledging that Goku's death is a thing and then going on to suggest ways of doing it that don't rely on Goku's presence', that's correct.

I also have to agree that the idea of Bulma being unable to get New Namek but able to invent a time machine is absurd.


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