The extended cut of Battle of the gods says even Potara fusion wouldn't do much against Beerus.
edited 1st Sep '14 6:53:07 PM by Demongodofchaos2
Watch SymphogearWell, Piccolo may not be able to quite catch up, but he still remains a comfortable 4th strongest being position.
Remember, he went from 2nd form Freeza tier to almost comparable to a Super Saiyan in 3 years. He then became as strong as 17, and then he spent a day in the hyperbolic time thingie with noticeable results according to Goku.
This is a guy probably comparable to suppresed Cell by the Buu saga.
As far as protagonists go on their own strength, I would say Piccolo is probably the strongest. He's overshadowed only by the amazing multipliers that the Saiyans get to use, and even then, he kept up pretty hard - being stronger than Super Saiyan Vegeta means that Piccolo, at that point in time, was at least 50 Vegetas. That's larger than the gap between Krillin and Goku at the end of Namek.
After merging with God, Piccolo far outweighed the Saiyans on his own merits; they only kept up with him because of the Super Saiyan multipliers and, later, fusion. To my knowledge, it's unclear if they ever surpassed him in their base forms.
edited 1st Sep '14 7:48:46 PM by TobiasDrake
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.While fusing with Kami is debateable since they were kinda-sorta the same person, Nail is a different situation entirely. Also, it's sad that by the end of his mid-arc training, he's only able to best the previous arc's biggest threat.
The benefits of using headphones... buuuut... I note the voices aren't completely isolated. You can still hear a bit in both. Oh well. Also, I'd like to see Piccolo, Nail and Kami share/co-interrupt the "fan based parody, BUY THE F*KING SHOW" bit.
edited 1st Sep '14 9:19:16 PM by wanderlustwarrior
Firstly there's the 23rd Tenkaichi Budokai (the arc before the Saiyan arc) where Goku says Piccolo Daimao put "everything of himself" inside the egg and so Ma Junior is "hardly any different from the old Piccolo". At several points, Ma Junior is referred to as "Piccolo Daimao" including the character bios of the manga volumes, until he dies in the Saiyan arc. Then he's explicitly called a reincarnation, firstly saying he is Daimao's reincarnation at the Budokai (after his clothing is damaged by Goku's Kamehameha and his Clark Kenting disguise is ruined) and Gohan also mentions that Goku told him Piccolo had been reincarnated.
The guidebooks also mention this in his character bios, but it's mostly just regurgitating what the manga said.
Or his whole family?
If you want a human powerful enough to take on the saiyans, just call him a mutant.
That's not enough. The Ginyu Force are mutants with Battle powers of 40,000 - 120,000 which wouldn't do the humans much good. Hell, Kuririn/Ten/Yamcha/Chaozu themselves could already be mutants to get where they were - they far outstrip Roshi, Tao, Crane Hermit, etc. Cui, Zarbon and Dodoria could all very well be mutants with their battle powers being so high (and being the only ones of their races seen in Freeza's employ).
Freeza isn't a good example because he's an outlier even for the mutants.
Minor correction on Namek, but the only fighters seen in the manga apart from Nail all read at 3,000. 1,000 was just the level they were at when suppressing themselves. And they're still known as a race with extraordinarily high battle powers.
edited 2nd Sep '14 5:45:27 AM by Saiga
Was it 3,000? My mistake. I think I said "1,000 to 10,000" in the other thread too.
EDIT: There we go. I was pulling numbers from Kanzenshuu
because I have trouble keeping track of all the exact numbers, and 10,000 was for three Namekians who attacked Frieza in anime filler. That's where the confusion came from.
Excluding characters made up for the anime who contradict the canon by Nail's own statement that he's the only Warrior-Type Namekian, yes, it's 3,000 for Namekian fighters.
edited 2nd Sep '14 8:04:49 AM by TobiasDrake
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.Well, I once had this idea about Krillin, as a Buddhist monk, managing to Ascend to a Higher Plane of Existence through meditation and enlightenment that would vastly increase his strength, but it has two problems :
1) it brings a mystical/religious edge that would clash with the overall tone of Dragon Ball.
2) it's Krillin we're talking about. I'm not sure he can be held as a great buddhist model.
- God
- The Afterlife
- King Enma
- Hell
...what?
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.@Tobias Drake : I meant, too openly entrenched in an existing religion still practiced by millions of people around the world. Dragon Ball does have mysticism, but it's way more fantasy-ish than based on real concepts.
Although I did forget the whole "Journey to the West adaptation" bit. Uh.
Edit : And I edited this post about a dozen times now. Hope I didn't say anything too stupid, as usual.
edited 2nd Sep '14 2:19:00 PM by purplefishman
No, Dragon Ball's theology is very much rooted in real concepts.
King Enma is based on Yama, the Buddhist God of Death.
Kami and Piccolo are the Christian God and the Devil; Kami literally means God, is presented as God and never has a name besides God, and he opposes the Demon King who embodies all evil.
Even Shenron is a mythical figure, the storm dragon Shenlong from Chinese myth - which is why the sky turns black and stormy whenever he is summoned.
edited 2nd Sep '14 2:57:14 PM by TobiasDrake
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.Near as I can tell, apart from being a genie, Popo is an original figure -
edited 2nd Sep '14 3:00:57 PM by TobiasDrake
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.Mr. Popo is black, vaguely Middle Eastern, and for a time, was the second strongest being on Earth (next to God).
Obviously he's a very racist Jesus
Well, his name DOES call to mind the word "Pope," especially given Toriyama's propensity for naming characters after words.
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.Dragonball does do a lot of Doing In the Wizard in regards to its gods, now that I think about it. Kami's pretty much only a god because he arrived on Earth and decided to be one, and there's isn't a lot to most of the other deities we meet beyond being particularly strong. DBZA even lampshades this in regards to Yemma. The only god that ever gave me the impression that he was special in some way because he was a god (as apposed to being in charge of X because of the same standard of strength the other characters are subject to) is the Supreme Kai.
Granted, Shenron (and Porunga, by extension - or the other way around, if you prefer) are consistently portrayed as a different kind of entity with vastly different kinds of influence.
That Meditation powerup for Krillin isn't that bad an idea IMO. Tien's arm growing technique could be his powerup. I don't know what Yamcha's powerup could be. Yamcha has an awesome epithet; The Desert Bandit.

I still say Vegito is stronger than anything introduced in Battle of the Gods.