TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

Dragon Ball Z Abridged

Go To

WillKeaton from Alberta, Canada Since: Jun, 2010
#37976: Nov 5th 2020 at 6:01:09 PM

Is it weird that Trunks isn't smart like his mom, nor prideful like his dad?

Eriorguez Since: Jun, 2009
#37977: Nov 5th 2020 at 6:08:30 PM

What's weird is that he is just a brat at times, rather than an utterly selfcentered asshole like both his parents are.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#37978: Nov 5th 2020 at 6:09:10 PM

Trunks did not grow up inheriting the mantle of Best of the Best from a proud warrior race and competing to see who can genocide harder.

He also did not grow up in the lap of luxury, never wanting for anything in his life, free to pursue his own field of academic study to his heart's content.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
fredhot16 Don't want to leave but cannot pretend from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
#37979: Nov 5th 2020 at 6:11:59 PM

[up]Present or Future Trunks?

Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.
WillKeaton from Alberta, Canada Since: Jun, 2010
#37980: Nov 5th 2020 at 6:14:40 PM

Trunks absolutely did grow up in the lap of luxury. He- Oh, wait, are we talking about Future Trunks or Kid Trunks? Yeah, I guess Future Trunks grew up in a pretty rough world. Kid Trunks though, he was born rich. I mean, I guess they were both born rich, but Kid Trunks never had to suffer through an android apocalypse, which I'm assuming hurt Capsule Corp financially? I honestly couldn't tell you. I'm assuming the apocalypse was bad for them.

Edited by WillKeaton on Nov 5th 2020 at 7:18:39 AM

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#37981: Nov 5th 2020 at 6:55:42 PM

I assumed we were talking about Future Trunks on account of the fact that Kid Trunks is, like, eight. He's a child who spends most of his time being a child. He and Goten are the youngest characters we've ever met in the series, barring Gohan - and Gohan had to grow up fast yet still didn't really have a clear impression of who he wanted to be for himself until he was 11.

Goten and Trunks are just kids doing what they enjoy. It's a little early to be making definitive statements about who they are as people.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Nov 5th 2020 at 6:56:02 AM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#37982: Nov 5th 2020 at 8:02:35 PM

I naturally assumed we we're talking about Kid Trunks.

That being said, I do think the fact he inherited nothing from his parents personality wise (not even hair colour depending on which Trunks we're talking about in the anime) was always something I found odd.

Then again, Gohan, even as a kid, had little in common with his dad too, so I guess that's just a thing.

One Strip! One Strip!
Weirdguy149 Former King from Lumiose City Since: Jul, 2014 Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Former King
#37983: Nov 5th 2020 at 8:11:43 PM

I find it astounding that Gohan turned out to be a nice genius when both sides of his family are full of people that are dumb, assholes, or both.

The legend has returned.
fredhot16 Don't want to leave but cannot pretend from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
#37984: Nov 5th 2020 at 8:20:08 PM

[up][up]He inherited a good spirit from Goku.

Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#37985: Nov 5th 2020 at 8:26:51 PM

[up]

Fair enough.

[up][up]

As for Gohan's lack of dumbness, Chi-chi was self aware enough to make sure he got a hella good education, so we can thank that.

One Strip! One Strip!
HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#37986: Nov 5th 2020 at 9:31:56 PM

Well yeah they were raised by humans and taught a life beyond pillaging and conquering.

This is part of why Gine not being an Action Girl like that one squad member of Bardock from the original nevet bothered me.

Not to disregard people who preferred the latter, of course, but for me a culture so based around macho values like conquering and fighting to dominate others (contrasting Goky, who fights for fun amd for self-improvement) being also horribly misogynistic makes perfect sense.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#37987: Nov 5th 2020 at 9:45:13 PM

Doesn't matter how much logic you can apply to it in-universe. The criticisms of Gine were Doylist criticisms and Watson cannot solve Doyle's problems. Internal universe logic is a bunch of made-up stuff to justify creative decisions that a writer makes; when people have beef with those creative decisions, no amount of made-up fiction logic is going to unwrite them.

Critics of Gine's handling were not upset because they lack the imagination to conceive of the Saiyans being a misogynistic culture or, more generously, a culture of no specified opinion on gender roles in which bread-making Saiyans must naturally exist alongside the warrior Saiyans. They were upset because a creative choice was made to introduce a female Saiyan to the story's cast, and yet to not give the audience a female warrior Saiyan.

The first female Saiyan character ever introduced to canon was coincidentally also the first non-combatant Saiyan character ever introduced to canon. And that bothered people, especially people who were still salty about the fact that GT refused to let Pan become a Super Saiyan. Dragon Ball had fans who, for decades, wanted an awesome female Saiyan character and Gine wasn't really what they had in mind.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Nov 5th 2020 at 9:48:36 AM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#37988: Nov 5th 2020 at 9:55:22 PM

Broly later introduced Beets, who showed another non-combatant job for Saiyans. But yeah, I do wish they had introduced at least one more female U7 Planet Vegeta Saiyan who was a fighter, maybe have Vegeta's mom be a badass.

I do really like Gine as a character, specifically in regards to the depth and worldbuilding she introduces to typical Saiyan culture, such as the idea that Saiyans are typically polyamorous, but monogamy is also not unheard of, just unusual.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#37989: Nov 5th 2020 at 9:56:43 PM

By the time Super Broly came around, we also had Caulifla and Kale, which were more in line with what the "Give us female Saiyans" crowd were actually asking for. If Gine had been created after Caulifla and Kale, there probably wouldn't have been a controversy.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Nov 5th 2020 at 9:57:04 AM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#37990: Nov 5th 2020 at 10:05:41 PM

I do dislike how Goku's mom is now the typical anime mom which is a pretty trite cliché.

Especially since she has the added effect of making Bardock a nicer guy when an interesting part about the character is that he never really cared for his sons much.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#37991: Nov 5th 2020 at 10:13:29 PM

Is that the interesting part about his character? I thought the interesting part about his character was that he's a brutal bloodthirsty monster, no better than any other Saiyan, forced to act altruistically when the Genocide Machine comes for his own people, but doomed to a much deserved yet oddly still tragic fate.

His feelings towards Kakarot and Raditz were a relatively minor feature of the original depiction.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#37992: Nov 5th 2020 at 10:15:51 PM

I said an interesting part, not the most interesting part. Its a minor detail but it does add to the overall character.

Plus its amusing how he never gave his son any thought until he was about to die, saw a vision, and went "Whelp your my lost hope son. Kill this fuck."

Edited by slimcoder on Nov 5th 2020 at 10:16:48 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#37993: Nov 5th 2020 at 10:24:15 PM

The first female Saiyan character ever introduced to canon was coincidentally also the first non-combatant Saiyan character ever introduced to canon

Okay, now that's just untrue: the movie showed there are a lot of Saiyans in non-combat roles, in fact it seems every combatant has an assistant following him around, presumably to keep the ship in order.

Also, did you actually read the part there where I said "not to disregard the people who had a problem"?

Or did you just read one part of my post then assumed I was arguing that criticism is invalid, when all I said was that I, as in the individual known in this forum as Hail Muffins, didn't have a problem with it?

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#37994: Nov 5th 2020 at 11:02:28 PM

Gine was introduced before Broly, is the thing. She was introduced in Minus, and I believe the only other pure-blooded non-combatant Saiyan at the time was one of the other workers seen in the meat processing plant with her.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Nov 5th 2020 at 12:02:48 PM

HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#37995: Nov 5th 2020 at 11:06:53 PM

If Broly is meant to substitute Minus then that argument goes out the window, though, because that Gine is no longer the canon.

Otherwise, no one should have any issues with Gine because there were already warrior Saiyanettes before in a now non-canon work.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#37996: Nov 5th 2020 at 11:18:02 PM

I kind of like that Kid Trunks, at least in Super, grows to be this dorky sort of kid who's decreasingly bratty but kind, and clever but not super bright, mostly because its a breath of fresh air after years of fandom stuff and fanfics and so on portraying him as a holier-than-thou jackass.

That said, who knows what his personality will be next time the series decides to put him and/or Goten in a more visible role. Super has kind of defined personalities for them (for as little they were actually used in the story), but we have yet to see Toyotaro do too much with them (minus the Cell Jr thing) so its anyone's guess what his side of the franchise prefers for them.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Nov 5th 2020 at 11:22:10 AM

Weirdguy149 Former King from Lumiose City Since: Jul, 2014 Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Former King
#37997: Nov 6th 2020 at 4:48:33 AM

Say what you will about GT, but GT Goten is very distinct from the other characters as a confident lady's man.

The legend has returned.
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#37998: Nov 6th 2020 at 5:59:37 AM

If Broly is meant to substitute Minus then that argument goes out the window, though, because that Gine is no longer the canon.

Otherwise, no one should have any issues with Gine because there were already warrior Saiyanettes before in a now non-canon work.

That's not how time works. The controversy around Gine chiefly existed when Minus was released as the canon version of Goku's origin. Super Broly coming out years later to replace Minus does not reverse the course of time and unwrite Minus and its criticisms from existing.

GT refusing to make Pan a Super Saiyan is similarly not really relevant to the state of modern Dragon Ball. But it still happened and people felt how they felt all the same.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Nov 6th 2020 at 6:02:07 AM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#37999: Nov 6th 2020 at 7:42:29 AM

[up][up] I dunno, I really hated GT Goten. I felt like he had only one character trait which was largely something that kept him away from the story, and his design kind of stunk besides.

I actually really like what little blips of character Super gives Goten, repositioning him as a precocious Only Sane Man in comparison to the other characters and increasingly mature - it's just that he's barely ever in the series so we only got to see it when they wanted a gag out of Goku being a moron or Gohan being overdramatic.

I still think Toei kind of blundered into what would've been a great character dynamic for Goten and Trunks - Trunks as a leader-type who's goofy and foolish, Goten as a follower type who's wiser than he looks - but there's no payoff since the characters never get to do anything.

randomness4 Ghost '11 from The Land of Inconvenience Since: Sep, 2011
Ghost '11
#38000: Nov 6th 2020 at 7:48:19 AM

He would've been kept out of the 1st arc anyway, his personality had nothing to do with that.

And it had even less to do with that for the other 2 arcs GT had.

Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.

Total posts: 40,340
Top