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unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#33776: Dec 10th 2018 at 6:31:11 PM

All the gods of destruction cna destroy planets.

Obviously.

The problem is that Beerus naps for 50 years and then goes on a binge, and destroys planets for the dumbest shit.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#33777: Dec 11th 2018 at 12:31:15 AM

Reading the bios for the various gods of the four best universes is a good way to understand what Mortal Level is and how it's judged.

  • U8, paired with U5, the worst of the top four best universes: Iru loves making plans and gets fired up when they come together. Liquiir works with Iru to eliminate flaws in his plans and he strictly destroys anything that would make his universe worse. Liquiir is also friendly and interested in the power of love. Korn is very assertive and has a high opinion of himself.

U8 seems to have gotten where they are by virtue of strict planning ahead and eliminating anything that would threaten their quality and standing.

  • U5, paired with U8: Ogma is gentle and values a balance of knowledge and power. She is proud of her work and pleased to hear that she did a good job on her universe. Arack is disciplined and merciful, investigating thoroughly what he should destroy. He tries to improve his universe while destroying the minimal amount. This is in direct contrast to Liquiir, showing that while both approaches are effective, Arack's is slightly better. Cukatail watches over Ogma and Arack and tries to learn from their knowledge, which is a unique trait for an Angel.

U5 seems to have gotten where they are by having no bias for or against any particular trait, and helping their universe prosper through kindness and mercy. Ogma and Arack also seem to be exceptionally talented/experienced at their jobs, if their Angel Cukatail thinks it would be better to learn from them, as opposed to the other way around.

  • U12, paired with U1: Ag says virtuous things and aspires to make his great universe even better. Geene performs his job mercilessly and without discrimination, but he’s become bored recently because there's nothing in his universe that needs destruction. Martinu doesn't have much to do since her gods are so good, but she tries to think of ways to improve them.

U12 appears to be a boring utopia. The gods want to do their jobs, but their universe is so perfect that they don't have much to do. There's not much focus on the gods' methods, though, so it's hard to tell how their universe got to the place it is now. This is also the universe that the first time machine came from.

  • U1, the best and most mysterious universe, paired with U12: Anat has a gentle smile, and was one of the only ones to realize that Goku gave the lower universes a chance with the Tournament. That said, he was also the only god to not care about the outcome of the Tournament, and was unfazed at the universal erasure, even saying that it was necessary for balance between the universes. Iwne is very efficient and successful, and he has strong passion, enthusiasm, or explosive feelings in contrast to his calm exterior. His true appearance resembles that of Shiva, the Hindu god of destruction. Apparently, Awamo can sense everything.

U1 scares the hell out of me. The gods give off a holier-than-thou enlightened feel, but they also seem to lack compassion for the lower universes. I totally expect a story arc revealing that U1 is a False Utopia and Iwne is the arc villain, with the Shiva thing being a transformation he has.

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#33778: Dec 11th 2018 at 12:43:16 AM

Eh. That sounds like the Angels are villains/Zen-Oh are villains/El Grande Padre arcs that everyone was expecting during the TOP.

It doesn't look like that kind of story is going to happen.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#33779: Dec 11th 2018 at 12:43:43 AM

I swear the next show better actually start exploring the various universes.

Cause as they are right now they are wasted potential.

The fact that Vegeta is finally visiting Sadala & we are dealing with a crisis in U6 in Heroes is awful because that shouldn’t be in Heroes.

That is stuff that should be happenening in the mainline series, not the crazy fan-service spin-off.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#33780: Dec 11th 2018 at 7:34:53 AM

Eh, only if something interesting happens there.

By the same token, you could say it's a waste of potential that they never went to South Galaxy to go fight all the dudes there.

Or that they never explored the Earth's south pole.

They haven't been to Mars yet either.

End of the day, there's a lot of places unexplored because this show is not a series of nature documentaries dedicated to exploring the infinite possibilities that exist within the universe. The Universes served their narrative function by providing dozens of wacky characters to fight U7's in the Tournament of Power.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Dec 11th 2018 at 8:35:56 AM

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unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#33781: Dec 11th 2018 at 9:02:07 AM

Eh. That sounds like the Angels are villains/Zen-Oh are villains/El Grande Padre arcs that everyone was expecting during the TOP.

It doesn't look like that kind of story is going to happen.

That's maybe true, but I personally still sorta wanna know what the Shiva true appearance thing is all about.

Until I remember that there's so much other shit that gets brought up and nothing ever gets done with.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#33782: Dec 11th 2018 at 9:29:00 AM

The Dragonball universe is both very big due to not only moving out into space, but into a multiverse...but also very small, due to the knowledge that (in the case of Universe 7) one guy runs the entire show without any real challengers, and many worlds were wiped out offscreen. Along with how most races are unimportant beyond the single representative introduced during certain arcs.

You can make arguments for how we should learn more about them, and how they are irrelevant. I myself believe the former, while recognizing the latter.

That being said, if Freeza was always going to be the only relevant member of his race...then why did we even need Frost? Especially since he's now Freeza-lite in both versions.

One Strip! One Strip!
VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#33783: Dec 11th 2018 at 9:29:55 AM

I prefer that Toriyama never be the one to explore the worldbuiling of each multiverse. That just isn't how he is as a writer.

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#33784: Dec 11th 2018 at 9:31:29 AM

To show off what being twin-universes means.

Freeza with Good publicity. An emperor of the universe with Saiyans at his beck and call, only instead of ruling through fear he rules through a facade of love.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#33785: Dec 11th 2018 at 9:46:26 AM

[up]

I would have honestly preferred it if he really was a legitimately good guy...but I think Toriyama has issues with those kind of characters (he might just find them uninteresting; it would explain his problems with Toei trying to make Goku more of a hero, and his tendency to make characters with traditionally heroic traits antagonists such as the Tokusatsu based Ginyus, or the Pride Troopers, who are flat out super heroes themselves).

One Strip! One Strip!
WillKeaton from Alberta, Canada Since: Jun, 2010
#33786: Dec 11th 2018 at 9:46:53 AM

About the twin universe thing. There are 12 universes, and they come in pairs, with any two universes whose total number adds to 13 being twin universes. Except, didn't they state at one point that there used to be more universes until Grand Zeno destroyed them? How do they fit into the system? Because that system only works if you have exactly 12 universes and completely falls apart if there are more than that.

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#33787: Dec 11th 2018 at 9:53:29 AM

I mean, my guess is that the numbers changed at some point.

Universe 12 used to be Universe 18. I sorta assume Universe 1 was always Universe 1.

The totals added up to 19.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#33788: Dec 11th 2018 at 9:54:28 AM

That's a very good question.

Perhaps the paired universe concept didn't exist until after those other five were destroyed.

One Strip! One Strip!
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#33790: Dec 11th 2018 at 11:12:30 AM

...Right. They add up to 13, but there are only 12. My bad.

My original idea still stands.

One Strip! One Strip!
Moth13 Since: Sep, 2010
#33791: Dec 13th 2018 at 8:41:00 AM

So what fights do you think are going to make TFS's Top 12 Best Dragonball Fights? I feel like Goku vs Vegeta round 1, Piccolo vs Android 17, Goku vs Majin Vegeta, and Vegito vs Buuhan are shoe-ins.

Rytex Your Friend on the Other Side from Here, There, Everywhere (Ancient one) Relationship Status: Married to the music
Your Friend on the Other Side
#33792: Dec 13th 2018 at 9:14:22 AM

Based on their criteria, Goku-Frieza is probably gonna make it. Maybe Gohan-Cell too.

The powerful play goes on, and you may contribute a verse.
Fedetropes Call me Blast, not Fedetropes from Doomed universe Since: Dec, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Call me Blast, not Fedetropes
#33793: Dec 13th 2018 at 9:33:52 AM

Wait, we can talk about DBCEMBER here? I thought we had to do it in the TFS thread

I'm not complaining, just surprised

Anyways, I guess Goku VS Freeza is gonna be the top one, given their general feelings about the namek saga in their previous countdowns

Edited by Fedetropes on Dec 13th 2018 at 2:35:42 PM

¡PONLE QUE DIGA!:"¡HUMONGOSAURIO HASTA LA MUERTE!"
fasoman1996 Google "big ears" from Argentina (A.K.A. Naziland) Since: Dec, 2014 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
Google "big ears"
#33794: Dec 13th 2018 at 9:36:08 AM

It's called D Bcember.

It can be discussed here last time i checked

Uni cat
Moth13 Since: Sep, 2010
#33795: Dec 13th 2018 at 9:40:01 AM

They listed pacing as a criteria, which I feel would dock Goku vs Frieza a few points, since the battle's pacing in the anime is baaaad, even in Kai.

Fedetropes Call me Blast, not Fedetropes from Doomed universe Since: Dec, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Call me Blast, not Fedetropes
#33796: Dec 13th 2018 at 9:58:09 AM

[up][up]the last DBCEMBER was posted only in the TFS thread, so forgive me for my scepticism

At least it generate more talk this time

¡PONLE QUE DIGA!:"¡HUMONGOSAURIO HASTA LA MUERTE!"
Kamiccolo Since: May, 2018
#33797: Dec 13th 2018 at 10:28:55 AM

So what fights do you think are going to make TFS's Top 12 Best Dragonball Fights?
They're fairly plebeian in their tastes and base everything off the anime so I have no doubt Goku vs Majin Vegeta, Vegetto vs Gohan-Buu, and Goku vs Pure Buu will be there.

Edited by Kamiccolo on Dec 13th 2018 at 10:30:39 AM

Kayeka (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#33798: Dec 13th 2018 at 10:49:08 AM

I'm calling Goku vs. Vegeta for #1.

Fedetropes Call me Blast, not Fedetropes from Doomed universe Since: Dec, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Call me Blast, not Fedetropes
#33799: Dec 13th 2018 at 10:57:55 AM

[up][up]no shame there, those are pretty good fights, in the anime at least

Edited by Fedetropes on Dec 13th 2018 at 3:59:14 PM

¡PONLE QUE DIGA!:"¡HUMONGOSAURIO HASTA LA MUERTE!"

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