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Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#33751: Dec 10th 2018 at 4:22:59 PM

It's quality of character.

In the anime, Beerus accuses Goku of bring their level down. Goku retorts that Gohan would be raising it up.

In the manga, 17's selfless wish improves the mortal level of his universe.

LSBK Since: Sep, 2014
#33752: Dec 10th 2018 at 4:26:19 PM

Beerus saying that seems weird sense it seems like this was the first time he even heard of the universes being ranked by "mortal level".

Edited by LSBK on Dec 10th 2018 at 6:26:36 AM

ultimatepheer Since: Mar, 2011
#33753: Dec 10th 2018 at 4:37:44 PM

Which is hilariously ironic, since I suspect that the mortal level would be way higher had Beerus been awake to save more than just one barely trained Junior Supreme Kai from Buu.

sgamer82 Since: Jan, 2001
#33754: Dec 10th 2018 at 4:39:40 PM

I think I remember taking "mortal level" to mean the quantity and quality of mortal life in a given universe. Between Buu wiping out the Kais, Beerus being lazy, and folks like Freeza wrecking everyone else's stuff wherever they went, Universe 7 being low wouldn't be shocking there.

Edited by sgamer82 on Dec 10th 2018 at 5:43:10 AM

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#33755: Dec 10th 2018 at 4:39:49 PM

Then again Beerus is lazy, incompetent, & something of a hypocrite so of course he doesn’t realize he’s to blame for the declining mortal level.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#33756: Dec 10th 2018 at 4:50:54 PM

[up]

Exactly. Hell, because o him sleeping through Buu's rampage, he nearly got himself killed (if Shin hadn't survived, he'd probably be dead)...unless the Old Kai would still count even while in the Z Sword.

One Strip! One Strip!
WillKeaton from Alberta, Canada Since: Jun, 2010
#33757: Dec 10th 2018 at 4:50:58 PM

People keep saying Freeza killing people lowered the average. That's no how average's work. If you were taking the average power level of mortals in the universe, then had Freeza kill a bunch of weaklings, the average power level of that universe would go UP, not down.

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#33759: Dec 10th 2018 at 4:53:00 PM

[up][up]

Not if he killed races that had the potential to be far more powerful. Also, if Buu killed the stronger guys who were around during his time, and then Freeza crushed the weaker races and those with some potential under his thumb to ensure his power base was never upset (like how he wiped out the entire Saiyan Race to ensure they could never be a collective threat to him), then it would screw things up with only weakling who can't challenge him being left, and more races being wiped out for his planet trade deal.

Edit: Also, [up]this.

Edited by HandsomeRob on Dec 10th 2018 at 5:53:27 AM

One Strip! One Strip!
WillKeaton from Alberta, Canada Since: Jun, 2010
#33760: Dec 10th 2018 at 4:55:16 PM

No, it probably isn't, but we're still talking about the average something. Getting a planet destroyed doesn't necessarily make the average Mortal Level go down. It would only do that if said planet had a high Mortal Level. If it had a low Mortal level, wiping out that planet makes the average go up.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#33761: Dec 10th 2018 at 4:55:53 PM

As shown by the top 4 universes, the Destroyers are outright responsible for managing and raising the mortal levels.

So fact of the matter is, its all Beerus' fault, no ifs, ands, or buts about it.

Shin is basically his assistant and how the Hell can an assistant do good work if their boss is a lazy piece of crap?

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Ikedatakeshi Baby dango from singapore Since: Nov, 2015 Relationship Status: Singularity
Baby dango
#33762: Dec 10th 2018 at 5:07:30 PM

The Galactic patrol had no issue with Jaco annihilating Earth if they find Earth isn't worth protecting, Jaco saying he would use the extinction bomb if he was annoyed and that Jaco was specifically sent because he was expendable. So evidently Universe 7 has no shortage of shitty people.

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#33763: Dec 10th 2018 at 5:10:48 PM

Freeza is evil enough that he probably brings down the mortal level slightly by himself. While dead and in hell, because he's so evil and so stubborn that they can't reincarnate him.

Kid Buu was either less evil than Freeza, or less conscious/sapient, because he reincarnated in, like, a week, or instantaneously.

Saiga Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
#33764: Dec 10th 2018 at 5:17:13 PM

According to Toriyama the more evil you are the faster you reincarnate

@Will Keaton and if Freeza is wiping out innocent people and expanding his empire of evil raiders, he'd be lowering the mortal level

Edited by Saiga on Dec 10th 2018 at 11:18:06 PM

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#33765: Dec 10th 2018 at 5:20:21 PM

Freeza's got a lot of will to consciously resist being reincarnated then.

One Strip! One Strip!
unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#33766: Dec 10th 2018 at 5:28:22 PM

[up][up] But don't they say in Super that Freeza is consciously refusing reincarnation?

I could have sworn they said that.

WillKeaton from Alberta, Canada Since: Jun, 2010
#33767: Dec 10th 2018 at 5:28:37 PM

[up][up][up] That's assuming high mortal level = goodness, which we do not know.

Edited by WillKeaton on Dec 10th 2018 at 6:28:47 AM

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#33769: Dec 10th 2018 at 5:32:30 PM

Goku put in a special request for Majin Buu. IIRC, wasn't that why his reincarnation got pushed through so quickly? Or was that only responsible for his battle power being retained, something that doesn't happen with most reincarnations?

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#33770: Dec 10th 2018 at 5:33:32 PM

Iwne has the best universe because he destroys everybody evil.

Sidra has the worst universe because he never destroys anybody, and his Supreme Kai constantly makes evil dudes.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#33771: Dec 10th 2018 at 5:35:07 PM

I don’t think it was stated that he destroys evil, just that he’s very devoted to his job.

Belmoud is the one who makes a point of destroying evil but he’s only in 5th place.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#33772: Dec 10th 2018 at 5:36:00 PM

First, doing his job is destruction, second, Vermoud is still the best of the bottom 8.

Moth13 Since: Sep, 2010
#33773: Dec 10th 2018 at 5:37:00 PM

Beerus: This is all your fault! You're the one who foolishly believed that if a mortal world didn't reach a higher level all on their own it wouldn't mean anything so you refused to lift a single finger to help them!

Shin: What about you?! What have you done besides spend most of your time sleeping?!

Edited by Moth13 on Dec 10th 2018 at 8:37:15 AM

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#33774: Dec 10th 2018 at 5:38:52 PM

Beerus and Shin seem to already be aware of what Mortal Level is, they just dont know how to. Get it higher.

It also seems to be evaluated and calculated by arcane, obscure methods by the Grand Priest, so you probably can't check what it is?

EDIT: Also, factoring in the Gods of Destruction Exhibition in the manga.

Iwne doesnt seem that strong, compared to the rest, while Beerus can briefly do Ultra Instinct enough to outlast a lot of the other gods.

It's unclear whether he's actually stronger than Quitela or Vermoud. Vermoud is definitely a better tactical thinker though.

But maybe Beerus spends too much time practicing Ultra Instinct and fighting and training, and that's another reason his universe sucks?

...I think it'd be funny if Beerus training too much instead of working is a flaw he has.

Like, Goku does like to relax and take naps and relax sometimes. Beerus sharing some more of Goku's flaws would be hilarious to me.

...Of course, then I start picturing either Shin or Whis in a Chichi wig, and it stops being funny.

(Before anyone brings up that Gods of destruction and angels cant fall in love, ask yourself if that makes the Goku/Chichi comparison more valid or less?)

Edited by unnoun on Dec 10th 2018 at 9:21:00 AM

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#33775: Dec 10th 2018 at 6:27:41 PM

If we go with the same belief Gowasu has that more civilized societies result in more moral and civilized people overall (though the example he chose turned out to not be a good one) - which would thus result in a higher mortal level - then yeah, Freeza (and Beerus come to think of it) being able to wipe out planets' worth of people for so long probably did do a lot towards making Universe 7's so low.

Universe 11 having an efficient means of cultivating moral societies and destroy evil ones (one that doesn't require its gods to lift a finger beyond a mentor capcity, and is largely kept up by the mortals themselves) is why there's is so high.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Dec 10th 2018 at 6:28:42 AM


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