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TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#33526: Nov 8th 2018 at 5:52:03 AM

There's a point in the Super anime where Arale is shown to be more powerful than Super Saiyan Blue Goku. After she soundly hands Vegeta his ass, she fights Blue Goku and is able to match his Kamehameha - then announces that she's going to fire another beam at 100x power, freaking Goku out.

Vegeta attributes Arale's power as being because she's a gag manga character, and thus able to fragrantly ignore the physics of their universe. Her power level is "F*ck you, that's why".

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
fasoman1996 Google "big ears" from Argentina (A.K.A. Naziland) Since: Dec, 2014 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
Larkmarn Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Hello, I love you
#33528: Nov 8th 2018 at 5:58:23 AM

Waitasecond. So the Goku vs. Saitama argument has been resolved in official Dragon Ball media?

... huh. Weird.

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ultimatepheer Since: Mar, 2011
#33529: Nov 8th 2018 at 6:06:11 AM

Not even Beerus could kill her, Arale 2stronk

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#33530: Nov 8th 2018 at 6:22:26 AM

Actually, Beerus almost did (maybe he's too much of a Knight of Cerebus for Arale's gag nature, kinda like how Buu promptly turned Chi-chi into an egg and squashed her the moment she tried to strong arm him like she does everyone else).

That being said, he immediately got a stomach ache from eating the world's greatest food out of a toilet before he could finish her, so jokes for the win!

Edited by HandsomeRob on Nov 8th 2018 at 7:23:27 AM

One Strip! One Strip!
Kamiccolo Since: May, 2018
#33531: Nov 8th 2018 at 8:58:52 PM

It's not entirely clear that anyone in the series can punch a planet into breaking, rather than using ki blasts though.

...Like, sure, you can vaporize Arale maybe, but that doesnt mean she can't hit much harder than you.

Their punches and blasts use the exact same energy source, transferred at the exact same rate (hence "battle powers" of big blasts being similar to or only a bit larger than those same peoples' bodies just standing there). The only differences are contact area and duration. But like... if Vegeta can charge a blast for ten seconds and have it be powerful enough to destroy a planet by the end of it, logically he should also be able to release that same amount of energy in a bunch of punches in ten seconds.

The Buu arc makes this explicit. Gohan has enough energy reserves in his body to blast back Cell's solar system destroying Kamehameha. Babidi takes it all (to the point that Gohan collapses in exhaustion and out of SS) and uses it to fill Buu's energy meter 40% of the way. The remaining 60% is filled by Vegeta punching Goku. In the time it takes for Babidi/Dabra and Gohan/Kaioshin to exchange a few words, Vegeta has delivered enough energy in his punches to fill the whole thing.

Vegeta attributes Arale's power as being because she's a gag manga character, and thus able to fragrantly ignore the physics of their universe. Her power level is "F*ck you, that's why".
That's just Toei being stupid. She got thrashed all the time in Dr. Slump.

Edited by Kamiccolo on Nov 8th 2018 at 9:02:09 AM

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#33532: Nov 8th 2018 at 9:04:43 PM

If by "similar" you mean "significantly higher", then sure.

During the fight with Raditz, Piccolo had a battle power of 408. The Makankosappo, however, had a battle power of 1,480. That's a 363% increase in power.

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PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#33533: Nov 8th 2018 at 9:25:27 PM

I can only think of one instance of Arale getting outright crushed in Dr. Slump, and that was against that one genie guy. It totally makes sense that Arale can beat Goku and Vegeta using gag logic, since gag logic is stronger within more realistic series than it is within gag series.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Nov 8th 2018 at 10:25:50 AM

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#33534: Nov 8th 2018 at 9:42:22 PM

To quote from the most canonical source I can think of, Jump Super Stars, there is an Elemental Rock–Paper–Scissors in manga and anime. Power beats Knowledge, Knowledge beats Laughter, and Laughter beats Power. Headstrong shounen hot-bloodedness beats tactical mind-games, logic and reasoning beats gags and goofs, and toonforce beats muscleheads.

Arale was able to beat Goku and Vegeta up because she was super effective against them.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Nov 8th 2018 at 10:45:54 AM

Kamiccolo Since: May, 2018
#33535: Nov 8th 2018 at 10:44:07 PM

During the fight with Raditz, Piccolo had a battle power of 408. The Makankosappo, however, had a battle power of 1,480. That's a 363% increase in power.
Yeah, that's similar. You don't seem to comprehend the scale we're speaking on here.
I can only think of one instance of Arale getting outright crushed in Dr. Slump, and that was against that one genie guy.
Caramel Man 7 destroyed her body.
It totally makes sense that Arale can beat Goku and Vegeta using gag logic, since gag logic is stronger within more realistic series than it is within gag series.
It "makes sense" because it happened in Toeiland, where Buu arc base Goku can beat up Ultimate Gohan and Yamcha can outperform Super Saiyan Goku against the Cell Juniors.

Edited by Kamiccolo on Nov 8th 2018 at 10:48:09 AM

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#33536: Nov 9th 2018 at 6:16:33 AM

I mean, those weren't gags or jokes though. That was Toei being completely unironically serious.

Sure, the end results might be the same in terms of power consistency, but they come from very different sources and logics.

EDIT: And, to be completely fair, I can almost make sense of the Cell Junior thing? Goku was exhausted and at his limit when he gave up against Cell, and he didn't have a Senzu bean himself because the one Krillin gave him he gave to Cell.

He'd only get another bean for himself later, after SS2 Gohan.

Still stupid, and still Toei being Toei, but there's an actual narrative logic reason there.

Now, why Yamcha specifically is doing so well is a different story.

I guess, since Goku was literally on the ground, it might have been to emphasize just how tired and out of gas he was? If literally everyone had more energy left than he did? Even Krillin Yamcha?

...Although, I'm actually curious now, how did Yamcha not die in the manga version? I'm pretty sure the panel of Goku face down in the dirt and unable to keep one eye open is in there. And I could have sworn that Piccolo was still on his feet. All the stuff I just said is still basically, mostly true. At least at the Piccolo, Vegeta and Trunks tier.

EDIT: Now, you might wonder how you're supposed to tell that Toei is trying to be funny after so much of their history and it being the same result, my answer is: because they said they were. Start of the episode.

And, speaking of idiots trying go be funny, Team Four Star!

Edited by unnoun on Nov 9th 2018 at 9:53:04 AM

Fedetropes Call me Blast, not Fedetropes from Doomed universe Since: Dec, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Call me Blast, not Fedetropes
#33537: Nov 9th 2018 at 7:10:23 AM

Man, they are really hyped for this, for Broly

Funny how stuff turns out

¡PONLE QUE DIGA!:"¡HUMONGOSAURIO HASTA LA MUERTE!"
fasoman1996 Google "big ears" from Argentina (A.K.A. Naziland) Since: Dec, 2014 Relationship Status: Baby don't hurt me!
Google "big ears"
#33538: Nov 9th 2018 at 7:13:12 AM

TFS has stated numerous times that they love Broly's concept but the first movie executed it horribly to the point that Broly was barely a character. That and the sheer Wolverine Publicity of Broly soured them on the character.

Super Broly looks to be a far more interesting character and the movie looks to have themes about fatherhood and growing up.

Uni cat
Moth13 Since: Sep, 2010
#33539: Nov 9th 2018 at 7:35:57 AM

I'm pretty sure the Cell Jrs are just playing around for most of their fight, not actively trying to kill the heroes.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#33540: Nov 9th 2018 at 7:36:55 AM

Worth noting: Vegeta does manage to land a solid hit on Arale.

Upon recognizing that her power isn't actually a factor in her ability to win because she's a gag manga character, Vegeta deduces that if he's going to beat her, he needs to fight her in a gag style. So he pulls the "HEY WHAT'S THAT OVER THERE" trick to distract her and then kicks her f*cking head clean off her shoulders.

This naturally leads to a wacky segment of Arale's body waddling around trying to follow instructions shouted at it from her head to reconnect. She reattaches it no worse for wear. But it's a valiant effort all the same.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Nov 9th 2018 at 8:37:38 AM

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unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#33541: Nov 9th 2018 at 7:42:43 AM

Right. Even in the episode, the gag manga logic reigning supreme was explicit. Part of the text.

When Vegeta tried to be a gag manga character, his massive power level mattered again, and brought him back to where he belonged

Briefly, until he got distracted and forgot to keep it up.

Either way, when something like that is an explicit part of the episode's plot and mechanics, you can't just blame it on "Toei being Toei" and them not knowing how strong anyone is or being inconsistent.

...Now, you can say that Toei's past inconsistency hurts the joke and makes it not as funny. 'Ooh, Toei made Buu Saga base Goku stronger than Ultimate Gohan, that's already ridiculous, even if they played it seriously, so this isn't much different,' you say, and you're not entirely wrong.

Like, if you're me, and eat feminist theory for breakfast and can spit out a feminist critique like breathing, you can tell/make up that the 'joke' is that 'hee ha, Arale's a girl, girls are weaklings amirite bois?' because Toei is misogynists. Yamcha and the Cell Juniors and Goku and Ultimate Gohan are all presented as boys, so the power inconsistencies are Serious Business and not jokes. Toei actually honestly believes those things.

They forgot about Ultimate Gohan in the trailers for Battle of Gods and after fixing it in the movie they kept forgetting it before the Tournament of Power, and I bet anything they'll forget it again as soon as they get a chance. So really, the Ultimate Gohan thing is just par for the course.

Anyway, they explicitly know and state several times that Vegeta and Goku are, actually, much stronger than Arale, what they were saying is that, because Arale is a joke, that doesn't matter unless you become a joke yourself.

Yeah, sure, Arale's gotten beaten or injured in Doctor Slump, but when she did, it was because the other character was funnier than she was. Or equally as funny but stronger. With stronger in a gag manga basically meaning funniness anyway.

"What does the scouter say about his humor level?"

EDIT:

Actually, Beerus almost did (maybe he's too much of a Knight of Cerebus for Arale's gag nature

I mean, in the movie of Battle of Gods, Beerus is hilarious. He constantly does old cartoon gags and sound effects.

And it's honestly funny that the strongest being in the universe is a giant hairless pussy.

Beerus is funnier than Arale.

Edited by unnoun on Nov 9th 2018 at 11:22:22 AM

WillKeaton from Alberta, Canada Since: Jun, 2010
#33542: Nov 9th 2018 at 9:52:44 AM

There an English dub of that Broly trailer out yet? Is there even any dialogue to dub over?

unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#33543: Nov 9th 2018 at 9:57:56 AM

Goku has two lines and Broly's little green waifu has one about how he's actually super nice, really.

Goku's second line is also about how Broly's really not that bad a guy.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#33544: Nov 9th 2018 at 10:47:47 AM

Even in Super, by the time of the Arale episode Beerus had almost entirely finished his transformation into a humor character who only has occasional moments where he reminds us that he's a big deal.

And in that episode, he goes up against humor and still loses. We never see what could happen if he tried to destroy Arale, because he never gets the chance. Instead, he's struck with screaming explosive diarrhea the moment he tries.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Nov 9th 2018 at 10:48:31 AM

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#33545: Nov 9th 2018 at 4:04:01 PM

I've seen that trailer subbed so many times that I can pretty much quote the dialogue word-for-word from memory:

Goku: "I think it's about time you fought me."

Goku: "Vegeta!!"

Freeza: "You dare push me to these lengths, do you!"

Goku: "You ain't a bad guy. I can tell."

Chelye: "He isn't fighting because he wants to fight!"

Goku: "You've still got even more?"

Vegeta: "This is no time to be playing around."

Vegeta: "Damn it all!"

Goku: "Let's go, Vegeta!"

Broly: "AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

I don't know if there's a dub, but there's the sub for you.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Nov 9th 2018 at 5:05:14 AM

Guy01 Since: Mar, 2015
#33546: Nov 9th 2018 at 8:07:59 PM

A Thank You Video To The Fans From Lanipator: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFekteJnZ7U

Now that's a man. cool

Ok, who let Light Yagami in here?
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
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#33547: Nov 9th 2018 at 9:46:36 PM

When I first saw that video pop up on YouTube, I panicked a little. I thought Lani was announcing his departure from Team Four Star.

This video is not that. It's actually really sweet.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#33548: Nov 9th 2018 at 10:28:46 PM

Man, it would be really hard for TFS to get by without Lani's vocal talent, considering he's basically the Christopher Sabat of TFS.

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#33549: Nov 10th 2018 at 3:53:51 AM

Taka going is one thing, but If he or Kaiser Neko left it would cripple TFS.

thok That's Dr. Title, thank you! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Non-Canon
That's Dr. Title, thank you!
#33550: Nov 10th 2018 at 5:31:02 AM

For what it's worth, the gag manga reason that Vegeta loses to Arale is that he's obviously the Comically Serious, and it would be funnier if he loses. (This isn't the first Comically Serious gag Super did with Vegeta; he literally spent an entire episode sucking on a pacifier.)


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