Well, they also played Goku's death 100% seriously even though the last time he "died" it was immediately pointed out they could just bring him back again. It was pointed out this time too, but considering they'd just spent about 5 minutes making it into a big deal it felt kind of awkward. Also kind of was in disbelief they genuinely tried to make "but mom, he mentioned you when he said he'd rather stay dead" into a touching moment. The bar is so low. I'd say poor Chi-Chi, but she isn't a real character.
I liked everything about Vegeta and Trunks though. Sometimes the serious stuff does work for me. Cell's death was good too. Maybe it took a little too long, but Abridged Cell was great so I didn't mind it. The joke with Yamcha wanting to be in the future was hilarious too. The whole friendship moment with him and Tien was kind of unearned though. Never got the impression they were supposed to be friends, even the kind of friends who are dicks to each other.
The less said about Krillin and 18 the better. Everytime they do stuff with these 2 it makes me fucking cringe. I guess unlike in canon, they're at least trying here, but it just doesn't work for me. And the whole concept of "dude gets rewarded with a hot girlfriend because he's a funny loser and turns out to be really good at sex, actually" makes me want to hurl.
Overall, I thought it was a good finale though. I wouldn't mind if it was the series finale, but I think they'd do a good job with the Buu saga so I'd like to see that.
That was my favorite moment in the episode, tbh.
Edited by lara16 on Sep 15th 2018 at 5:11:21 AM
Cell: "You see, I-"
Gohan: "He survived the explosion! He must have survived as a single cell with Freeza's DNA!"
Cell: "Haha, correct young-"
Piccolo: "and when he came back with my regeneration, he must have returned to his Perfect form!"
Cell: "Yes but-"
Tien: "And he must have copied Goku's instant transmission after seeing it once and returned!"
Krillin: "and he's part-Goku, that means he came back even stronger than before!"
Cell: "Would you just let me-"
Yamcha: "But couldn't he just self-destruct a few more times and come back-"
Cell: "WOULD YOU ALL BE QUIET AND LET ME HAVE MY MOMENT"
[beat]
Vegeta: "MY BABY BOY!"
(and continue as per episode)
Edited by Sigilbreaker26 on Sep 15th 2018 at 12:10:47 PM
"And when the last law was down and the Devil turned round on you, where would you hide, the laws all being flat?"I mean.
It's worth noting that even if Trunks and Tien had the same power level people would still be able to tell them apart with Ki Sense?
Not with Scouters, but. Sensing energy naturally.
It's part of Cell's thing, how he 'feels' like all the different fighters he's made of.
Also, on Namek, Krillin and Gohan could tell how evil Frieza was just by sensing him.
It's an underrated aspect of ki sensing that isn't discussed as much.
"Also, on Namek, Krillin and Gohan could tell how evil Frieza was just by sensing him."
I thought it was more that Freeza was so earth shakingly powerful that their immediate instinct was to run and hide. He's what, half a million in his first form?
"And when the last law was down and the Devil turned round on you, where would you hide, the laws all being flat?"I mean, I dunno about the Abridged version, but when they land on Namek in the manga:
Krillin: "Y-yeah... and every one of 'em's strong! W-what could it be...?"
Bulma: "Duh! What do you expect? Those are Namekians! If Kami-Sama and Piccolo were as strong as they were, then real Namekians are gonna have amazing chi-power!"
Gohan: "B-but they're..."
Krillin: "Yeah... evil, that's what they are."
So not just Frieza specifically, but his crew more generally.
Did they mean to say person and not character?
Because there's only ever "real" characters.
Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.
(2) Yes, but consider:
- Cell is a prick and is using the gap between his power level and the humans' power levels to mock them. Team Four Star's made similar jokes with Krillin talking about "stealth mode" and Gohan wondering why he can't seem to make his power as low as Krillin's.
- Cell never actually received any sort of training or guidance in how ki energy works. He just copies techniques that Gero knew about and pretty much got a crash course in how regeneration/Zenkais work.
- Didn't know about instant transmission, didn't know how durable Piccolo or himself were. He could "feel" Goku's power when he was standing right in front of him and Goku was powering up. But no one actually explained to him how to tell peoples' powers apart - Vegeta didn't know how to do it until he was a grown adult and had fight an unknown number of battles. I don't think Gero gave 17 or 18 the ability to detect power levels either.
Edited by Soble on Sep 15th 2018 at 5:47:42 AM
I'M MR. MEESEEKS, LOOK AT ME!Gero not giving 17 and 18 the ability to sense energy may or may not have been specifically to make them more vulnerable to Cell.
Also, Vegeta can tell that Cell's energy feels like his own but stronger. So.
And Vegeta learned how to sense energy just because he knew it was possible.
There's a whole thing about how it feels like Piccolo is powering up to fight himself, and one of the two Piccolos is also Goku and Vegeta and Frieza and King Cold. And both of the Piccolos are stronger than Piccolo Jr. was that morning.
Edited by unnoun on Sep 15th 2018 at 8:57:57 AM
Like I said, I was fully expecting that to be the end end, which I think colored my impression of the episode quite a bit. As a Grand Finale, I would've been perfectly satisfied with it, and as just a season finale, it was pretty amazing too.
I find it kind of funny that people are saying Cell's death dragged on too long, when I personally thought the beam struggle ended too quickly. The other characters helping out would've been cool. Didn't happen in the manga, but considering how Abridged Tien has been written even in Part 2, I would've expected him at least to chip in. "Cell's Way" was definitely the highlight of the episode for me. The best death so far for the best villain so far. Perfect indeed.
My favorite joke was probably Krillin's negative ownage though. I'm biased because Krillin and 18 are my favorite couple in canon (not saying much, I know), but that just made me so happy for the guy. About time he caught a break.
Looking forward to Season 4 toning down the seriousness like canon did. Considering their stated intention to "have fun with it", I don't think we have to worry about them skipping stuff like the Great Saiyaman or the Otherworld Tournament. The former at least was in a large chunk of the manga as well, so it seems pretty safe.
Edited by Berserker88 on Sep 15th 2018 at 6:36:12 AM
The Great Saiyaman should almost certainly be played as a way for Gohan to work through all the issues he's acquired over the first three seasons. That would also give a good reason for Gohan getting weaker in the Buu saga; if Gohan is suddenly well-adjusted enough that he no longer has the ability to get insanely angry, then he also loses the potential for pulling out new rage boosts that increase his power levels.
"I find it kind of funny that people are saying Cell's death dragged on too long, when I personally thought the beam struggle ended too quickly."
Basically this. I was placing bets on what they were going to have as Vegeta's joke for his intervention... and there wasn't one, really, aside from a repeat of "oh shit".
"And when the last law was down and the Devil turned round on you, where would you hide, the laws all being flat?"Regarding 17 and 18 not being able to sense ki, I actually don't think that's an intentional design flaw like Abridged 17 supposes.
16 has what is basically a built-in Scouter, but he's fully mechanical. "Errors have been made" and all that.
Cell has ki-sensing, but he also has the Makankosappo, regeneration, the ability to survive as a nucleus, etc. I think the implication that he got ki-sensing from his donors and wasn't specifically programmed with it by Dr. Gero is pretty clear.
19 is fully mechanical. 20 is a brain in a robot body.
But 17 and 18 are biomechanical upgrades to existing people. While Dr. Gero was able to build a Scouter for 16, it's probable that he never figured out how to build an entirely biomechanical Scouter.
Edited by TobiasDrake on Sep 15th 2018 at 7:51:42 AM
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.17 had to have trained a lot because even in the Manga he's about SSJ 3 level and he's higher in the anime.
"And when the last law was down and the Devil turned round on you, where would you hide, the laws all being flat?"I'm sure 18 learned ki-sensing in the same offscreen training sessions where she learned the kienzan.
I think 17 benefit from the same "never trained before" logic as Frieza. What we know as his immense battle power is his normal untapped state. It's what he's like when he's out of shape and has put zero effort into actually training his body to become a seasoned combatant. Frieza arc Frieza and Cell arc 17 are schlubby.
Super gives them an opportunity to find out just what they can be capable of when they've learned how much they can lift, bruh.
Edited by TobiasDrake on Sep 15th 2018 at 8:13:18 AM
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.Why is the beam struggle so big...
Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.Size and Length...somehow both Cell and Gohand got super far apart.
Rules of the Internet 45. Rule 45 is a lie. Check out my art if you notice.

I definitely prefer the joke about him hoping he hit Tien over the joke that has been said a million times.