Dragon Ball Z Abridged

Nice.

Shortly afterwards, Raditz would be at Heaven's Door.

Silence you!

Autocorrect, you continue to vex me.

One day, I'll have my revenge.

I'm surprised to this day Raditz still hasn't gotten his recognition.

People enjoy shitting on him too much.

Plus, Toriyama didn't really have much respect for him, what with him completely disappearing after only a few chapters.

His fight is interesting but also kind of dodgy, he doesn't have any really cool moves at his disposal and in terms of character he's massively overshadowed by Nappa and Vegeta. Even in power terms he's very unimpressive when compared to the Saiyan standard that eventually developed, and was reduced to not being a big deal very quickly with Saibamen being introduced as only slightly weaker than him. (which is odd because Raditz himself was introduced as blowing start of Z Goku out of the water).

It is kinda weird that Raditz was so formidable compared to Goku. The series would go on to establish that the whole concept of lifting weights and shit to increase one's strength is an exclusively Earthling idea. Saiyans and the PTO in general just roll with however strong a person is and hone their battle powers entirely through combat.

Aliens just go by whatever their natural inherent strength is. The kind of gains Goku makes are considered phenomenal and ultimately convince Vegeta that maybe there's something to this training thing after all.

Now, Goku is acknowledged as being a garbage third-class Saiyan, but. Like. So is Raditz. The difference between Raditz and Goku is that Goku's been training and honing his battle power and drinking magic poison water to awaken his hidden potential and shit, while Raditz has just been out there using the Oozaru to genocide planets.

So.

They're both garbage Saiyans and Goku's been actively working to increase his battle power which is shown later in the series to have incredible returns compared to aliens like Raditz just being naturally strong.

Why is Raditz the powerful one here? The answer is, of course, that all of that stuff about aliens not training hadn't been established yet and Toriyama writes by the seat of his pants. But it really doesn't make a lot of sense in retrospect.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Jul 24th 2018 at 9:22:59 AM

Then again, not much drama if Raditz shows up on Earth and Goku wrecks him.

It actually leads to the weird idea of just how weak was Goku by Saiyan standards. Like, AU where Freeza doesn't blow up the planet, how garbage would Kakarot be without training? One might assume he'd be slightly stronger than regular Goku was as a child (since he'd grow up on a planet with 10X gravity).

I know Lani has mentioned reading a Fan made manga where Vegeta was the one sent to Earth instead of Goku, and Goku was the villain of the Saiyen Saga. Goku got by entirely relying on Zenkai boosts, eventually getting as strong as Vegeta was.

What's really wierd is that Goku doesn't actually have any gains from OG Dragonball that can be attributed to Zenkai boosts.

Though I'd argue that his lack of high gravity training is probably the reason; when he finally does train in that for just a year he leaps past Raditz and Nappa to within spitting distance of Papa Bardock.

He trained in 10x gravity for a month between the King Piccolo and Piccolo Jr arcs.

Also didn't he use the chamber once?

It's not when you remember that it wasn't invented yet. Like all things that should retroactively have happened but didn't.

IIRC, the Manga actually tries to retcon Zenkai having happened when Vegeta explains them, by having Krillin note that Goku would also get stronger when he'd almost die, but sort of forgetting there was always a "Goku does a thing to get stronger" following the almost dying, and almost dying on its own didn't do it.

Huh? No he didn't as far as I'm aware. He seemed massively surprised by King Kai's planet's gravity. His Kami training was mainly about learning Ki sensing and wearing weighted clothing.

Oh I know the out of universe explanation, I'm talking from a purely in-universe POV.

Huh? No he didn't as far as I'm aware. He seemed massively surprised by King Kai's planet's gravity. His Kami training was mainly about learning Ki sensing and wearing weighted clothing.

He does when they retcon him having visited the Hypertonic Lion Tamer during the Android Arc (They pretend he visited it between King Piccolo and Piccolo Jr). As the Chamber has x10 Gravity...

Edited by Ghilz on Jul 24th 2018 at 12:28:27 PM

Yet another reason to hate the Hyperbolic Time Chamber.

Considering his power when we first met him, Goku is seriously janky by Saiyan standards. They actually underestimated the battle power of Earth when they sent Goku there. Without his training and magic water and shit, even Goku's Oozaru form was pretty weak.

In a universe where Goku didn't suffer brain damage and tried to carry out his mission faithfully, there's a strong likelihood that his rampage is swiftly and brutally ended by Taopaipai or Tenshinhan. And then life continues as normal for the Earthlings.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Jul 24th 2018 at 11:28:38 AM

Hard to say about Tenshinhan but Taopaipai and Roshi could have easily handled him. Korin and God could have also wrecked his shit if they so chose.

Then Raditz arrives many years later and murders the entire planet that is ruled by either Pilaf or the Red Ribbon Army.

Edited by Zelenal on Jul 24th 2018 at 12:35:28 PM

Tien might not have started his martial arts training by that time, Roshi and Taopaipai would have definitely been strong enough. Probably the same with some of Uranai Baba's fighters, and if Popo, Kami or Korin ever left the damn lookout they could beat him probably.

I mean, canonically Oozaru Kid Goku got beaten by a combination of Yamcha and Puar. So a lot of people could beat him if they figured out the tail weakness.

Edited by Sigilbreaker26 on Jul 24th 2018 at 5:40:21 PM

Raditz actually might leave after he finds out what happened to Kakarot. Earth was a pit-stop. There was another, stronger world that he, Vegeta, and Nappa were planning on hitting. He only came to Earth so that he could grab Kakarot, thinking that having a fourth Saiyan with them when they hit said planet would be a good idea.

If he had his way, he would have popped by Kame-sennin's house, Kakarot would have been like "Sweet! Let's go!" and then they would have left the planet that same day.

He kidnapped Gohan and demanded that Kakarot kill 100 Earthlings as a show of good will because of how soft and un-Saiyanlike the guy was when he met him. But he still had every intention of f*cking off and taking on that other, better planet rather than wasting his time genociding the Earth.

There's nothing that says he wouldn't come back, mind you. But also nothing that necessarily says that he would, either. There were explicitly bigger fish to fry. I'd say that after Raditz left, Earth would have pretty much the exact same odds of getting hit by the Planet Trade Organization as any other planet.

Plus, who knows? If that other planet is really as formidable as Raditz thought, he might wind up getting his ass killed and then his chance of returning falls to zero. And it's not like Nappa and Vegeta would go out of their way to come after Earth if they didn't know about Dragon Balls.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Jul 24th 2018 at 11:42:51 AM

He also expected everyone to be already dead by the time he arrived. there's no real garantee Raditz wouldn't have killed all humans if Goku had accepted to come along.

After all, Vegeta and Nappa were a year away and he knew it. Not like he ain't got time to kill. And Terrans to kill.

Edited by Ghilz on Jul 24th 2018 at 3:11:05 PM

The fact that he had no plans to kill all humans in the first place is the guarantee. He did expect all the humans to be dead, but this didn't actually change his plans. He did not say, "Kakarot, you and me, we need to go around killing all the humans. Once this planet is exterminated, then we can leave."

Instead, he was like, "The f*ck, man? Look, kill 100 humans to show me you mean business and then let's get the f*ck out of here! We got shit to do!"

The having of more important shit to do would not cease to be a factor if Kakarot was dead.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Jul 24th 2018 at 1:32:24 PM

I believe he says "these 100 will have a head start" or something to that effect so I believe that indicates that he was planning to return to Earth after they did the other planet.

The 100 humans would be his proof that Goku was really willing to go along with them. After it became apparent that wouldn't be the case, Raditz decided that after he and the others finished their big mission, they'd come back and wipe out life on Earth to be a dick.

So it wasn't about Earth's value anymore, it was to spite Goku for defying him and turning his back on the Saiyan race.

Edited by LSBK on Jul 24th 2018 at 2:57:00 PM

On Raditz being so much stronger than Goku: Kaio says it's because the Saiyans are adapted to the 10x gravity, and it only takes a year for Goku to shoot past him.

But it's also a big assumption to say that Raditz was just a brute and only relied on Oozaru. Though the Saiyans did not know ki sensing or how to manipulate their battle power, they could fly very easily and nanipulate their ki (like Vegeta's power ball). Raditz also mentions that they do train. It's more like a divergent evolution in skill.

Besides, Raditz has had plenty of opportunity for zenkai since he's not that powerful by the universes' standard.