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Demongodofchaos2 Face me now, bitch! from In a Cultivation World (Ancient one) Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
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#2651: Jan 11th 2013 at 9:10:46 PM

He went on record saying that Dragon Ball Online and the new Battle of the Gods movie erases it from canon, though I could see an alternate Canon version of 4 be created by him.

edited 11th Jan '13 9:10:58 PM by Demongodofchaos2

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theweirdKiddokun What a Wonderful World! from Last Place in the Race Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
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#2652: Jan 11th 2013 at 9:13:34 PM

[up][up]He said something like he like the ideas that they did, but he didn't like the writing.

I was wondering about something I have heard recently that Toriyama only gave Super Saiyan a multiplier because of Kaioken and that he later wanted change how it was explained. Is this true or was this another moment of the Word of Dante?

edited 11th Jan '13 9:14:19 PM by theweirdKiddokun

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unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#2653: Jan 11th 2013 at 9:14:31 PM

Hideo Kojima said he enjoyed Snake's Revenge. He still replaced it in his canon with Metal Gear 2.

edited 11th Jan '13 9:14:53 PM by unnoun

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#2654: Jan 11th 2013 at 9:16:48 PM

@ Enlong

I know what you mean, and I agree. I'm just saying that the DBZ canon, at least as far as the anime is concerned, is already kinda screwy what with all the Non-Serial Movies.

edited 11th Jan '13 9:17:53 PM by Spirit

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#2655: Jan 11th 2013 at 9:22:09 PM

True. Then again, nobody's going to acknowledge the "Super Saiyan" form from Lord Slug anytime soon, either.

In any case, the Death Battle was just as cool as you'd expect from the combatants given. It was also cool to see Team Four Star giving the voices, and portraying Goku as original flavor rather than Abridged style.

Seems very irresponsible for Superman to actually meet Goku's last punch, since the force of said clash destroyed the Earth. While I can see SS 4 Goku going nuts in that manner, it seems more in Supes's character to evade the blow.

I half expected Goku's final attack to be the spirit bomb, which would've completely fizzled when fired at the Big Blue Boy Scout. Forgot about the very Hiei-like method of absorbing the Spirit Bomb.

On a side note, it would be very cool if the newest movie introduced something in the vein of SS 4 itself.

edited 11th Jan '13 9:22:29 PM by Enlong

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unnoun Since: Jan, 2012
#2656: Jan 11th 2013 at 9:24:59 PM

I still think it would have always made more sense for Goku and Supes to become friends. Unless Supes was in one of the power trips he keeps getting in the various alternate universes. But somehow the evil Supermans are usually weaker than the good ones. With some exceptions.

edited 11th Jan '13 9:25:17 PM by unnoun

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#2657: Jan 11th 2013 at 9:26:27 PM

The circumsances weren't the best for them to become friends, since Goku kinda strolled in and started an unprovoked fight.

But in another situation, like, say, an alien invasion or something, then I can totally see them teaming up. With Supes playing the disgruntled police chief to Goku's Loose Cannon Cop Who Makes His Own Rules.

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#2658: Jan 11th 2013 at 9:26:28 PM

One of the major tenets of Death Battle is that the fights must end in death.

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#2659: Jan 11th 2013 at 9:26:47 PM

Considering that It's hinted in certain promotional material that SS 3 Gogeta is needed, well, maybe.

The new movie villain stopped Super Saiyan 3 Goku just by holding his finger outwards, and can destroy an entire Galaxy with raw power.

No, not just a planet at a time destroyed galaxy, a single galaxy and all it's made up of with at once.

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#2660: Jan 11th 2013 at 9:32:13 PM

As cool as SS 4 being made official in the movie would be, I think it'd end up being too big of a "Whoa, what!?" moment for fans. Yet somehow SS 3 Gogeta does sound about right.

edited 11th Jan '13 9:37:54 PM by Spirit

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#2661: Jan 11th 2013 at 9:32:44 PM

About time SS 3 did something useful.

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#2662: Jan 11th 2013 at 9:36:17 PM

If SS stayed as a crippling corruption, Mystic Gohan could've been more believable as the final hero.

Also, no one pointed out the use of "Kaio-WHAT!?". I was hoping you guys would like that.

edited 11th Jan '13 9:37:01 PM by wanderlustwarrior

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#2663: Jan 11th 2013 at 9:37:13 PM

Not the same SS 4, but a new form that might as well be the Toriyama-written equivalent.

[up] I did enjoy the "Kaio What?"

I liked most of it. I was jsut mystified by Supes not thinking ahead to what would happen to the planet he's trying to protect by meeting Goku's final punch head-on.

edited 11th Jan '13 9:38:17 PM by Enlong

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#2664: Jan 11th 2013 at 9:47:47 PM

I still think it would have always made more sense for Goku and Supes to become friends. Unless Supes was in one of the power trips he keeps getting in the various alternate universes.

It's a death battle though, calling a truce or stopping the fight goes against the very concept of the series. If anything, the only thing I think they should have done differently was take the fight into another system since it goes against both their code to put people in harms way.

edited 11th Jan '13 9:49:17 PM by Lionheart0

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#2665: Jan 11th 2013 at 10:12:36 PM

I wouldn't mind seeing SS 4 being introduced. GT invented it but there's no reason Z can't have its own reason for 4 existing.

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#2666: Jan 11th 2013 at 10:35:37 PM

I always liked the concept behind SSJ 4. Toriyama kind of stopped caring about the Oozaru after Super Saiyans were introduced, but the idea that combining the power of both Saiyan transformations creates the ultimate Saiyan transformation always resonated more deeply with me than "Train really REALLY hard until you unlock a higher power level form."

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#2667: Jan 11th 2013 at 10:45:14 PM

Yes. I love the idea of SS 4. I just wish it was in the greater canon of the series.

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#2669: Jan 12th 2013 at 5:28:37 AM

No version of Gogeta is being hinted at with the new movie, DGOC. That Gogeta stuff is all from Dragon Ball Heroes and existed the movie announcement.

Oh, and more importantly, Toriyama did not say anything about DBO and the movie replacing GT in canon. Nobody has said anything about canon. The whole "new movie is canon/DBO is canon" stuff being thrown around comes from twisting the words of people who aren't Toriyama.

He did refer to GT as a "side-story", in the same quote where he said he enjoyed it. Make of that what you will.

I hate SS4's colour scheme (and doing away with the lack of eyebrows, seriously, that was so fitting and you didn't keep that for the ape like form? You fucking idiot, Nakatsuru) but it's a decent concept. I'd rather the new movie just kept away from it, but who cares, at the moment it's looking like it will have bigger problems than that.

Deathbattle using SS4 is no surprising thing since they have absolutely no grasp of canon. And no grasp of Dragon Ball, either, looking at their Vegeta vs Shadow video. Or even the current one, they still managed to screw up the research that was done for them in some ways.

@Kiddo Kun

What you've been told seems to be a twisting of Toriyama's words. What he said on the Super Saiyan multiplier is that he originally envisioned it as being x10, but it had to be x50 because of the story (since at the point he was ready to introduce it, Goku needed x20 Kaio-ken just to be even with half of Freeza's power). Badly twisting his words.tongue

edited 12th Jan '13 5:28:54 AM by Saiga

Demongodofchaos2 Face me now, bitch! from In a Cultivation World (Ancient one) Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
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#2670: Jan 12th 2013 at 8:23:53 AM

The whole "new movie is canon/DBO is canon" stuff being thrown around comes from twisting the words of people who aren't Toriyama.

One problem is that Toriyama is the main writer for both and outright states their both canon.

And No, Saiga, they have complete grasp of canon, and Daizenshu and the Dao of Dragonball outright helped them with the Research for the fight. They also outright stated that as long as something Doesn't completely contradict the original Manga, they would use it. SS 4 is one of those things, as well as the idea of Goku Absorbing the spirit bombs energy to power himself up.

edited 12th Jan '13 8:27:02 AM by Demongodofchaos2

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#2671: Jan 12th 2013 at 8:28:43 AM

"Their [sic] both canon" what?

More seriously, I wish Superman didn't have access to the Speed Force. Isn't Boxing Lessons for Superman enough?

Demongodofchaos2 Face me now, bitch! from In a Cultivation World (Ancient one) Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
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#2672: Jan 12th 2013 at 8:30:49 AM

Both Dragon Ball Online and The new Battle for the Gods Movie are Written mainly by akira Toriyama, and he has stated that both are canon. The former is basically 150 years after the end of Z, while battle of the gods takes place between the Last two chapters of the manga.

Superman doesn't have access to the speed force, he doesn't need it.

edited 12th Jan '13 8:31:26 AM by Demongodofchaos2

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#2673: Jan 12th 2013 at 9:25:41 AM

Wait, when did he have access o he speed force? I thought he was just real fast (not Flash fast, but w/e)

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#2674: Jan 12th 2013 at 9:42:42 AM

At least for the sake of this video, he used 2 Speed Force powers. I don't remember it word for word, but I'm pretty sure they mentioned it explicitly.

GethKnight Since: Apr, 2010
#2675: Jan 12th 2013 at 9:52:02 AM

The Infinity Fist? I thought that was just a "Go really fast and punch something" move. Nothing Speed Force related.


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