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I think we're talking past each other. People can be real feminists while being annoying jerks, but when they're annoying/obnoxious about their feminism then they fail at being true feminists. Because feminism isn't about doing things like threatening people with knives because they read (gasp) porn.
Just like I consider atheists who aggressively try to rub their atheism under everyone's noses and PETA fanatics who advocate for burning people who wear fur as failures of the faction they err... choose to represent. (atheists and vegetarians/vegans)
edited 25th Jul '13 2:37:43 PM by kay4today
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Well "supposedly" the Nail has something to do with that... because it's not like the Hyuga clan are just a convenient way to turn Hinata into the perfect companion for Naruto and all of his angst. I'm sure Hiashi had a tragic experience that turned him into such a cold bastard.
There is a review for Chapter 20 that made me think of something kind of funny. When Kurenai gets head-shotted by Itachi, isn't she wearing her forehead protector, the metal plate on her head that's supposed to stop or at least negate such attacks? Itachi has a damn good throwing arm. That, or the kunai really skewered her, which isn't as funny...
This story is so old, if anybody posting here doesn't know about that death I'd be surprised.
edited 25th Jul '13 3:06:08 PM by FOFD
Bottom line: When a "real X" concept is the product of human thinking, it's practically always subjective and, some way or the other, will be ultimately proven to flawed to some degree.
edited 25th Jul '13 3:12:58 PM by MarqFJA
Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.I don't get why Orochimaru losing an arm is even a problem. Didn't he like get torn in half at one point during Part II?
He's the poster boy for regeneration in this series. Sarutobi had to rip the soul out of Orochimaru's arms, but Haku froze one of the arms and this somehow caused significant damage? Alright, my medical knowledge is extremely limited, but if they could amputate and stabilize a 60-70 year old man, a 40-50 year old regenerator should have no problem.
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Some "opinions" are more right than others and should be seen as such. Some people also have the "opinion" that there's nothing wrong with things like rape and murder as well, but those people are rightly seen as wrong by not-sickos. And nuts. Kind of like the radical straw feminists get ridiculed by the actual feminists who don't have the maturity of a screeching baby.
As for the other things you say in your post, not sure whether you talk to anyone here or are just kind of babbling to yourself, so... yeah.
edited 25th Jul '13 3:47:53 PM by kay4today
My point is that you're acting like your interpretation of what "real feminism" is about is absolutely correct and precise. In my opinion, simpy being "not obnoxious about your feminism" (which is what you look like you're saying to me) cannot be all there is to "real/true feminism"; it's insultingly and short-sightedly oversimplifying.
And the less said about whether Kurenai is objectively obnoxious about her feminism, the better. That way inevitably leads to Flame War.
edited 25th Jul '13 3:54:04 PM by MarqFJA
Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.edited 25th Jul '13 3:59:17 PM by MarqFJA
Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.It's not gem the obnoxious part that's the problem. She has a legitimate problem with how pornography portrays women. The problem is that she’s criticizing other women (Sakura and Ino) for the way they act, as though feminism isn't about women being able to make such choices in the first place. Basically, you can’t say your a feminist while you criticize the choices other women make (note, this is different from criticizing ideologies other women have– there are a lot of things forced into women's heads by the patriarchal society).
Don't forget the part where she threatens people over reading porn, which is really mature and stuff.
edited 25th Jul '13 3:59:47 PM by kay4today
Ninja'd.
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Now that is an interesting look at it. Care to elaborate and perhaps refresh our minds of stuff that we may have forgotten/glossed over?
edited 25th Jul '13 4:01:10 PM by MarqFJA
Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.Is she? I never really thought about feminism aspect. Then again, I read this fic, what, five years ago; I wasn't even really aware of what feminism was back then.
Continuously reading, studying, and (hopefully) growing.Not sure how sarcastic you're being.
Anyway, like I said, I have no problem with the fact that she has a problem with porn. Of course, there's a bit of the Tone Argument there– yes, it is wrong for her to threaten people, but the point she makes about how pornography treats female characters is still valid.
Yeah, yeah nobody said her points weren't valid, yada yada yada…
@Roy
There's also all the random bashing over the place; it's subdued compared to other bashfics but it's still there. Oh, and and all the random japanese is annoying.
Oh, and negative five points for Team 8 for making Hinata Naruto's damsel. Way to completely miss the entire reason Naru/Hina exists as a pairing.
Yeah, I can deal with some honorifics here and there, but I can do without random words being thrown into normal speech. It's like they're trying to do Spanglish with Japanese.
edited 25th Jul '13 4:26:46 PM by ScorpioRat
edited 25th Jul '13 4:31:19 PM by MarqFJA
Fiat iustitia, et pereat mundus.

And claiming that people who display noxious behaviors aren't 'real' feminists, regardless of what they believe or identify as, is textbook no-true-Scotsman. Feminists can be annoying asses just as much as other people can.
Shinigan (Naruto fanfic)