Pokémon anime

Unova was a case of wanting to invoke the early anime, without providing good justification for basically everything being reset. It was probably the most enforced example of Fleeting Demographic Rule in the anime.

My dA: https://www.deviantart.com/toko90s

Just a bit curious, but am I the only one who thinks a Darker and Edgier Unova arc, where Nothing Is the Same Anymore applied and Nobody Can Die is averted, would have been more natural than what we ultimately got? Given the Breaking Old Trends and mature themes being explored in Pokémon Black and White, it wouldn't have been such a bad idea to do the same in the corresponding anime arc. Maybe have Ghetsis replace Team Rocket as the recurring main antagonist and become a more personal villain to Ash instead. Then the transition to the comparatively dark Kalos arc would have felt more natural. What would your thoughts be on this?

"Okay, it's just my opinion, but I think a futuristic, Darker and Edgier sequel to Pokemon Platinum is a HORRIBLE idea." - Irida

I don't think Pokemon has the guts for that.

They saved N's arc for the very end, and the anime has never really devoted itself to the game arcs (or done a poor job of it when they do).

One Strip! One Strip!

That's disappointing to hear. The 23rd and 24th episodes of Best Wishes were originally supposed to feature Team Plasma's debut, with Team Rocket facing off against them, but due to an earthquake and tsunami that devastated Japan a week before the episode was set to air their, these episodes were skipped and then retconned completely, with Team Plasma eventually appearing in the 112th episode instead. Maybe they should have delayed the episodes for another few weeks instead of completely writing them out of existence and changing the course of the whole arc entirely.

Ghetsis could have been a proto-All For One, manipulating events behind the scenes for years before Ash arrived in Unova, and perhaps a case of Adaptational Badass, without any Smug Snake attributes or Villainous Breakdowns of his game counterpart, while N would have filled the role of Tomura Shigaraki instead of getting a bit forced Adaptational Heroism, being portrayed as a sympathetic yet still dangerous character.

Maybe I've been reading too much My Hero Academia, but I wouldn't have minded if Best Wishes marked a point where the anime permanently shifted into a more serious tone with more threatening villains instead of what we ultimately got.

Edited by clemont107 on Jun 29th 2022 at 7:37:26 AM

"Okay, it's just my opinion, but I think a futuristic, Darker and Edgier sequel to Pokemon Platinum is a HORRIBLE idea." - Irida

If it was just the Fukushima Earthquake and Nuclear disaster, then the writers probably would have brought Plasma's role in the plot back at the next charted plot point, condensing the 2-parter into a Whole Episode Flashback and resumed the story from there. I'm think that they originally intended for N to have some role in the Meteonite events, even if said role was just a Meanwhile Scene at the end.

Of course, as all we know, the franchise had a little earthquake of its own shortly thereafter. The writers decided to shift all of the B1W1 villainy on not so harmless Team Rocket and make the Team Plasma arc based more on their more black and white B2W2 version. One has to wonder what would have happened if the Fukushima disaster didn't happen but the sequel games were still released: how would the writers have responded if the Meteonite duology was released and then the news of Sequel games came out?

Granted, their declaration of Comic-Book Time, locking Ash in at 10, along with certain decisions regarding his character, has me doubt the writers' ability to address the questions N would raise. A "kid" would not be a good match for such questions... so Ash would have to fall back to the Stock Shōnen Hero method of "answering" such questions anyway...

Ketchum's corollary to Clarke's Third Law: Any sufficiently advanced tactic is indistinguishable from blind luck.

Plus let's be real here the villainous teams were always the weakest part of a Pokemon story both the anime and games.

The gym battles and eventual league tournament is what all the fans come to see.

Hell in XY with the dumb decision to have Ash lose his rematch to Alain both the fans and the staff revolted against the decision. With the Team Flare arc trailer being bombed with dislikes.

Cause Ash has "saved the world" too many times to count in the anime and movies that it's a forgone conclusion. Those stakes have zero meaning because no way would the pokemon anime have the characters die in some end of world cataclysm.

But Ash winning or losing a tournament that's what people are invested in because we legit don't know if the writers will find a way to screw Ash out of another tournament win.

Ash's win in Alola came off as the writers "We're sorry for Kalos"

Now Ash is in his biggest tournament yet with zero mention of any villainous team sans Jesse, James and Meowth up to their usual odd job at tournament antics.

Ash always wins against the villainous teams. Unless your name is Giovanni. In which case Ash cannot truly win against him.

Admittedly I don't really know how well the trio would work as The Remnant if something were to happen to the organization and this is more my grievance with Team Rocket as a franchise whole, but I feel like none of the villain teams can truly flourish as long as Team Rocket is around.

Edited by TPPR10 on Jun 29th 2022 at 5:10:50 PM

Continue the bloodline, Fujimaru!

Unless you count meeting Team Yell in Galar for the Marnie battle? And Macro Cosmos for the Eternatus arc?

I can see this for the anime but I disagree with the games. Gen 5 is most well known for its strong story across both games that focused on the villainous teams. The previous 4 gens also had the villain teams as a focus and strong memorable aspects of the game. Meanwhile, all the gens after the 3D jump had much weaker villains and all had overall weaker reception. Of course, there were a multitude of other issues with them but the trend of weaker and less engaging villains likely didn't help.

Generation five's plot is overhyped. If you want a Pokemon game with an actual good plot you're going to want to play either Sun or Moon.

Eh Lusamine was a good villain but SM's constant unskippable cutscenes and terribly paced tutorial were the biggest reasons I don't like replaying it.

Frankly the pokemon games with the stories I liked the most were the shadow pokemon games. As beating team cipher and snagem were the focus from start to finish.

Mt. Battle was just a way to exp grind. Plus with all the main games talk of rescuing pokemon from evil team in the GC games you legit did save abused pokemon from the evil team.

Edited by FKJ10 on Jun 30th 2022 at 6:10:25 AM

Wasn't Lusamine given a huge case of Adaptational Heroism in the anime? They turned her into an overly-affectionate mother and relatively Nice Girl compared to her Ax-Crazy Sun and Moon game incarnation. Maybe it was because of the Alola arc's Lighter and Softer tone, but still it's still kind of jarring to compare her between those versions.

I really wouldn't have minded Lusamine remaining a villain in the anime, as long as her connection with Lillie was shown and Lillie would be determined to bring her back to redemption. Heck, maybe have Lusamine be written without the Nihilego toxins affecting her, as a more sane, Magnificent Bastard Well-Intentioned Extremist who's perhaps more dangerous because she isn't being affected by toxins. And give her a motive different from both her SM and USUM game incarnations, while showing that she still loves Lillie.

"Okay, it's just my opinion, but I think a futuristic, Darker and Edgier sequel to Pokemon Platinum is a HORRIBLE idea." - Irida

Lusamine has been getting the Draco in leather pants treatment since the USUM games. The only other time she's been as villainous as her original SM version was in the adventures manga.

But the adventures manga has always been the darkest depiction of the pokemon franchise.

So changing Lusamine from a megalomaniacal abusive mom to a loving ditzy mom works for the light hearted SM anime.

Edited by FKJ10 on Jun 30th 2022 at 6:48:07 AM

I feel like if you would rewrite Lusamine (for the anime), you'd had to rewrite Lillie as well. Or even the entire structure of the Alola seasons. I think the reason why the two's (and Gladion, if you need to insist on him) got through the radar was because Lillie was The Runaway caused by her trying to rescue Cosmog, meaning that Lillie doesn't need to spend too much time with Lusamine specifically. The anime on the other hand has her be "the rich kid", meaning that she needs to be connected to Lusamine in the present day, even if the connection is bit thin. This is mainly because the entire season have a central place where the gang are located in, meaning that the runaway plot wouldn't necessarily last that long unless Lusamine isn't actively looking for Lillie.

Continue the bloodline, Fujimaru!

Plus...I just like seeing ditzy Stacy's Mom Lusamine.

The juxtaposition after playing SM where she was basically just PG Mom from Futurama was hilarious.

Manga!Lusamine: You must be perfect appearances are everything!

Anime!Lusamine: Just woke up and still hungover no way am I grooming all this.

One idea I had for anime Lusamine was to have her start off as just an emotionally distant parent, lose her sanity and become like her SM incarnation after her exposure to Nihilego, and then eventually recover and reform by the end of the series as her children decide to search after Mohn.

Even SM Lusamine was Easily Forgiven, so I don't think she was meant to come across as evil as she did. It might also be a case of differing values with an emphasis on family ties, like how in Paper Mario TTYD Vivian went back to be with her sisters even though Beldam was abusive (she promised not to do it again).

The Protomen enhanced my life.

I've always thought that our Terrible Trio could have jumped tams easily if it gave them a better chance of catching 'da Twoip and his Pikachu.

It's just too bad that the first game in which they could do so had two evil teams opposed to each other.

As for Anime!Lusamine, I would have rather she suffer from a different madness: Rather than being addicted to Nihilego's toxin, Lusamine's whole drive would be to get her husband back or, failing that, avenge him. The latter would come to light when Necrozma comes calling; and that, plus her willingness to risk her own children, would be the crux of her conflict with Ash.

But why does she use her children and their friends against the Ultra Beasts? Perhaps she truly sees their potential and wants to nurture it through these missions. Perhaps it's because, between her long term as an executive and the result of her failure against Nihilego, she believes that she doesn't have the strength herself anymore. Or perhaps she subscribes to the wisdom of Denethor, only going to battle either at the Darkest Hour or when Necrozma appears to be cornered; in the latter case, let her beware...

As for the Sentai motif of the Ultra Guardians... She's just a fan of the genre or what it stands for.

Ketchum's corollary to Clarke's Third Law: Any sufficiently advanced tactic is indistinguishable from blind luck.

I think that Team Rocket still being around is a result of Gen 1 and 2 refusing to adapt the games in any meaningful way. Ash didn't battle Giovanni in Kanto, the Silver and revived team rocket didn't happen, nothing. So instead, Team Rocket are just these unrelated third parties who have no real dog in the fight.

More of a case of them being favorites of the original writer and general favoritism towards Gen 1.

It's also partiality the reason why we've never had a new male protagonist. Instead Ash just gets each gens female protagonist (sans 5, 7 and 8) as a traveling companion.

Why bother replacing Ash when all he needs to do is just a similar enough outfit to the newest Gen's protag?

Or just outright copy it with SM.

It's why I dismisively call the male protagonists post Gen 2 "Red in a different hat". Cause they really are that inconsequential.

Even the Gen 2 protag got an anime counterpart with Jimmy for that one Raikou special.

Edited by FKJ10 on Jul 1st 2022 at 10:16:33 AM

The Male protags really got fucked over by refusing the trade up Ash.

Hilariously though, this has recently started to happen to the female protagonists too; with the exception of Serena, none of the ones since Gen IV have been adapted; Hilda, Rosa, Seline, and Gloria all gutted.

A lazy millennial who's good at what he does.

The next games protagonists being bland and the customization feature becoming more important is likely why we'll never see the female lead from the games in the anime ever again.

It's pretty obvious the writers are done with that, they'll either make their own OC characters like Koharu again or whatnot. They probably won't use the rival character or just have her appear in 1 episode like Marnie did.

I mean, the protagonists being kinda bland is par for the course, since they are silent protagonists, but why would the customization feature convince them to not use the female leads anymore?

One Strip! One Strip!

x2

To be fair, Lillie basically fulfills Ash's typical role for the player in the games and they kept her in the anime even if she had to share screentime with the rest of the group. It's really just skipping over Hilda and Gloria that's weird.

Is there an episode of the anime that uses the trope Mistaken for an Imposter?