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My ideal Autobot team would probably be something like Optimus, Bumblebee, Perceptor, Grimlock, and Jetfire (akin to his ROTF incarnation).
My interpretation of Perceptor would probably have difficulty with casual conversation and a very narrow range of topics.
EDIT: Maybe Arcee would be in there too.
Edited by Etheru on Sep 21st 2019 at 6:55:26 AM
Heh you know Grimlock could have taken him alone.
Huh so a show where Optimus is already in the war but he's not a Prime yet?
That certainly be new.
Edited by slimcoder on Sep 21st 2019 at 6:59:18 AM
Optimus and Megatron have fought over Minicons, Energon, and the Allspark, so I thought Primehood is another juicy objective coveted by both sides.
One idea I had for a pre-prime Orion Pax is for him to be the cybertonian equivalent of a nurse or doctor working under Ratchet until he finds the Matrix of Leadership.
As for the origin of the Autobot and Deception faction, they would have both started out as protest movements against Cybertron's caste system before the Deceptions become violent and the Autobots take up arms to stop them.
When it comes to the Aligned Continuity, its greatest legacy will be codifying and laying the modern foundations as to what was the world like before the War for Cybertron and why the Transformers went to war in the first place. To this day, continuities like Cyberverse and IDW 2019 follow this format even if it greatly varies in depictions.
While Beast Wars establish the biology of the Transformers and official terms like Great War and the Decepticon Warship Nemesis, it was still following the old G1 idea that Autobots and Decepticons were fighting each for millions of years because they were programmed differently. Reprogramming Maximal protoforms to become Predacons? And no one on the Maximal side try to redeem Inferno and Quickstrike along with Blackarchnia despite their origins as Maximal protoforms? Then considering the original G1 cartoon, which states that Autobots were originally consumer goods and Decepticons were military hardware created by the Quintessons. And that the Decepticons decided to be evil conquerers due to their military programming. Oh, and you can reprogram Autobots into Decepticons with the Robo-Smasher or the personality destabilizer device. And then you have Simon Furman's original plans for Liege Maximo in the Generation 2 comics, which reveals he subdivided himself selectively to slowly and but surely create his descendants that will become the Decepticons because he was Made of Evil.
This doesn't fly well in modern media, which now emphasizes that evil is a matter of choice and not something physical that makes you automatically bad (aside from some corrupt substances like Dark Energon, but that makes you more of a feral zombie than a Card-Carrying Villain).
And the new major continuities that came in between Beast Wars and the Aligned don't really emphasize how or why the war started despite ancillary media trying to address in some obscure comics. It's always been "the war has been going on for millions of years and this is what they are currently fighting over (insert Mini-Con, Energon, Allspark Cube, etc.)" and you never got the how or why the Decepticons rose into power in the first place. Was a military faction gone rogue? Were the Autobots and Decepticons always two species? Why is Megatron considered to be Optimus's brother in the films? Why is Megatron being tutored by the Fallen? What does the Fallen have to do with the Decepticons? We don't have a clear answer (especially when the answer keeps changing). Even Animated didn't elaborate why Megatron consider himself to be a freedom fighter or why he started the Great War in the first place (in the TV show, that is; I'm not counting the Allspark Almanac). And IDW 2005, while it eventually did elaborate how and why the Great War started, had a messy and confusing start that required the most talented IDW comic writers (who managed to make sense of the IDW movie comic continuity despite every new Bay film retconning the previous film's history) to fix it.
It was the Aligned Continuity that codified and established the basic consistencies of the modern Transformers backstory. Optimus Prime and Megatron once worked together to reform Cybertron's corrupt political system, hence they considering themselves as brothers-in-arms. Optimus was once Orion Pax who worked as data clerk (as opposed to a dock worker). Megatron came from a gladiator background, which was why he was prone to violence. There was a caste system that put the Cybertronians into different classes, which led to inequality and corruption. The Thirteen Primes were considered to be mythical and revered figures in Cybertronian history. And the Autobots and Decepticons were just factions made of various robots, not just consumer bots vs military cons though there are certain bias based on ideologies.
Edited by Shadao on Sep 21st 2019 at 7:38:44 AM
The Autobots include Optimus (not Prime yet), Ironhide, Arcee, Red Alert (female), and Hot Rod. Jetfire and Windblade also join later.
The Decepticons include Megatron, Starscream, Shockwave, Soundwave, Blitzwing, and Moonracer.
The human ally is a college student named Alicia Lin who provides computer support for the Autobots and operates the ground bridge when Red Alert is on field duty. She is paired with Hot Rod, who she nicknames Hot Shot.
Both sides arrive on Earth in order to uncover the secret messages left by Primus, which is rumored to grant the power of a Prime to whoever awakens him. The message is accidentally unscrambled by Alicia, so she's kind of a Living MacGuffin of the series.
Pal, Hasbro should hire you. That's the greatest idea for a TF show I've ever seen since Transformers Animated.
There are things from Animated and, yes, even the first live-action movie, that still persist in the franchise to this day.
Animated's robot proportions and aesthetics can be seen in the character designs of Prime, RID (2015) and Cyberverse. The Cons were also made out to be more bigger and stronger than the Bots. More significantly, several of its original characters (Bulkhead, Lockdown) and concepts (human villains that can give the bots a run for their money) were integrated into later incarnations.
The 2007 movie, for better or worse, made Bumblebee bigger, stronger, and more prominent (and a tad bit overpowered). Megatron gained a new level of brutality.
Characterizations also carried over. Animated's personality for Ratchet enjoyed praise and popularity. Modern Megatrons often drift between being The Brute and being a Magnificent Bastard (if not a combination of both).
Edited by BrightLight on Sep 22nd 2019 at 3:09:23 AM
Bulkhead wasn't created in Animated. He was first used in Tramsformers Energon.
Energon Bulkhead was a completely different character using that name. Bulkhead the Autobot as he is known today was entirely the invention of Animated.
Also, here's something I have been thinking about...
While the Decepticons' origin as a social reform movement turned violent was a great idea, I feel like it is getting old, as it has essentially become the new status quo (even the new IDW continuity is using a variation of the same idea), not to mention nowadays it carries quite a lot of Unfortunate Implication.
I'd like to see a continuity in which the Decepticons are the fascist, oppressive ruling class of Cybertron, with the Autobots as scrappy rebels fighting against them. Bumblebee (2018) seems to imply this, by having characters outright refer to the Autobots as "the Autobot Resistance".
Edited by Nightwire on Sep 22nd 2019 at 12:26:00 PM
The name Bulkhead was used before, but it was one of those names that gets reassigned over and over till there's a memorable character that fits with the name perfectly. Blackout, for example, was the name of a Decepticon Mini-Con for Demolishor in Armada but it wasn't until the 2007 live-action movie that Blackout became a household name. Same thing with Knock Out, who just an obscure Micromaster in G1 until Prime made him into the campy Mad Doctor that we know and love. More details are here:
Edited by Shadao on Sep 22nd 2019 at 12:27:58 PM
That would be an interesting idea.
For that idea of the Decepticons being The Empire and the Autobots being La Résistance, there had to be a time where Cybertron was at a Golden Age, or at least a Gilded Age, to show what the Autobots are fighting for at all. It's the same thing with Star Wars; how did the galaxy ended up this way to begin with? Most classic Great War stories of the Transformers always start off in the middle of the Autobot-Decepticon War, with the Autobots losing. And often, we don't really know why a war started between the two other than Decepticons are power hungry and the Autobots don't like tyrants.
Recall that the opening narration of TV pilot "More than Meets The Eye" said that the Autobots were on the brink of extinction. As well as the fact that the Decepticons pretty much control the Space Bridge and thus Cybertron. They were pretty much The Empire, just an incompetent one.
So really, the question would be how did the war started? How did the Decepticons rose into power? And why are they called Decepticons?
Honestly, if you want to avoid the Unfortunate Implication of a mass movement that rightfully protest against corruption suddenly turning into a violent uprising that devastated the planet, then we better have Megatron climbing to power the legal way. As in, he was elected by the Cybertronians, and then he started changing laws to make himself dictator for life.
Edited by Shadao on Sep 22nd 2019 at 12:46:23 PM
A good detail in the current comic is that part of Megatron's political campaign is the reversal of the Nominus Edict which is a doctrine that self-imposes many restrictions on the Transformer life-style that includes such little details like:
-No further colonies will be established unless by unanimous agreement of the Senate.
-No Energon harvesting will be undertaken in sectors inhabited or claimed by other sentient life, or in sectors adjoining such sectors.
These are obviously made to protect the rights of other sentient species so they won't be conquered by the Transformers yet Megatron wants to reverse the doctrine in its entirety out of a nationalistic belief that its stopping Transformers from reaching their true potential.
Its major red flags that showcase the innate power hunger that truly resides in Megatron even back when he still was just a freedom fighter. Shit Megatron actually gaining ultimate political power & the horrible results of such an election would be an amazing route to take.
Edited by slimcoder on Sep 22nd 2019 at 12:56:19 PM
The thing that was most important about the evolution of the backstory is that I can see the social reform movement as a damn good story in it's own right. Just hearing about how Optimus and Megatron came together excites the imagination. The G1 origin of the Great War was basically "energy shortages, we took sides" and all the focus was on episodic conflicts within. It would be equally interesting to see that the social reform created a Decepticon uprising that toppled the previous Cybertronian Council, and Optimus had to lead the Autobots in a rebellion against THAT in shades of Star Wars.
But yeah, Transformers takes a little bit of everything that came before and reworks it into a new whole. Some names get passed around with no discretion with regards to the character, other times a legacy name just needed an iconic character to go with it. Bumblebee was a largely forgotten G1 character until the movies revamped him into something more interesting than just the Kid-Appeal Character. And it was about the time of the first movie that the mystical elements started to take hold rather than just Sufficiently Advanced Technology. The Allspark particularly was outright "we don't know how it works, it just does." Unicron and Primus were originally just apex machines before being reworked into physical gods of the setting.
That's one way of making Megatron both someone to admire on the surface (namely a campaign of change for greatness) and someone to be concerned about when you actually analyze what he actually said, all while staying true to Megatron's overall character as megalomanic dictator who despises humans. Still, to get the whole oppressive, fascist Empire parallel that Nightwire suggested, Megatron needs to usurp control of the whole government without needing to fire a single shot (at least not in the method that requires conquering each section of Cybertron by violent invasion). The worst kind of dictatorship are always the ones that the people willingly put into power. Just look at Adolf Hitler or Sheev Palpatine.
As for my ideas for a new Transformers series, here's an idea I had for Shockwave:
He was originally a highly respected scientist named Longarm who once proposed to make Cybertronians (and to a later extent, Cybertron) reach their full capacity by tinkering with their CNA, leading to new creations like Combiners, Triple Changers, and even modern Beast Modes. His ideas were deemed to be unethical by his fellow scientists and he was prohibited from carrying out his experiments. To prove his colleagues wrong, Longarm convinced a Constructicon team to undergo an illegal experimentation where they would become a first combiner in recent years. The experiment went horribly wrong as it created the rampaging and uncontrollable Devastator. Caught by the authorities, Longarm was put on trial, deemed guilty by the jury, and was stripped of his scientific credentials. Because Devastator's rampage caused massive amounts of damage (and likely caused massive causalities), Longarm was subjected to Empurata and then imprisoned (I'm not sure where right now). He managed to escape and took the name Shockwave to avoid being identified by the authorities.
Now a wanted fugitive, Shockwave made his way to the city-state of Kaon, where governmental authorities are all but non-existence and the crime rate were at an all time high, and established himself as a morally ambiguous medic in the gladiatorial pits. Here, Shockwave continued his experiments under the guise of "improving the gladiators" and "giving horrific monsters for the gladiators to fight." Despite all of this, Shockwave never forgot his past and cursed his fellow scientists for letting their "weak" emotions get in the way of progress to make Cybertron great. Vowing to correct such "weakness," Shockwave suppressed all of his emotions so he can follow pure logic (though he is still capable of feeling anger). Shockwave continued on with his work in the dark until he heard a certain Cybertronian who preached a rhetorical that fit with Shockwave's train of thought...
Edited by Shadao on Sep 22nd 2019 at 1:34:23 AM
I was catching up on the thread, decided to take a look at that clip of Bumblebee vs Blitzwing from last year's movie. Hot damn. That was easily better-choreographed and better-filmed than anything we ever got in the films where Bay was directly involved, even the very first movie. Blitz even got Skyquaked! Glorious.
That does sound interesting.
Have any media depicted Shockwave as a rival or enemy to Prowl or Perceptor? I see him as an Evil Counterpart of sorts to both.
Perceptor is more of the counterpart to Soundwave, given their minions. Ratchet is probably the closest parallel to Shockwave in terms of being the scientist of the group, or maybe a classic Wheeljack. Prowl at best would be a counterpart to Starscream, given his confrontational personality.
It is interesting that the Decepticons have a slightly more consistent line-up compared to the Autobots, as nearly every incarnation has a Megatron, Soundwave and Starscream across the franchise whereas Optimus is about the only consistent Autobot, with Bumblebee and Ratchet only lately becoming more ubiquitous.
The 2015 Robots in Disguise series was pretty bland but one thing I liked that it introduced was the concept of cybertonian subspecies, which is the origins the the shows version of the dinobots.
Wait, I thought that was Blaster's role? Since when did Perceptor have minions?
That was an oversight, I confused the two.
Oh. I'd like to see more of Blaster in adaptations, though.
I don't necessarily have an idea for the main plot of a Transformers show but I do have some things I'd like to see:
- Jetfire as a retired Autobot air fighter and Jet Storm as his daughter.
- Arcee and Nightbird being rival former members a Cybertronian Ninja School.
- Hot Shot and Rodimus being brothers.
- Barricade being Prowl's former police partner.
Edited by windleopard on Sep 22nd 2019 at 6:33:44 AM
My idea for a Transformers show would take the Autobot/Decepticon conflict and turn it into more of political thriller. Let's say it takes place either before the Great War or during a period of relative peace between the two sides.
The main Autobots would be a plucky peacekeeping force on Cybertron trying to quell the more obvious threats to Cybertron's population. However, as the show would progress, they begin to learn more about the machinations going on up high. The Decepticons are trying to gain complete control of Cybertron, but through subtle means. Changing laws, manipulating voters, taking advantage of disasters to declare emergency powers, etc. There would be Decepticons that use violence to get what they want, but they'd be declared rogue extremists by the ruling body.
And the Autobot High Command wouldn't be squeaky clean. They know what would happen if the Decepticons gain more control, and will stop at nothing to prevent that from happening. Mass propaganda, censorship, unfair trials and stripping rights from their citizens in the name of security. The main Autobots would be largely unaware of this until it starts affecting them personally.
It be a different way to portray the conflict (I haven't read the IDW comics, so if they go this route, I wouldn't know), and make it a little more grey. In Beast Wars, there were implications that this was how the Maximal/Predacon conflict was going back on Cybertron, but we only saw glimpses of it. The Tripredacus Council believing Megatron's approach would ruin their more subtle schemes, the Maximal High Command creating Rampage and then attempting to cover it up after he killed an entire colony, implications that the Maximals withhold information about the Great War or Earth from the general public, etc.
Edited by chasemaddigan on Sep 22nd 2019 at 10:18:43 AM
Actually, alot of the stuff you mentioned about the Deceptions (and Autobots to a lesser extent) is going on in the IDW reboot comic. The cons aren't the ruling faction on Cybertron but they are actually doing many of the things you suggested.
Today I saw the Transformers: Cyberverse episodes "Infinite Vendetta" and "I Am the Allspark"...
Sky-Byte (nah, it's without the hyphen even in the credits) is here! And also, wow, did Starscream killed the Seekers loyal to him and also nearly killed the Autobots and the Decepticons?!
On today's episode of Transformers: Cyberverse, "The Visitor", Bumblebee searches for answers about the mysterious creature from the moon. Will he do it? Also, Grimlock goes crazy fast after drinking Wheeljack's hyperfuel.
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How well does it match the trope?