A Transformers Thread

Not really but Hasbro is in big "back to basics" mood lately. So I'd not expect a show where Optimus is a troubled leader juggling the hard decision and more the usual robot Jesus spouting wisdom who dies and returns.

Ironic, because in G1, Optimus was a troubled leader juggling hard decisions instead of a destined above-all messiah.

It's as if Hasbro themselves have forgotten what their true basic template for Optimus was, and how that characterization was responsible for Prime's huge appeal.

Not making him a Robo-God made incarnate.

Edited by BrightLight on Feb 27th 2019 at 8:15:24 AM

Bring back Autobots playing basketball!

I would say that WFC sounds like a prequel, so maybe we can avoid that.

In the Marvel comic maybe. In the cartoon, not so much. He still was more relatable as he'd joke around, something his modern incarnations almost never do. But "Troubled and Juggling hard Decision". LOL no.

I imagine if you were one of the leaders in the civil war that left your home planet dead and your race on the brink of extinction you probably wouldn't be a very light hearted person either.

I never said there wasn't a reason for it.

By the time the movie comes about, he very definitely is juggling hard decisions and is troubled.

The original series was not a regular commander making tough decisions, he was a pretty standard cartoon heroic figure, although Peter Cullens' performance made him a bit more emotional than normal. Once the movie introduced the Matrix of Leadership and the concept of a Prime being The Chosen One, removing it becomes problematic. The closest they came was Transformers Animated, and there Optimus was a largely ineffectual leader upstaged by just about everyone else (even his climactic victory against Megatron came from extensive external upgrades and wielding a powerful weapon, rather than genuinely rising to the challenge).

If anything, the movies have shown more of a conflicted Optimus than just about all others. Every film he has to juggle the needs of his race with what is best for humanity, while also showing that he cannot treat the Decepticons with kid gloves.

Correct. Of course the movies decided to balance that with a healthy does of saw-esque psychopathy and also being garbage. Can't get everything.

By the time the movie comes about, he very definitely is juggling hard decisions and is troubled.

I think the only time he comes close to that is handing out the matrix as he's dying.

Heck, Rodimus is more troubled than Optimus ever is, as he constantly second guess himself, doubts his ability, and has a clear inferiority complex when compared with Optimus. But Optimus, troubled or juggling hard decisions? LOL No. The hardest is "How do we solve the evil plot of the week". Which like said, is standard cartoon heroic leader fare.

TF!Prime sort of has Optimus imply he's carrying a lot of grief over Cybertron's fall and his role in it, but it's very subdued and it also still plays strong into "Our Lord And Savior Optimus Prime" (He literally finishes the series by dying for everyone's sins)

Edited by Ghilz on Feb 27th 2019 at 9:54:31 AM

I could see an incarnation of Optimus who masks his grief over the fall of Cybertron and the state of his species with a more upbeat G1-esque demeanor.

Animated Optimus had allies who were inspired to follow him through loyalty, which is ultimately what both Megatron and Ultra Magnus lacked. That's the "rising to the challenge" part - albeit it's not physical, but rather psychological. Megatron is beaten because his second in command betrays him, while Optimus' second in command pulls a Heroic Sacrifice.

"Megatron must be stopped. No matter the cost."

One could argue that moment is when G1 Prime knew a hard decision would have to be made. But yeah, outside of the movie, the G1 cartoon as a whole doesn't admittedly have that much depth to it.

And that death at the end of Prime's finale was forced. The writers deliberately ignored the Star Saber relic which could've totally evened the odds and avoid Optimus needing to make a sacrifice.

In light of the brand-new Transformers comic series coming tomorrow, I went and made a new page for it just now.

Contribute whenever you guys can. (As soon as we learn more about it, that is.)

Edited by TargetmasterJoe on Mar 13th 2019 at 6:37:57 AM

You know, I always wonder:

What does Con exactly mean in Cybertron? There are Predacons, Insecticons, Constructicons, etc.

Out-of-Universe, it's clearly an easy means to market bad guys and good guys (Cons bad; Bots good) but since Predacons, Insecticons, and Constructicons have come to mean larger sub-groups that are not necessarily prone to Decepticon tendencies, what would the word Con mean In-Universe?

I honestly wouldn't know. Maybe it's because it sounds cool.

Well, the definitions of the word "Con" (that does not mean deceiving, disadvantage, or convict) are:

"study attentively or learn by heart (a piece of writing)." (it's now archaic, btw)

"a convention, especially one for science fiction enthusiasts." (Abbreviation of Convention)

"direct the steering of (a ship)."

"variant spelling of com- assimilated before c, d, f, g, j, n, q, s, t, v, and sometimes before vowels"

Which leads to "Com" that means:

"with; together; jointly; altogether."

Well, take your pick of the Cybertronian definition of "Con."

Edited by Shadao on Mar 13th 2019 at 11:35:43 AM

Maybe a conclave of similar funtionality, then taken on as a unifying identity?

Construction Conclave - Constructicons
Predator Conclave - Predacons
Insect Conclave - Insecticons
Combat Conclave - Combaticons

Subgroups fit this idea better than the Decepticons as a whole.
Though if you believe "Megatron was a noble freedom fighter who was corrupted by power" angle, then an argument could be made that the name was taken as an ironic jab at the corrupt Autobot bureaucracy. "If we cannot gain freedom through the corrupt laws, then we will gain it through deception. Join the Deception Conclave, become a free Decepticon!".

This is all pure fan-wank, of course.

Well, that's sort of how the Decepticons got their name in Transformers: Prime, at least according to Megatron. Either that or he was lying, like he was pulling a "deception" of some kind..

Edited by chasemaddigan on Mar 13th 2019 at 4:45:35 AM

But like, that's only shifted the question. "From what does "Con" mean" to "What does "Combat Conclave" mean?"

Like, do the Combaticons represent every other fighting cybetronian? Do they gather to vote for the Combat Pope?

Do they stop being a conclave when they leave?

Are the Duocon a conclave of two, or just a conclave who debates all topics pertaining to the number two?

Why aren't the Seekers a conclave?

Furthermore, the Predator Conclave is composed of 2 Predators, 2 Preys, and 1 Scavenger.

In IDW, the "Decept" part cames from the opening passage of Megatron's first book "You are being Deceived", which was a critic of the corrupt cybertronian society of the time.

It's also interesting that Megatron didn't pick the name, his followers did. He was in fact unaware they existed for the longest time as he was a miner in a lunar mine.

Edited by Ghilz on Mar 13th 2019 at 6:30:50 AM

Ah yes, the name explanation that's basically "Those dreaded galactic war criminals, the Sheeple".

Larry DiTillio, one of the main writers and creators of Beast Wars, has passed away, according to Babylon 5 creator JMS

Larry was responsible for a lot of our 80s/90s cartoons memories, RIP to him.

For sure. There goes a guy who contributed to a lot of shows of my childhood. RIP Larry.

How, old was he? Wait, I'm on the internet. Let me just look it up...

He was 79.

Edited by Buzzinator on Mar 17th 2019 at 1:53:13 PM

Honestly, that's older than I thought. I had thought that he was in his sixties. It's still a sad thing that he died, though.