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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#248501: Feb 19th 2021 at 8:57:22 AM

Tbf films are we're most of us ep cms which is why the page is longer. It's easier to watch a 2 hour film then play a several hour game/ read a book , etc.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
papyru30 from Colorado for summer break Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
#248502: Feb 19th 2021 at 9:23:11 AM

So I found this write up and simply put, I think it's a bit of an awkward read.

  • Bulletproof Monk: Strucker is a staunch Nazi who seems to extend his racial prejudices to everyone who isn't a White Anglo-Saxon Protestant later in the film. He is ruthless in his goal for world domination, perhaps epitomized early in the film where he slaughters a temple-full of Tibetan monks, who refuse to defend themselves. He also has the informant who'd been helping him brutally executed and threatens his own granddaughter when she continues to fail him. He has no redeeming qualities and no goals beyond orchestrating a Holocaust Times Ten. This all might just be in order to make the thief protagonist look a bit more amiable.

The only thing stopping me from rewriting it myself is that I can't find anything that explains what his actual genocidal plan is. Could someone who's familiar with the movie help with this please?

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#248503: Feb 19th 2021 at 9:37:18 AM

Holocaust times 10 just sounds weird to put in an entry. That sounds like a variation of the 9/11 times 100 meme.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#248504: Feb 19th 2021 at 10:15:14 AM

Gotta concur with Scraggle on Sky's duo... films were lighter back then but we had Rotwang running around (loved one or no, he was one bad dude), Harry Lime was selling boatloads of fake penicillin and trying to commit a handful of murders for self interest and no redeeming qualities will net you a spot on Hate Sink but not Complete Monster, even in 1944.

Man a lot of that entry is weird... "He's not a Nazi, he's even more bigoted. He doesn't give another crack at the Holocaust... he wants the Super Holocaust!" Also... why do I care if he's there to make the protag look better or not?

Edited by 43110 on Feb 19th 2021 at 1:17:21 PM

Keet96 Good Hunter from Anor Londo Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: He makes me feel like I have a heart
Good Hunter
#248505: Feb 19th 2021 at 10:22:36 AM

Here's my first writeup for Jonah Magnus:

The Magnus Archives: Jonah Magnus is the founder and head of the Magnus institute, having stolen several of his worker's bodies to survive for centuries. Attempting to bring about the end of the world in order to rule over the remains as an avatar for the Eye, Magnus conducts a ritual which kills his friend. Once that fails, he realises that the reason the rituals don't work is because the Fears are too interconnected to destroy the world alone, and so he manipulates Jonathan Simms into making contact with all of the Fears and uses him to bring about the apocalypse against his will. Along the way, he murders anyone who gets too close to the truth and tells his employees that if they choose to leave or try to hurt him, they will all die horribly, which may be a lie. This, along with him using her father's horrible death to taunt her, leads to Melanie King stabbing her own eyes out in an attempt to escape him. Cruel, smug and willing to stoop to any depth to preserve his own life and power, Magnus manages to stand out in a setting full of evil gods, monsters and other Avatars.

You can check out any time you like but you can never leave.
Atlantis1930 Since: May, 2012
#248506: Feb 19th 2021 at 10:30:41 AM

[tup] Reynolds, Wadkins and Magnus (apologies if I've missed anyone).

[tdown] Entity, Sydney, the Protagonist, and Cleeve.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#248507: Feb 19th 2021 at 10:33:15 AM

[up][up] Please add here.

Also, you need to add Podcast/ before the title: Podcast/TheMagnusArchives=The Magnus Archives

Keet96 Good Hunter from Anor Londo Since: Aug, 2013 Relationship Status: He makes me feel like I have a heart
Good Hunter
#248508: Feb 19th 2021 at 10:35:10 AM

@ACW Thank you

You can check out any time you like but you can never leave.
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#248509: Feb 19th 2021 at 11:22:28 AM

Also it's funny your note on films there mir. Absolutely true here but on MB our biggest pages are video games followed by animanga. That said, who knows what that trope'll look like once it's cleanup thread is a decade old!

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Enid Sinclair
#248510: Feb 19th 2021 at 11:31:20 AM

No to Entity, Sydney, the Protagonist, and Cleeve.

Yes to Wadkins and Magnus.

Hey guys I am just stopping by to let you guys know my surgery went fine. Just don't expect me to be here much for the upcoming weeks.

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#248511: Feb 19th 2021 at 12:08:49 PM

Re: Bulletproof Monk. Who effortposted him? Barring that, who else has seen the film? Maybe it would be worthwhile giving him an actual effortpost.

All the best, Bull.

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#248512: Feb 19th 2021 at 12:20:33 PM

As you just brought this up to me and I'm off work today, I wouldn't mind checking it out in a bit. Is anyone able to find an actual EP or would we prefer I do one in addition to a rewrite? Literally all I get searching it is just someone rewriting it to the current version.

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#248513: Feb 19th 2021 at 12:23:52 PM

He was grandfathered in.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
papyru30 from Colorado for summer break Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
#248514: Feb 19th 2021 at 12:26:07 PM

Looks like the guy was put up in the early days of the thread here without an effortpost (I ctrl+Fed his name searching through like 30 pages before and after the linked one and found nothing). I'll watch the movie either today or tomorrow and give him a proper EP.

Edited by papyru30 on Feb 19th 2021 at 1:26:59 PM

DukeNukem4ever Since: Jan, 2017
#248515: Feb 19th 2021 at 12:39:50 PM

I found a CM entry on YMMV/Strife:

  • The Entity is a being who infects planets with a virus that turns people into its slaves, and then devour the life from the planet when it's done. The game starts with a comet, the Entity's spaceship, crashing into the game's unnamed planet, and also releasing a deadly virus, killing millions, with the survivors suffering a Fate Worse than Death. Said infected people founded their own evil theocracy known as The Order, who enslave and terrorize the rest of the planet. Fairly early on, once "Strifeguy" beats The Programmer, Strifeguy finds a piece of the Sigil, which Macil explains is a superweapon that is regarded as holy by the Order and that you five other pieces must be found. The game has Multiple Endings; if Strifeguy makes the wrong choice, Blackbird was killed at some point and the Entity has been impersonating her ever since. And even if Strifeguy kills the Entity, it will still take decades to cure the plague, if humanity survives at all.

Even though I do agree the Entity counts (and I've read the effortpost too), this entry feels a bit rushed. Therefore, I propose a better rewrite:

Edited by DukeNukem4ever on Feb 19th 2021 at 12:43:32 PM

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#248516: Feb 19th 2021 at 12:49:44 PM

A quote suggestion since he's going up now.

"Batman has always been a reactionary idea. He was born in response to those gunshots in the alley. And just as he is a reaction, so too are the twisted Batmen of the dark. Even the most dominant is still a reaction to some fear that has shaped him, built him into a newer, crueller incarnation, perfectly designed to overcome it. Now, understand this, I know that I am not a Batman of any kind. Not a Batman Who Laughs, not a Batmanhattan, not even a culmination of all dark Batmen. I am more. And to be more, I must not be a reaction. I must be the thing that creates the reaction. I will be the bullet. The multiverse will be the dark alley. And its worlds will fall like pearls before me."

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#248517: Feb 19th 2021 at 1:05:29 PM

What the fuck is a "Batmanhattan" supposed to be?

Anyway—sure to the quote.

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#248519: Feb 19th 2021 at 1:08:16 PM

Batman with Dr Manhattan's powers

Edit : [nja]

Edited by miraculous on Feb 19th 2021 at 1:08:31 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#248520: Feb 19th 2021 at 1:10:52 PM

Well that just sounds fucking sweet and way too awesome to be a crime, no to the quote...

Jk yes!

STARCRUSHER99 The Moron from one of my unhealthy obsessions (Captain) Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
The Moron
#248521: Feb 19th 2021 at 1:12:53 PM

Yes to the TBWL quote and the Entity rewrite

papyru30 from Colorado for summer break Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
#248522: Feb 19th 2021 at 1:19:31 PM

that is an awesome quote, yes there

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#248523: Feb 19th 2021 at 1:23:44 PM

Yes to the quote.

Rewrite needs to go to the Drafts.

Michealthehero21 Since: Jan, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#248524: Feb 19th 2021 at 3:08:44 PM

[tup] to the Batman Who Laughs quote.

DrUnknown Since: May, 2020
#248525: Feb 19th 2021 at 4:00:29 PM

[tup] to the Entity rewrite and the Batman Who Laughs quote.

@Bullman: Good to see that the surgery went smoothly. Take as long as you need.


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