During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Hey ya'll, bringing your attention to this ATT thread about a banned troper
in case you want to pitch in, since it's about CM thread shenanigans and ya'll might know what's what.
@ACW: Due to the format of the series, being patient interviews, we don't really see Crane torment people, but he's in the asylum for his crimes, and his torment of Arkham sets a pattern. As for Croc and Black Mask, no dice. Croc has genuine, agency-compromising insanity, and Black Mask feels remorse when he accidentally exposes Batman's Secret Identity becaise they were childhood friends.
That said, anybody else wanna vote
?
Fair enough, I was just being careful. Here we go:
What is the work?
Jessica Jones: Playing with Fire
is an audio drama from Serial Box, with the story usually being read by one actor. Jessica Jones is still tormented by memories of Kilgrave and is seeing a therapist, who advises she take an easy case next time and Jessica thinks she has one, a conservative father drove off his super-powered son Jamie by demanding he go to repression therapy to deal with his powers, the son leaves home and goes to New York instead. After 2 years of alienation, Jamie invites his father to NYC to reunite, but Jamie doesn't meet this father at NYC and the father hires Jessica to see what happened to him, that should be an easy case....
Who is Selene Gallio? What has she done?
Selene Gallio, an immortal energy vampire, under the name Diane Galway sets up a commune called Nova Naledi, for young people with minor superpowers to create works of art, but really it's a cult/hunting ground, where Selene drains them of their energy, a little bit at a time to ensure no one asks questions and she can keep on feeding on her followers.
After having a fallout with his conservative father, a young man with fire powers named Jamie Greene joins Nova Naledi. One day Jamie invites his friend Brenden to join Nova Naledi, who pretended to have powers but has nothing and Selene goes overboard and murders them both by draining too much energy from them. She puts Brenden's body in a freezer and pumps Jamie's body full of drugs and dumps it at an overpass, trying to pass it off as an OD.
Jessica doesn't buy that story and works to discover the truth, she investigates the place Jamie works, the Hellfire Club, and gets into a couple of fights with the owner, Sebastian Shaw. Jessica gets arrested for breaking into the Hellfire club and on the release is banned from going there. So she investigates Nova Naledi instead. Also, Shaw and some of his goons try to kill Jessica when she gets too close.
Jessica finds Diane Galway's home address and she asks Galway some questions, when Shaw enters the house, calling Galway babe and Jessica discovers they are lovers. Selene and Shaw defeat Jessica and lock her in the basement, where Selene tortures her by feeding on her. Selene also mentally tortures her by making her imagine she is in her therapist's office and the therapist is calling her worthless and broken and then having Jessica herself call Jessica worthless and broken. However one of one of Galway's followers Sam shows up to warn her that Jessica is coming and Sam barged in at the wrong time, so Selene captures Sam as well and puts Sam in the basement to be drained with Jessica.
Anyway, eventually Jessica and Sam escape, Sam finds evidence that Diane is really Selene, an immortal vampire active since the 30s at least and she has been pulling stuff like for decades, she ran an orphanage in South Africa under a different name, that mysteriously burned down and almost everyone died.
With evidence of Selene's crimes, Selene flees, taking all her followers from Nova Naledi with her, to a retreat upstate. But first, she sends Shaw to kill Jessica, Sam, and any other witnesses, Sam, Jessica, and Luke Cage defeat Shaw and Jessica finds Selene's upstate compound.
Jessica and Sam confront Selene, where she has all her followers in a trance and they are all her puppets, with Selene planning to drain them all to death. Selene has her followers attack Jessica and Sam, having a telepathic follower mentally torture Jessica again. Selene almost killing Sam snaps the other followers out of it. Jessica defeats Selene and the cops arrive. But Selene almost immediately kills the cops guarding her and escapes, the only bright spot is Matt Murdock manages to freeze most of Selene's assets, denying her wealth and some of it goes to her former followers.
Is she heinous by the standards of the story?
Well, there are other Marvel audio dramas on this site, like one where Black Panther fights zombies, I do not know how connected these dramas are. They are like 10 bucks each.
But this is a more offbeat version of Selene, she doesn't have some apocalyptic scheme as other versions do, but she killed at least 2 people and planned to kill all her followers (I assume it would be a couple dozen of followers ) and mentally tortured Jessica a couple of times and killed some cops guarding her. It also is stated she has pulled off similar schemes several times over the decades, so it fits a pattern.
Does she have a Freudian Excuse or other redeeming qualities?
So there is a scene in the middle of the story, where Jessica brings up Jamie, Selene has a guilty look on her face and says his death was an accident.
But by the end of the story, she is in berserker supervillain mode, planning to kill all her followers and when Sam calls her out, she talks about the strong devouring the weak and New York eating young people alive, so she seems to have gotten over her remorse pretty quick. She has also done similar things in the past.
Besides that, nothing, she doesn't care about Shaw and there is no evidence she has to do this feeding to survive.
Final Verdict?
Another keep for the sinister Selene.
Edited by Overlord on Jan 27th 2021 at 6:26:36 AM
I am pretty sure it's official. I saw Marvel trademarks on that page. Serial Box has several audio dramas from Marvel, DC and Doctor Who. The audio drama is also read by professional actor Fryda Wolff, so I think it's pretty legit, all things considered.
Those are in addition to the Marvel podcasts from Stitcher. There were two keeps from the Wolverine podcast, but no keeps in the Marvels podcast, where the closest thing to a villain was a Jerkass senator who wanted to draft mutants into the Vietnam war, but the last episode made that senator seem far more sinister, murdering his sectary for seeing something she shouldn't have, so if Marvels gets a second season that guy could count.
Actually, Mastermind from the Wolverine podcast had a similar plot to Selene in this podcast, in terms of setting up a cult-like group of followers and trying to kill them off when they deem it ''necessary''.
Edited by Overlord on Jan 27th 2021 at 7:34:21 AM
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There was a series of Marvel Novels called the X-Men: The Legacy Quest trilogy, the second book featured Selene as the main villain, up to her usual tricks.
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Monster/MarvelLiterature
So she has appeared as a monster in 4 different formats.
- Batman audio series Arkham Patient Sessions: The Scarecrow, real name Jonathan Crane, is a Psycho Psychologist obsessed with causing fwar in the masses. Inventing a fear gas, Crane proceeds to terrorise the people of Gotham City with hallucinations of their worst fears, committing murders along the way. When Batman captures Scarecrow, he spends his days psychologically tormenting the staff, including convincong an orderly to kill himself, while periodically fear-gassing people when he escapes. After fellow supervillain Dr. Death causes a mass breakout in Arkham Asylum, the Scarecrow kidnaps asulum director Jeremiah Arkham and locks him in the asylum's basement in order to drive him insane. Crane spends an extended amount of time drugging and torturing Arkham until he finally breaks, leading to his suicide.
Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button
“obsessed with causing fwar”
Oh no, not fwar! Anything but That!
One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.

Is this effort post or are we just discussing and ironing some stuff out first before Overlord does it ?
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."