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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#24451: Apr 21st 2014 at 7:48:25 AM

As usual, [tdown][tdown][tdown] to all Pony darkfic.

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#24452: Apr 21st 2014 at 7:49:58 AM

Not just that, but rape by itself is insufficient to merit Complete Monster status. Much like murder, it's too common a crime and therefore fails the "outstanding" criterion.

edited 21st Apr '14 7:50:43 AM by Fighteer

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
SeptimusHeap from Switzerland (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Mu
#24453: Apr 21st 2014 at 7:50:14 AM

That seems not very outstanding, to be honest.

"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Furienna from Örnsköldsvik, Sweden Since: Nov, 2013
#24454: Apr 21st 2014 at 7:50:23 AM

"I'm sorry but when I hear 'rape' and 'My little Pony' together, I am very disinclined to give it the time of day."

I know, but I guess fanfics can be Darker and Edgier than the original.

I later saw that two other people had commented on this guy. Sorry. And just like I thought, it seems like he won't qualify.

edited 21st Apr '14 7:53:09 AM by Furienna

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#24455: Apr 21st 2014 at 8:51:48 AM

I searched, and couldn't find anything about Paracelsus. In all honesty, from the description, he doesn't seem TOO bad (and a side note, GILES as a Complete Monster???).

edited 21st Apr '14 8:52:37 AM by ACW

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#24457: Apr 21st 2014 at 9:07:11 AM

He killed an entire village and a ton of people in the hospital to become immortal. Plus attempted homicide on his family.

I think he passes the test

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#24458: Apr 21st 2014 at 9:09:55 AM

[up]I take back my objection (I'll assume the village thing was done via flashback?).
[up][up]Giles an ASSASSIN?

HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#24459: Apr 21st 2014 at 9:41:45 AM

[up] Yup. Repo is an intentionally over-the-top horror musical in the vein of Rocky Horror about the world organ shortage getting so bad the government authorizes "organ repossession," or taking the organs of living people to meet the demand (in other words, killing them). Anthony Head plays Dr. Wallace, one of the people responsible for the "collection." He's not a CM though due to a Morality Pet daughter.

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#24460: Apr 21st 2014 at 10:41:10 AM

The villain, Rotti Largo, comes closest, I'd say.

HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#24461: Apr 21st 2014 at 11:14:30 AM

[up] I'd argue Shilo, Nathan's daughter, counts as a Morality Pet for Rotti, too. Since his ex was Nathan's wife, he seems to wish that Shilo was his, which is the closest thing to a redeeming trait he has.

TVRulezAgain Since: Sep, 2011
#24462: Apr 21st 2014 at 11:15:28 AM

ReGenesis

  • Vascily Popov, once we find out that not only did he synthesize the Miranda virus and dupe Daisy into spreading it as far and wide as possible, but he also dug up the body David got his Spanish Flu sample from and left it in the open so that birds could spread the virus and start an epidemic.

Anyone familiar with this show?

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#24463: Apr 21st 2014 at 11:23:46 AM

[up]Not at all, but seems the guy COULD be a qualifier. PM the Troper who added it.

[nja]BTW Lighty, I slightly modified your Fable rewrites.

edited 21st Apr '14 11:38:17 AM by ACW

TVRulezAgain Since: Sep, 2011
#24464: Apr 21st 2014 at 11:47:59 AM

The history doesn't show who added it.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#24465: Apr 21st 2014 at 11:57:43 AM

I was able to at least find who edited it; I PMd him.

[nja]BTW, for Star Wars, some of the Comics entries don't have what comics they're from.

[nja]Say, for TV, any way to condense some of the Wall of Text entries? Jimmy's probably okay if he can't be narrowed.

  • Speaking of Jimmy, should we mention that he doesn't really love his family and only said so to taunt Chibs?

Also:

* Nikita:
  • Percy, the head of Division, at first seemed like an Affably Evil character who was Only in It for the Money, working for Corrupt Corporate Executives and criminal organizations just as easily as for the government. However, as the series progressed, we've seen just how far he'll sink to achieve his goals, including murdering the loved ones of his own agents to keep them loyal. Perhaps the most shocking example of this was the revelation that the terrorist who killed Michael's family was, in fact, a Division agent who did so on Percy's orders so that Kazim Tariq could be Percy's mole in al-Qa'ida. When Kazim accidentally killed Michael's family instead, Percy recruited Michael with the promise of getting even.
  • Amanda is also a Complete Monster and a Manipulative Bitch who constantly and ruthlessly tricks people into doing what she wants and earning their loyalty (or at least their fear; she's quite Machiavellian). But more to the point, she's the resident Torture Technician and is quite skilled at her job, using everything from electrocutions to breaking bones to threatening lobotomies in order to get information out of her victims — and it's quite clear she enjoys doing it. She's the one person Nikita is afraid of.
Enough detail, esp. for Amanda?

edited 21st Apr '14 4:56:30 PM by ACW

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#24466: Apr 21st 2014 at 5:51:02 PM

Well, apparently, the Lich has been turned into a human child in the latest episode of Adventure Time. His mind was also rebooted as well. This may mean nothing, but I just thought I should bring this detail up.

despoa Since: Aug, 2012
#24467: Apr 21st 2014 at 6:00:25 PM

Could be another thing like rebooted Smallville Brainiac. So the Lich still stays.

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#24468: Apr 21st 2014 at 6:05:46 PM

I know, that's why I stated that it probably didn't matter overall.

AnewMan A total has-been. Since: Apr, 2013 Relationship Status: Don't hug me; I'm scared
A total has-been.
#24469: Apr 21st 2014 at 6:52:18 PM

Also, we don't know for sure if this is really it for the Lich anyway.

Btw, I saw that Kuro is now an example on the One Piece page, but he's still mentioned as a non-example on the paragraph right above his entry. just bugs me

edited 21st Apr '14 6:52:28 PM by AnewMan

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#24470: Apr 21st 2014 at 8:17:35 PM

Yeah, weshould fix that...gonna propose Bejo soon.

toonyloon Since: Jul, 2011
#24471: Apr 21st 2014 at 10:19:25 PM

I think that the Lich should get his entry updated to include the actions he committed during the season 6 premiere.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#24472: Apr 22nd 2014 at 12:12:18 AM

[up][up]This Bejo? BTW, Both Raids are fucking AWESOME cool

[nja]I'll request The Good Wife example be cut around noonish EST today unless somebody makes a compelling case for him.

[nja]I'll try and work on Nikita and the Wall of Text entries this weekend maybe. [nja]Actually, TV Rulez, looks like you worked on the Nikita entries. Any way to expand?

edited 22nd Apr '14 6:55:44 AM by ACW

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#24473: Apr 22nd 2014 at 7:24:22 AM

Tweaked O'Phelan:

** James “Jimmy O” O'Phelan from is a member of the True IRA, an Irish terrorist organization and criminal syndicate involved in gun running with the gangs in California. O'Phelan previously ran current SAMCRO member Chibs out of the IRA years before marrying Chibs’s his wife Fiona and adopting Chibs’s daughter Kerrianne. When he tries to mend the business relation with SAMCRO he meets with Chibs again, gloats that he took what was his, and threatens to dump Fiona and marry Kerrianne next because he says Fiona has become too old. Enraged, Chibs gives him up to the authorities, and O'Phelan flees back to Ireland. He withholds information about Jax's kidnapped baby son Abel to maintain the good dealings with SAMCRO. He goes rogue when the IRA intends to demote him for his failure in the States, and plans to destroy SoA's Belfast chapter to take over the IRA himself. He tries to have SAMCRO killed in an explosion in which many Belfast members die, and Fiona and Kerrianne have to be put under IRA protection because he poses a threat to their safety. He kills an IRA member trying to take them back and tortures and executes another one to find Abel, murders the adoptive family Abel was placed with, takes Abel hostage to ensure his escape to the States, and then exchanges him for another hostage whom he later kills. He tries to escape to South America through the Russian mob, but is double crossed and given up to SAMCRO, who kill him. Unlike the other gang members in the show, he has no real loved ones note  or shows remorse for any of his crimes, and there seems to be no point behind his actions beyond power, cruelty, and trying to save his own hide.

TVRulezAgain Since: Sep, 2011
AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#24475: Apr 22nd 2014 at 10:28:30 AM

On the Adventure Time Main Characters page, someone added the Generic Doomsday Villain trope under the Lich's article. Should I remove it?


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