During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
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back when I first joined this thread, I wanted to do Debbie Jelinsky before experience kicked in and I realized that’s a dumb idea, so you’re not alone
I have this question that I’ve been thinking about: On DC Universe and Marvel Universe, should we link to works that don’t fit with Batman, Spider-Man, etc.?
For example the main DC Universe page would include a link to Film C To E (DC Extended Universe), Film O To S (Swamp Thing), Live-Action TV: P to Z (Titansverse), Arrowverse, DC Literature, DC Video Games, & DC Animation
Edited by nwotyzal on Jan 13th 2021 at 12:23:01 PM
Years ago, I had the exact same initial thought about Debbie, thinking heinousness wasn’t an issue and not realizing tone was.
Plenty of characters you at first think easily fit this, only to find out they actually don’t.
I mean it’s tricky since there’s so much of each really big-named superhero. I’m probably not the person to ask.
Edited by futuremoviewriter on Jan 13th 2021 at 12:28:00 PM
Marvel film villains (That aren’t from the MCU) and the Marvel film novelizations should be merged together. There’s enough C Ms to warrant a separate page.
Edited by Tvtropesfan234 on Jan 13th 2021 at 12:29:05 PM
Maybe, but how many CMs can a franchise get it's own page? So far, Nasuverse has seven and Heavy Object has six.
"I SHALL UNIFY THE WORLD! FROM ALPHA TO OMEGA... BOW DOWN TO ME!!!"Seven or eight usually, but it's a case by case basis thing. Like we don't have a Stargate page because there's still allot of expanded universe stuff we haven't got to yet.
I think we decided that it was pointless to make a Marvel Films page. Since that is done no where else on the site.
Edited by Bullman on Jan 13th 2021 at 2:43:42 PM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup threadYeah I have asked about allot of pages myself. And learned that to mostly use the search for the reason why. I have mostly decided to leave the page deciding to the more seasoned tropers.
Edited by Bullman on Jan 13th 2021 at 3:02:21 AM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup threadI'm sure the Nasuverse probably has more candidates out their. Like if somone wants to look into them sure (I did hear that Fate Grand Order Zouken Matou was suggested once since hes an alternate self but dont know what happened?)
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."It wasn’t about making a page for it, I was saying something like
- Examples from the Titansverse can be found here
Unless we did discuss this in the past.
Edited by nwotyzal on Jan 13th 2021 at 1:03:21 AM
nwot: Yeah that sounds like a good idea to me.
Edited by Bullman on Jan 13th 2021 at 3:13:48 AM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup threadThe thing is making a page takes a lot of effort and attention to detail to make sure everything's properly moved. I get wanting one but who actually offers to help ACW make sure wicks are correct, shit's in the right place, etc. Like... I wanted one for Inuyasha since the YMMV page was gonna have a seven-person tree so I took it upon myself to make it and he basically just had to request the lock. If a new page really is warranted, assist, it's not that hard. As for Nasuverse if we do want one I've got an MB one just for ease of formatting Adam.
Btw the entry for Peter Foley of Copycat
has this as its start:
When the infamous Serial Killer Daryll Lee Cullum coerced Peter Foley to kill his arch-nemesis, Dr. Helen Hudson, Foley decided to use the opportunity to make himself a "legend."
Could we rewrite that a bit. Its written in an odd manner that I thought Cullum was the candidate.
Edited by miraculous on Jan 13th 2021 at 2:17:14 AM
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."Yeah... don't start an entry with someone else's name... it's obviously awkward and confusing. In fact, fixing up two on which I dropped the ball. On Preacher. From:
- Jesse's zealous grandmother, Marie L'Angelle, views herself an agent of God. Seeing her daughter Christina as nothing but a way to breed a strong male preacher, when Christina runs away and gives birth to Jesse, Marie forces the family to stay on her estate, under her abusive control. Having Christina's husband murdered and eventually trying the same with Christina herself, Marie locks Jesse in an airtight coffin under a lake for weeks at a time, hoping to break him and make him accept God. Capturing Jesse years later, Marie has her servants kill Jesse's girlfriend Tulip and once again tries to break him into worshipping her and her religion.
- Marie's enforcer, Jody, is a sadistic bully of a man. Murdering Jesse's father in front of him, Jody sneers when the young boy bursts into tears. Nailing Jesse's dog's head to a post for humping his leg, Jody savagely beats Jesse for attacking him, making him beg while twisting his arm so much the bone snaps out. When he recaptures Jesse and Tulip for Marie, Jody happily shoots and kills Tulip. In a rematch with Jesse, Jody tries to make Jesse suffer as much as possible, and when fatally wounded by Jesse, he feels nothing but pride as his abuses turned Jesse into a killer.
To:
- Marie L'Angelle, Jesse's zealous grandmother, views herself an agent of God. Seeing her daughter Christina as nothing but a way to breed a strong male preacher, when Christina runs away and gives birth to Jesse, Marie forces the family to stay on her estate, under her abusive control. Having Christina's husband murdered and eventually trying the same with Christina herself, Marie locks Jesse in an airtight coffin under a lake for weeks at a time, hoping to break him and make him accept God. Capturing Jesse years later, Marie has her servants kill Jesse's girlfriend Tulip and once again tries to break him into worshipping her and her religion.
- Jody is Marie's enforcer and a sadistic bully of a man. Murdering Jesse's father in front of him, Jody sneers when the young boy bursts into tears. Nailing Jesse's dog's head to a post for humping his leg, Jody savagely beats Jesse for attacking him, making him beg while twisting his arm so much the bone snaps out. When he recaptures Jesse and Tulip for Marie, Jody happily shoots and kills Tulip. In a rematch with Jesse, Jody tries to make Jesse suffer as much as possible, and when fatally wounded by Jesse, he feels nothing but pride as his abuses turned Jesse into a killer.
Isn't that cleaner looking?
Yeah, force of habit to do the before-after thing. Also go for it.
Edited by 43110 on Jan 13th 2021 at 5:42:20 AM
May I throw my hat in the ring for Copycat? My suggestions are in bold. I left the rest virtually untouched other than the fact that I took the liberty of dicing the final sentence, and changing some potholes.
- Copycat: Peter Foley, the titular "Copycat", is a killer who wishes to become a legend. Enlisted by a Serial Killer named Darryl Lee Cullum to target the profiler Dr. Helen Hudson, Foley began killing people in ways reminiscent of serial killers of the past, from The Boston Strangler to The Son of Sam, murdering numerous women throughout the film. When the police locate Foley after he killed Helen's best friend, Andy, Foley murders his own wife and tries to blow up dozens of police officers while they search his house. Kidnapping Helen, Foley reenacts her traumatizing experience at the hands of Cullum, hanging her by a noose and killing a police officer, planning to torture her to death. In the end, when an officer gives him the chance to surrender, Foley still attempts to gun her down.

Okay. Thanks anyway.
Edited by Tvtropesfan234 on Jan 13th 2021 at 11:56:05 AM