TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

Go To

During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

Snoketrope Barb / Temporary Kylo from California Since: Oct, 2020 Relationship Status: Waiting for Prince Charming
Barb / Temporary Kylo
#239626: Dec 9th 2020 at 4:46:13 PM

For the SCP stuff....

If the issue with the SCP Duo and the stuff on the plot bit....well, My issue there is that the stories don't exist on there own, both are supposed part of a Larger thing. Heck, the Young Man one was even written by 106 creator.

Now with Lawrence and that bit with the Hole, yeah that would be a good reason to Cut, but I did want to say a few things first.

The point is that Its left ambiguous if He was geniunly just a solider who fell into the Hole and got corrupted or if he was always 106 and the Hole just empowered him more, But it leans quite a bit towards the Latter.

Aside from him just being uncomfortable to be around, No one knew where he came from, With the Higher levels of Command not having any Orders or papers on him, and The Asylum he was put in finding out there were no records on him period, even a birth certificate. He was already giving his Creepy crazy ramblings before The hole incident, with him At one point saying the name of a Fellow soldiers daughter before Giggling. Even the people who thought he was suffering from Mental imbalance are established to not quite know what was going on, as they thought his Creepy actions were just 'War Fatigue' And people were already getting Sick around him, it just went from Those he shared a Bunk with getting Things like Trench foot to others getting a sickness that 'seemed to eat the Flesh like Acid'.

Basically its fine if he got cut, but I wanted to give more context for the story because while the story leaves both possibilities that he Was Once a Man who was corrupted and turned mad or he was always 106 and just got Stronger....it seems to end with basically a 70% chance that it's the second one given most of the narration is descrbing 'There was something up with that guy'.

An Audio / Animation of the story is here if your interested

https://youtu.be/F2ZwAUzABZE

Edited by Snoketrope on Dec 9th 2020 at 4:52:20 AM

Bow to the Prototype
Fighteer MOD Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#239628: Dec 9th 2020 at 5:02:47 PM

So uh now what do we do....

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#239629: Dec 9th 2020 at 5:07:03 PM

Same as before, sigh. Which were the candidates they proposed?

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#239630: Dec 9th 2020 at 5:09:00 PM

Edmund dorrance/King Snake whose in 35 issues. Ouch....

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
nwotyzal Since: Sep, 2019
#239631: Dec 9th 2020 at 5:15:20 PM

[up]I think she already made a writeup for him.

Ravok Son of Liberty from Big Shell Since: Jun, 2015 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Son of Liberty
#239632: Dec 9th 2020 at 5:15:34 PM

Yeah, I messaged the mods about this one, and as it turns out that hunch was right. Someone popping in with a perfect effortpost first go-around these days is almost never a good sign [lol]

'Yes' to Ego and Terrax on better news, and a 'No' to Psycho Man.

No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#239633: Dec 9th 2020 at 5:16:56 PM

Kinda funny actually that the first ep of being such good quality was the give way who he a few times. [lol]

Edited by miraculous on Dec 9th 2020 at 5:17:41 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#239634: Dec 9th 2020 at 5:17:29 PM

[tup] Barza, Rudo, Emperor, Wick quote, Ego and Terrax

[tdown] PM

SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#239635: Dec 9th 2020 at 5:20:58 PM

To be fair, I lurked in the thread before posting, although I wouldn't call my first effortpost perfect.

Yes to Terrax.

[down] I am not defending the BE. I am merely pointing out that some people are freaks who look at the effortpost template before they made their first post. Actually, you were not talking to me, were you?

Edited by SkyCat32 on Dec 9th 2020 at 8:34:07 AM

erazor0707 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
#239636: Dec 9th 2020 at 5:21:21 PM

What's so hard about living out your ban sentencing...? Jesus Christ.

Anyway, [tup] Ego and Terraz. [tdown] Psycho Man.

nwotyzal Since: Sep, 2019
#239637: Dec 9th 2020 at 5:31:20 PM

here was the writeup she (if that's the real gender) made (edit history on the drafts didn't add it there)

  • King Snake, real name Sir Edmund Dorrance, is the father of Bane, who abandoned his mistress and unborn son to rot in Santa Prisca's prison after he was blinded fighting the corrupt government for a pay day. Moving to Hong Kong and taking the name King Snake, Edmund became king of the heroin trade, using the young gangs as Child Soldiers, but when China was given the island, King Snake moved his operations to France and the US, killing the family of Clyde Rawlins when he attempted to stop him. Not wanting Hong Kong to be "soiled" by Chinese hands, King Snake planned to release a Nazi developed plague to kill the island's millions of inhabitants. Though he was stopped, he managed to kill Rawlins. Turning out to have survived, King Snake took control from the Triads of Gotham's Chinatown, seeking revenge on Tim, but was thought dead yet again when his forces turned on him and the Triads sent assassins. Revealed yet again to be alive, King Snake had joined the Kobra cult terrorist organization, and attempted to take control after its leader was disgraced. Forcing the cult to heal his eyes, King Snake was blinded when he attempted to kill Tim Drake when he came to save Danny Temple. Returning one last time, he once again tried to take over Kobra, this time assisted by his son, Bane. Before his death, King Snake gunned down his own son when he turned against him.

[down]not sure if they "lied" about anything

Edited by nwotyzal on Dec 9th 2020 at 5:39:28 AM

DoodSlayer136 It's Him from SAGE (Snick Amateur Game Expo) (Experienced, Not Yet Jaded) Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
It's Him
#239638: Dec 9th 2020 at 5:35:25 PM

Dammit, I though I made an actual friend! sad

Also, that whole "Perfect EP first time" things got me sussed about how I got my first EP upvoted.

[up] I see. Who were they anyways? Nobody's giving names for some reason.

[down] In all fairness to the candidate, we could still take a look at him.

Edited by DoodSlayer136 on Dec 9th 2020 at 5:44:28 AM

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#239639: Dec 9th 2020 at 5:42:17 PM

No reason to trust it's accurate tbh... I'm not comfortable putting it up.

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
nwotyzal Since: Sep, 2019
#239641: Dec 9th 2020 at 5:44:11 PM

EDIT: Lighty beat me to it.

Edited by nwotyzal on Dec 9th 2020 at 5:44:26 AM

SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#239642: Dec 9th 2020 at 5:45:32 PM

Abstain on Dorrance pending re-evaluation.

[down] Move along. Nothing to see here.

Edited by SkyCat32 on Dec 9th 2020 at 8:51:04 AM

RobertTYL Since: Oct, 2019 Relationship Status: Holding out for a hero
#239643: Dec 9th 2020 at 5:48:09 PM

[tup] Yes to Ego and Terrax.

... someone got banned while I was asleep???

TheImmortalAngelNewton The MILF Virus Since: Aug, 2015 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The MILF Virus
#239644: Dec 9th 2020 at 5:50:20 PM

[tup] Ego and Terrax

So Rabbit was a ban evader, is it bad for me to ask who it was? This person seemed to been experience in this thread considering their King Snake proposal.

Allow me, take my hand and never let go, promise? - Giselle
Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#239645: Dec 9th 2020 at 5:53:36 PM

[up] It's beside the point. Move on please.

Kappaclystica Since: Jan, 2019
#239646: Dec 9th 2020 at 5:54:44 PM

Nvm.

[tup] Terrax and Ego.

Edited by Kappaclystica on Dec 9th 2020 at 5:56:10 AM

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#239647: Dec 9th 2020 at 5:55:42 PM

Also looking over Lawrence's story... I see Snoke's point but I'm still not down to keep him. The story is purposely mysterious about the surrounding details and as has been said, it's hard to get a great read on a guy with zero dialogue who's just described as strange and creepy until something changed him. You can speculate there's more of a chance he was evil rather than driven insane, possessed, etc. but with such a story assigning something like a "70%" likelihood doesn't really work for me. He could have been a psycho with dark powers, he could have been driven insane in the trenches, he could have been possessed. We just get scant reports on him and I can't see enough strength in the implications that he's got all the facets of this trope nailed down.

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#239648: Dec 9th 2020 at 6:15:19 PM

Yeah Thats the thing. The story is written vague as hell. So it would just be creating an interpretation of something that was meant to ambiguous on whether he was always evil and gained powers or snapped.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Snoketrope Barb / Temporary Kylo from California Since: Oct, 2020 Relationship Status: Waiting for Prince Charming
Barb / Temporary Kylo
#239649: Dec 9th 2020 at 6:50:12 PM

Perfectly fair Thoughts

Bow to the Prototype
Critica7 Self-Declared King of Everything from Smallville Since: Jul, 2019 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Self-Declared King of Everything
#239650: Dec 9th 2020 at 7:19:24 PM

Okay, while reading, I found a candidate that could qualify, but I'm not completely sure. I decided to check to see if she had been effortposted before, and didn't find anything, so I figured I'd give her a try.

What is the work?

The work is The Undead Schoolgirl: Dead Pulse. Basically, after being told that a quirkless kid can't be a hero, Izuku Midoriya commits suicide. But she (yes, Izuku is a girl in this fic, hence the title) doesn't stay dead. Turns out she was misdiagnosed as being quirkless (intentionally, as it turns out), and as a result of her quirk, she Came Back Strong. Surprisingly, despite the premise, it isn't actually as dark as you might think. Gorier than the source material? Yes, but otherwise after the first couple of chapters its tone lightens significantly.

With two exceptions. One is that Himiko Toga gets introduced much earlier than in canon. The other is the subject of today's EP.

Who is Bloody Mary? What has she done?

Bloody Mary is the Starter Villain of the story (not counting the Sludge Villain). While Izuku is undergoing quirk testing, Gunhead suggests regenerative testing to see whether her Healing Factor is purely regenerative or adaptive, but he notes that it requires parental consent. In the next chapter, a nurse begins testing on her, creating incisions on her body to see how it responds.

Turns out Mrs. Midoriya didn't actually okay the testing.

The "nurse" is actually part of Bloody Mary's Circus of Horrors. Bloody Mary is a villain out to make a name for herself, and she decided the best way to do that was to perform a terrorist attack on a medical center, and hold the people there hostage as bait in hopes of killing heroes, then escaping with the kids being tested in tow. Bloody Mary and her gang quickly kill most of the security forces, then she faces down Gunhead and Death Arms while her minions fight Fatgum, Calculator, Whisper, and Hand of Harmony. Meanwhile, another of Mary's minions tries to kidnap Izuku, and kills a nurse who tries to protect her. This isn't directly Mary's doing, but I thought I should mention it because it becomes Izuku's Trauma Button.

Mary's minions are all either captured or killed, but Mary escapes using her warp quirk. She resolves to recruit Izuku and another of the children who was at the clinic, Osore Dendo. Endeavor is sent to hunt her down; he doesn't find her, but he does find a warehouse with several kidnapped children (I may have forgotten to mention that at least one of her gang members is a known cannibal), as well as plans to break one of her gang members out of prison. And only one; specifically the only one who doesn't have a quirk that gives her a monstrous appearance. The others she dismisses as "worthless."

But before that, she ambushes Izuku when she and her friends are working out at Dagobah Beach. She plants a fire axe in Izuku's shoulder and tries to kidnap her, deciding to take Bakugo too when he intervenes and attempting to kill Mitsuki. When pro heroes Retribution, Hand of Harmony, and Coagulate arrive, she tries to kill them. But when All-Might shows up, she realizes she's outmatched and tries to flee. Upon fleeing, she notices an attractive teenager and decides to kidnap her.

Turns out that teenager was Himiko Toga. It ends very badly for Bloody Mary. Turns out the press coverage of the attack on the quirk assessment clinic had caught the interest of other villains besides her, including Himiko and Tomura Shigaraki.

Heinousness?

I'll be honest, I am not nearly caught up on MHA. I don't fully know the current standard. That being said, I can comment on the standard of the fic. Himiko Toga does not count. Despite being a deranged serial killer, she has high-level quirk instability, meaning her brain is wired to see nothing wrong with cutting people to death. Shigaraki hasn't displayed any sort of redeeming qualities yet, but his canonical ones aren't revealed until later and from what I've seen, his initial portrayal is exactly the same as in canon. Dr. Tsubasa is a Hate Sink, but I'm not convinced his way of driving children to villainy is enough; time will tell with him. All For One finds him too deranged for his tastes, so that's a disqualifier.

For Bloody Mary herself, though, in terms of resources and goals, I have to say, even if she doesn't end up qualifying, she's a real piece of work. A terrorist attack on a medical center, child slavery or worse, and abandoning people absolutely loyal to her is nothing to sneeze at for a Starter Villain.

Mitigating factors?

Not in terms of justifying or even explaining her actions. In terms of personality, it's nothing ground-breaking but it's there: she's an Attention Whore who drags out battles instead of fleeing or ending them quickly because she likes the spotlight, and because of her vanity she wants to be surrounded by beautiful things, hence her only planning to rescue her human-looking minion and leave the rest behind. And her care for that specific minion is only the result of her vanity, nothing genuine.

And while her role in the story is small, it's definitely Small Role, Big Impact as a result of bringing Himiko's attention to Izuku and making both her and All For One intent on her capture (for different reasons). Time will tell how this affects the larger plot. As for being killed off by a non-CM to demonstrate how dangerous they are, it's a bit unusual but not entirely without precedent.

Verdict?

It really depends on the MHA heinous standard. That's the big issue that I'm not sure about, so I will let you decide.

Check out my current fanfiction project.

Total posts: 326,048
Top