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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

papyru30 from Colorado for summer break Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
#235876: Nov 11th 2020 at 3:44:02 PM

No to Barnett, going by the EP he's barely pushing the baseline and is nowhere near the standard for X-Files based on the monster page.

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Enid Sinclair
#235877: Nov 11th 2020 at 3:44:58 PM

Yeah looking over the X-Files page, going with a no to Barnett.

Edited by Bullman on Nov 11th 2020 at 5:45:21 AM

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
falcontalons from Earth-2 Since: Apr, 2019
PurpleEyedGuma Since: Apr, 2020
#235879: Nov 11th 2020 at 4:08:22 PM

[tdown] to Barnett based on what others are saying.

nwotyzal Since: Sep, 2019
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#235881: Nov 11th 2020 at 4:16:40 PM

Which is also why I asked how many people he threathens during the last building as unless its really high. He's not at all punching like he should for the series. [tdown]Barnett

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Enid Sinclair
#235883: Nov 11th 2020 at 4:41:18 PM

Okay I have a question. Just out of curiosity. As there is probably a good reason. Why do we only have the comic examples for stuff from Marvel and DC franchises listed on there character subpages like for Batman or Spider-man. I get it for when there's already a subpage for it like MCU, Arrowvwerse, or the video games and animation. But for stuff like the X-Men series I think it could clear some space. Again probably a good reason and I have searched, but the search engine never works for me.

Edited by Bullman on Nov 11th 2020 at 6:42:24 AM

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
deathnoteFNBOI58 Since: Aug, 2019 Relationship Status: A teenager in love
#235884: Nov 11th 2020 at 4:54:27 PM

To answer your question Mircaulous, Barnett shoots Scully and holds a violinist at gunpoint, so he threatens about two people

Edited by deathnoteFNBOI58 on Nov 11th 2020 at 7:54:41 AM

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#235885: Nov 11th 2020 at 4:56:48 PM

Okay definite no to him then

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
ImperialMajestyXO Since: Nov, 2015
#235886: Nov 11th 2020 at 5:03:58 PM

[tdown] to Barnett. Don't be too put out, though, everyone here has had candidates who didn't pan out.

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Libraryseraph uu~ from Canada (Handed A Sword) Relationship Status: Raising My Lily Rank With You
uu~
#235888: Nov 11th 2020 at 5:05:20 PM

[tdown] to Barnett

HAPPY HALLOWEEN FOR MARIA
Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Enid Sinclair
#235889: Nov 11th 2020 at 5:11:57 PM

I will be pretty busy for the next couple of weeks with personal stuff. So I won't be here as often.

Edited by Bullman on Nov 11th 2020 at 8:35:04 AM

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#235890: Nov 11th 2020 at 5:56:33 PM

  • Saint Seiya: lucifer himself, once endowed with beauty, power and wisdom by his Creator, is released from hell and sets off for cruel vengeance. Unleashing the spirits of evil gods to kill countless humans, Lucifer demands Athena in her human guise of Saori Kido offer her life after murdering the Gold Saints, intending to torture Athena with every step under threat of destroying all mankind should she refuse, which he unleashes his trapped gods to do anyways.
  • Portrait of Hell: Lord Horikawa is the tyrannical overlord of the province and a sadist who oppresses, starves and murders his people en masse, including an old man at the film's start. Abducting the daughter of the painter Yoshihide, Horikawa forces her into sex slavery and attempts to force Yoshihide into painting scenes of heaven even as Yoshihida can only paint hell. When Yoshihide asks to paint Horikawa in hell, Horikawa burns his daughter alive for "inspiration."
  • Lovecraft Country: Seamus Lancaster is the brutal, corrupt and racist officer who has designs on rising in his lodge at the Sons of Adam, introducing himself by subject Leticia to a "rough ride" as a form of torture and interrogation. Having delivered multiple victims for the horrific experiments of Hiram Epstein, Lancaster has an immortal body that he maintains by having black men abducted and murdered so he can take their body parts and organs to replace his own, even infecting young Diana with a curse to murder her should she not obey him.
  • Young Bond:
    • Scolopendra is a genius Mad Scientist with a Social Darwinist bent. Born Audacto Solares, Scolopendra clawed his way to found his own industry and believes all of humanity should be shaped the way he wishes. Developing a plague, Scolopendra intends to unleash it to force the submission of the world, with the deaths of millions thanks to contaminated banknotes while all nations beg him for the cure, having it tested on living victims. Even his own daughter Jagua is tormented and tortured by him, Scolopendra even trying to shatter her skull when he decides she's too weak to live.
    • Adam Elmhirst is a seemingly friend SIS agent. In truth, a longstanding traitor for the Soviet Union, Elmhirst is the man who murdered James Bond's parents for stumbling on his plot. Having dug tunnels with explosives, Elmhirst will detonate them and flood London from the Thames, killing countless innocents so he can have the king murdered and surrender the nation to the USSR.
  • The Princess Bride: Prince Humperdinck is a man who loves nothing so much as to kill other things, having a menagerie of animals to hunt and kill at leisure. Applying this philosophy to the real world, Humperdinck plans to start a bloody war so his nation of Florin can conquer Gildor. Forcing the lovely Buttercup into marriage, Humperdinck tries to have her murdered and frame Gildor to give pretense for invasion, having her rescuer and true love Westley subjected to his right-hand man Rugen's wicked Machine for torture, something he enjoys subjecting their victims to. Deciding upon murdering Buttercup with his bare hands, Humperdinck turns the Machine to its highest setting to give Westley the most agonizing end imaginable.

SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#235891: Nov 11th 2020 at 6:04:56 PM

No to Barnett.

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#235892: Nov 11th 2020 at 6:20:17 PM

  • Ducktales: Taurus Bulba, inventor of the reality-warping RamRod and one of the chief agents of F.O.W.L., is introduced as a brilliant, charismatic scientist and colleague of the mysteriously-vanished Professor Waddlemeyer. Bulba heavily implies that he himself tossed Waddlemeyer into another dimension in protest over the destructive effects of the RamRod, does the same to Scrooge when he clues into Bulba's plans, and betrays the head of F.O.W.L. to spearhead a more extravagant means of world domination. Bulba attempts to use the RamRod to utterly remake the world, even if it means totally ripping apart the old reality and putting a new one in its place.

  • Jesse James Meets Frankenstein's Daughter: Maria Frankenstein seeks to ape and eclipse her grandfather's works in resurrecting the dead by murdering a slew of children and trying to resurrect their bodies, her efforts always thwarted by her nobler brother. When Jesse James and his wounded, hulking associate come into her care, Maria murders James' assistant, revives him as a zombie she dubs "Igor," and promptly has him strangle her own brother to death.

  • The Glimmer Man: Donald Cunningham is the pet hitman of arms dealer Deverell who, to distract from a major chemical weapon trade, adopts the MO of the serial killer called the "Family Man." Cunningham murders a series of innocent couples to put heat on the real Family Man, ultimately leading to the real killer's death within a church, among the dead the crucified bodies of the hero's ex-wife and her current husband. Cunningham murders his own boss rather than face the authorities at the end and is cowardly enough to put up one of his own men as a human shield in the final battle.

  • The Princess Bride: Count Tyrone Rugen, the "six-fingered man" Inigo Montoya has dedicated the past twenty years of his life to hunting, is the Prince's "twin in misery." A cold-hearted Torture Technician who seeks immortality through the science of human suffering, Rugen once offered a noble swordsmith named Domingo to slave for a year on a perfect sword, then offered only a tenth of his original price upon seeing the result. Rugen heartlessly murdered Domingo when he was refused and spared his son Inigo only a whim, leaving the boy with two scars upon his cheek to forever mark the moment. Rugen now writes what he hopes to be the "definitive work" on torture, testing his skills upon the captured Westley for weeks on end. Rugen's crown achievement is a ghastly device he simply calls "the Machine" he first demonstrates on a dog before subjecting Westley to it, leaving him broken and sobbing.

Edited by Scraggle on Nov 11th 2020 at 7:24:15 AM

DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#235893: Nov 11th 2020 at 6:39:55 PM

[tdown] Barnett

Edited by DemonDuckofDoom on Nov 11th 2020 at 6:43:44 AM

DrakeClawfang Since: Apr, 2010
#235894: Nov 11th 2020 at 6:54:13 PM

Has anyone ever EP'd the Castlevania character Actrise from 64/Legacy of Darkness?

richieduck3 The Dimension Spawn from [CLASSIFIED] Since: Sep, 2019 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
The Dimension Spawn
#235895: Nov 11th 2020 at 6:54:15 PM

I know that the "Tremas" Master is considered a Complete Monster, but I happened to notice these two tropes:

  • Even Evil Has Standards: There's a scene in "The Mark of the Rani" where the Master actually apologizes to Peri for getting her mixed up in what was supposed to be a tussle between just him and the Doctor. Additionally, some of the Rani's actions in that story genuinely horrify him, like turning people into trees.
  • Heel–Face Door-Slam: He genuinely tries to help the Doctors out in "The Five Doctors", but their constant refusal to trust him leads him back to being evil. On the commentary, the story's writer Terrence Dicks noted that he felt quite sorry for the Master in this one.
With these two tropes present, shouldn't the "Tremas" Master no longer be included?

I'm right, your argument is null and void.
G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
The 47th President
#235896: Nov 11th 2020 at 7:06:28 PM

[up][up] not that I’m aware of. If you think she counts feel free to EP her

Edited by G-Editor on Nov 11th 2020 at 5:06:58 AM

My sandbox of EPs and other stuff
DrakeClawfang Since: Apr, 2010
#235897: Nov 11th 2020 at 7:18:49 PM

I'm not entirely certain. I'm not very familiar with the Castlevania series beyond a few games, so I don't know how Actrise compares to everyone else in spite of her own pretty awful wickedness. But I'm good to do an EP if others with more informed opinions could weigh in.

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#235898: Nov 11th 2020 at 7:27:52 PM

Pretty sure that one was disqualified for Offstage Villainy.

DrakeClawfang Since: Apr, 2010
#235899: Nov 11th 2020 at 7:30:22 PM

Ah. Yeah, that makes sense then.

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#235900: Nov 11th 2020 at 7:38:17 PM

I seem to recall mir describing the Tremas Master as an intentional moustache-twirling classic tv villain who committed crimes with style. I haven't seen it myself but the wording of that second description at least sounds like it's relying on creator's notes outside of the work to lean on something that isn't apparent in the work itself.


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