During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/thumbs_up_emote.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Ehh, good enough.
Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
Not Losto’s entry as a whole, but the link to his cut character page.
Cautious ![[tup]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/Thumbs_up_emoticon_3268.png "[thumb up]"){kind=small}
to Sam/Controller, but will also check the series out for myself to see. I know Night Mind has a review/analysis of it, but I have not watched that either.
Edited by MasterN on Oct 17th 2020 at 2:03:09 AM
One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.
Bonnie's Artistic Cousin
Night Mind is who taught me about the series, actually.
Edit: Addition moved to a new post for visibility's sake
Edited by WarJay77 on Oct 17th 2020 at 5:14:21 AM
Current Project: The Team
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Shit, I should probably fix that on the Disney page too.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
The Merry Monarch of Darkness
Orson, Lamashtu, Silent Witness duo.
Goku Black
Cute Is Evil for his name instead then ?
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Bonnie's Artistic Cousin
Also, weird question: Is it possible for a character from a work-within-a-work to count? See, I'm planning to rewatch The Call of Warr tonight. The villain from Warr doesn't actually count; he's a crazy mass-murderer who got one of the heroes possessed by a demon, but his motivations were fundamentally rooted in the desire to do good; he's Obliviously Evil.
However, Warr has a funny quirk, and that's that it comes with an internal work featured at the end- "Undercover Soldier", an Action Movie script written by one of the main characters (in-universe; it was actually fan-written in reality). The villain of "Undercover Soldier" might actually count; I'm not positive since it's been ages since I watched the thing, but let's say they do. Would it matter at all that, in-universe, "Undercover Soldier" is a work of fiction written by one of the characters? It has a ton of unique tropes and is a full-length work. They read the entire script in the final episode, and it was written as a fan project, so it's not entirely fictional to the universe of Warr. It's practically a fanfic, but one that got incorporated into the universe of Warr.
So...how would it work? If I end up thinking that the villain of "Undercover Soldier" counts, is it negated by the fact that he comes from a work-within-a-work, or does the unique status of "Undercover Soldier" benefit it here?
Current Project: The Team
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
I'm thinking of Vile Villain, Saccharine Show, and we don' need Big Bad; there's Toy Story - Sunnyside Daycare Toys. So:
- Toy Story 3: Lots-o'-Huggin' Bear is the ruler of Sunnyside Daycare, and oppresses the other toys through brute force and violence. Originally the favorite toy of a young girl named Daisy, Lotso was mistakenly lost and replaced, leading him to believe that all toys were worthless and unloved. Taking over Sunnyside, Lotso subjects the toys in the Caterpillar Room to horrid mistreatment from the younger children. When Andy's toys request that they be relocated to the Butterfly Room, Lotso resets Buzz Lightyear and has him beat down his friends, showing a cold satisfaction while doing so. When Woody frees the toys and they attempt to escape, Lotso has Chatter Telephone beaten in order to get him to explain Woody's escape plan before ordering the toys disposed of in the dumpster. When his minions turn on him and he is taken to the dump, along with Andy's toys, he abandons them to burn to death in the incinerator, ignoring that they had previously saved his life. While he has a tragic backstory, Woody himself calls him out on how weak it is, stating that Lotso had abandoned her, not the other way around. Sociopathic and misanthropic, Lotso may have appeared innocent, but was depraved at his core.
I'm thinking that's fine. We have Garrard.
Edited by ACW on Oct 17th 2020 at 5:20:12 AM
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button
We do have The Legend of Heroes: Trails of Cold Steel‘s Garrard from an in-game novel, so yes.
![[nja]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/user_ninja_2074.png "[nja]"){kind=small}
Edited by MasterN on Oct 17th 2020 at 2:52:53 AM
One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.
Bonnie's Artistic Cousin
Ah, cool. There's a precedent. Well, if he fits, I'll do an EP later.
Current Project: The Team
Self-Declared King of Everything
Okay. Veran EP later tonight. After that, I’ll do my writeup drafts.
Check out my current fanfiction project.
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
If Veran DOES count, I believe that'd be the third, after the original and manga.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Emperor Georgie Artémis Enkoom Evulz II
Didn't Critica mention that it wasn't the same Veran?
All ACW said was that it'd be the third version to be listed. He wasn't questioning anything.
Industrious Incisors
Hey guys, sorry for bringing this up after the thread has moved past it, but I just saw the Crash Bandicoot 4 entry added and I wanted to remind you not to use exclamation points to differentiate versions of characters.
SoundCloud
Goku Black
Oh yeah those aren't allowed to be used on the wiki.
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
... that's a thing we shouldn't do?
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Industrious Incisors
It's not the way it's always been, but that's the current policy.
SoundCloud
Can I make a request for the Warhammer Monster page?
I would like to add a picture for the 40K folder and move Nagash's picture under the WHFantasy folder. Figure the series are separate enough to do so.
I nominate either this picture
of Abaddon the Despoiler or this one.
Edited by krimzonflygon2 on Oct 17th 2020 at 4:59:36 AM
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
I don't know if we should have more than 1 image.
But damn do I love that first Abaddon image.
EDIT: Hey, I was able to upload it without screwing up the quality:
Shall I take it to Image-Pickin'? It looks better quality-wise than the current one, plus this allows us to have a quote from Fantasy Battle and an image from 40k.
Edited by ACW on Oct 17th 2020 at 8:04:22 AM
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
It's that both continuities are under their own folders: if they weren't the page would end up looking kind of messy, but if both are under folders and both folders end up with their own picture...
Edit: Sure. Maybe this could work for the caption: I am the Arch-fiend, the Despoiler of Worlds, and by my hands shall the false Emperor fall.
It's not TOO over-the-top visceral evil as Nagash's quote, but the Card-Carrying Villain-ness of it should suffice.
Edited by krimzonflygon2 on Oct 17th 2020 at 5:07:49 AM
Unofficial Wiki Curator for Complete Monster
Shoot, that's a good point. I'm fine with that if everyone else is, but either way, that Abaddon image is going SOMEWHERE, whether adding/replacing the one on the franchise page, or just to the main image page.
CM Dates; CM Pending; CM Drafts
Goku Black
In okay with it personally.
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Why Lotso need to be removed?
Here is the updated and reduced version of Josiane's entry, which I couldn't reduce any further than that.
A Dona do Pedaço: Josiane Sobral is the elitist and sociopathic Maria da Paz's daughter, who hates her own mother for being a cake maker. She begins by stealing her to get money for her desire to be a digital influencer and sabotaging the cake factory's production, ordering his cousin to burn down the stock. At the same time, she begins an affair with her mother's fiance and kills a butler and his boyfriend when the two discover and blackmail her. Convincing her mother to put the entire property in her name, after factory production has been sabotaged, she takes everything from her, including the cake factory, and throws her out of the house. She tries to murder her boyfriend when he finds out she is a murderer, butchering him with an ice pick, even though he promises not to report her for really loving her, and tries to kill him again in the hospital when he finds out that he survived. And when the company with which she had a digital influencer contract fired her for not bringing a return, she threatens to kill her photographer. Being sent to jail, Josiane pretends to have redeemed herself in order to have her sentence reduced, becoming evangelical. But in the end, she kills her mother's ex-fiancé (who in fact converted and wanted to marry her) in order to marry with a richer man, proving that she never redeemed herself and that she is nothing more than a sociopath capable of anything to achieve what she want.