TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

Go To

During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#225601: Aug 18th 2020 at 3:25:50 PM

The one played by jim Carrey. I uh don't I'd be cool with that. Uh don't get me wrong. Hes probably heinous enough but the tone is just off for him.

[up]Yeah Charles Holocombe is loosely based on him and actually does count.

Edited by miraculous on Aug 18th 2020 at 3:27:08 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Libraryseraph uu~ from Canada (Handed A Sword) Relationship Status: Raising My Lily Rank With You
uu~
#225602: Aug 18th 2020 at 3:28:49 PM

[tup] to Holmes

HAPPY HALLOWEEN FOR MARIA
nwotyzal Since: Sep, 2019
#225603: Aug 18th 2020 at 3:28:52 PM

[up][up]I wasn't planning on doing him, I was just asking if he could

That reason you listed is the reason I abandoned my plans for The Threepenny Opera, since the show is a tonal clusterfuck that can go from silly to serious at the drop of a hat.

How many H.H.Holmes do we have?

Edited by nwotyzal on Aug 18th 2020 at 3:35:41 AM

SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#225604: Aug 18th 2020 at 3:33:40 PM

[tup] H.H. Holmes.

falcontalons from Earth-2 Since: Apr, 2019
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#225606: Aug 18th 2020 at 3:36:57 PM

[up][up][up]Three. The others are that song one by duck and my book one (stalking Jack the ripper)

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#225607: Aug 18th 2020 at 4:05:18 PM

[tup] Clinton and Holmes

  • The Real McKenzies' "Sawney Beane Clan": Sawney Beane is a medieval outlaw who takes his wife to live in the caves of Galloway. Becoming a bandit and Serial Killer, Sawney spawns many children and feeds them on his victims' flesh. He raises the sons to be his goons and rapes his daughters to keep their numbers high, abducting anybody who sees their father's face and butchering them. The Beane Clan's crimes are so severe that the Queen of England personally orders them put to the sword.

Edited by DemonDuckofDoom on Aug 18th 2020 at 4:08:46 AM

RobertTYL Since: Oct, 2019 Relationship Status: Holding out for a hero
#225608: Aug 18th 2020 at 4:53:36 PM

[tup] Hollister, Clinton (not this one), H.H.H

Edited by RobertTYL on Aug 18th 2020 at 8:18:21 PM

therealjackieboy from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
#225610: Aug 18th 2020 at 5:10:11 PM

[tup] Clinton and Holmes

It's been more than two weeks since this show's season finished, so it's about time to start talking about it. I want to give a special shout out to Lighty, G, and Morgenthaler for letting me handle this one. They're awesome.

What Is the Work?

The Umbrella Academy (2019) is a Netflix series based on the comic books by Gerard Way.

One day, 36 children were simultaneously born. These children possessed super powers of their own. A man named Sir Reginald Hargreeve adopted seven—er, I mean six—of them to serve as his own team of superheroes, the Umbrella Academy.

But they all have serious issues. After Hargreeve dies in 2019, the siblings reunite to work out their differences, catch up with each other, and try, and fail, to prevent the end of the world thanks to their emotionally abused sister Vanya. But thanks to one of them, Five, having the ability to time travel, he’s able to take the siblings back in time to try and prevent the apocalypse from happening again.

Now trapped in 1963 Dallas, TX, Five finds out that yet another apocalypse is set to happen the day after JFK’s death, this time involving a nuclear war between the United States and the Soviets. Now trying to prevent this new apocalypse from happening, the Hargreeves must wait out until the assassination of JFK to save the world, all while dealing with the civil rights movement, homophobia, and cold war paranoia as they as they attempt to right what they made wrong. How hard can that be?

Who Is she?

The Handler is the high ranking head of the Commission, an organization of time traveling hitmen created to preserve the current timeline, and while she first appeared in Season 1 as a minor villain, it’s Season 2 where she becomes the show’s Big Bad.

What has she done?

As a member of the Commission, it’s the Handler’s job to assign targets to the organization’s field agents, telling them who to assassinate in order to prevent the timeline from screwing up. Thing is, the Handler wants to ensure that the apocalypse in 2019 will arrive on time, as she doesn’t believe history can really be changed. After Five goes rogue to prevent the eventual apocalypse from happening, the Handler sends her two agents Hazel and Cha-Cha to stop him and the Hargreeves in order to allow the apocalypse to happen.

But when the two assassins try and kill each other thanks to Five’s manipulation, the Handler assigns the two to protect Vanya, as she’s the catalyst for Armageddon. The Handler sends other agents out to kill the Hargreeves so that they won’t intervene when Vanya brings about the end of the world. But after a battle with Five, Hazel later shoots the Handler in the head, killing her for good. Granted, even after the Hargreeves snap Vanya out of her anger-induced funk, the apocalypse still happens and wipes out the entire world, but not before Five and his siblings jump into a time portal to try again. Should be simple this time.

Except not really. After surviving her supposed death in Season 2 thanks to a metal plate she had implanted in her skull, the Handler shows throughout the season just how low she can sink.

After getting replaced as the head of the Commission by AJ Carmichael—who’s just a sapient goldfish in a fish tank head piloting by a robotic body—and a guy named Herb, as well as getting comically demoted to a measly desk job, the Handler plots her revenge against not only the Commission, but the Hargreeves for getting her demoted in the first place. She plans to do whatever she can to seize control of the Commission, no matter who she has killed.

It’s at this point when the Handler is revealed to have an adopted daughter: Lila, a woman who Diego Hargreeves knows from the asylum he was sent to when he traveled back to the 60s. The Handler had Lila’s parents killed when she was a mere child by Five, adopting her after their assassination. With Lila in her hands, the Handler raised her as her own little Tyke-Bomb, implanting her as a spy to help stop the Hargreeves’ plan, with her mission to protect Five at all costs.

Since Hazel and Cha-Cha are now obsolete, the Handler sends in the Swedes, a trio of brothers, to prevent the Hargreeves from stopping the new apocalypse. But after they start slacking, the Handler has one of them killed via a mine and pins the blame on Diego, knowing that the two remaining Swedes will do anything to avenge their brother.

Meeting with Five, the Handler sends him out to kill Carmichael and the Commission’s board of directors in return for sending him and his siblings to an alternate 2019 where the apocalypse doesn’t happen. Once Five has finished slaughtering the board members, with Carmichael being reduced to just an ordinary goldfish in a bowl, the Handler becomes the new head of the Commission, using her position to impose harsher rules, deadlier agents, and has those who disappoint her “vanished.” Meanwhile, Five is set up as the fall guy for the board committee’s assassination.

Oh, and as for her part of the deal with Five? Doesn’t really work out, as Five ends up being too late to take everyone back to 2019. Besides, the Handler only promised him that so that they could leave her alone. But the Handler also knows that Carmichael is trying to get the truth out to Lila that she was responsible for the death of her parents. Knowing that Carmichael is assisting Herb in his plan to overthrow her, she devours Carmichael from his fish bowl, killing him for good. The Handler also turns Lila against the Hargreeves, using the knowledge that Five killed her parents as a way to manipulate her.

Despite the apocalypse being successfully prevented by the Hargreeves, the Handler is still able to find out where the siblings are hiding when the young, super-powered boy Harlan accidentally triggers a snowstorm with his newfound powers. Killing the switchboard operator who informed her of this, the Handler calls upon an army of hundreds consisting of every single Commission field agent by her side to take down the Hargreeves for good. Thankfully, Vanya’s able to use her powers to kill all of them.

But the Handler’s not done yet. Brushing aside the deaths of all of her agents, she tells Lila to let it rip. Lila flies in the air and uses Vanya’s powers, completely catching the Hargreeves off guard. Turns out, Lila’s one of the 36 children born with powers. The Handler knew that, so she had Lila’s parents killed just so that she could adopt and raise her as her own special weapon. Lila has the power to copy the abilities of those she’s fighting, kind of like a chameleon. As she sends Lila to take down the Hargreeves, the Handler attempts to snatch Harlan for herself, intending to raise him as her new weapon, just like what she did with Lila.

Eventually the Hargreeves get Lila to accept them as her true family, which angers the Handler so much, she kills Lila herself for going against her. She proceeds to gun down the rest of the Hargreeves as well with a sick smile on her face before getting killed by the final Swede brother in retaliation for killing his brother. In what I can assume is an homage to Galaxy Quest, the barely alive Five is able to use his powers to travel a few seconds backwards and save his family, getting the final Swede brother to gun down the Handler before she could kill anyone.

Redeeming Qualities?

There really is none. She only views people as tool to help further complete her goals, willing to dump them should they go against her. She shows no love for Lila, and isn’t at all afraid to kill her when she retaliates. She did have some respect for Five in Season 1, even hinting that she wanted him to succeed her position, but that goes out the window in Season 2, where she’s trying her damnedest to have him killed.

Her whole ‘we can’t prevent the apocalypse from happening’ isn’t really about preserving the timeline, but mainly just pure stubbornness on her part, refusing to believe that one can fight fate, and killing those who go against her.

The reason why I didn’t think she counted at first was because she has quite a few goofy scenes, like when she gets super excited for winning a patio set in a game of bingo, or when she goes through a humiliation conga that results in her getting demoted, which involves losing her parking spot, her old job, and sitting at Five’s old work desk; of which she throws a large hissy fit.

But like fellow CM Jean-Baptiste Emmanuel Zorg, her actions and goals are portrayed seriously enough, still coming out as a capable threat not to be taken lightly.

Heinousness?

Easily one of the worst people on the show, as she’s responsible for hundreds of deaths. While she’s not personally responsible for the apocalypses, she still allows them to happen, prevents anybody from trying to stop them, and from what we do see from these disasters, everybody on Earth dies. She also allows Hazel, Cha-Cha, and the Swedes, to torture and kill those who stand in their way.

As for the other villains introduced in Season 2? Primarily Hate Sinks who don't do nearly as much as the Handler.

Conclusion

I think she’s a keep.

Edited by therealjackieboy on Aug 18th 2020 at 5:14:28 AM

It's Spooky Month!
falcontalons from Earth-2 Since: Apr, 2019
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#225612: Aug 18th 2020 at 5:21:51 PM

Yes to Holmes and the Handler.

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#225613: Aug 18th 2020 at 5:28:44 PM

[tup]handler

First cm for Kate Walsh. One of my favorite actresses too.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
SumDumNerd LOCKDOWN PROCEDURES ENGAGED from [REDACTED] Since: May, 2017 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
MasterN Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button from Florida- I mean Unova Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#225616: Aug 18th 2020 at 5:53:10 PM

[tup] H. H. Holmes and miss Handler.

One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.
DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#225617: Aug 18th 2020 at 5:54:52 PM

[tup] Handler

Another quote:

"This man, Makarov, is fighting his own war, and he has no rules. No boundaries. He doesn't flinch at torture, human trafficking, or genocide. He's not loyal to a flag or a country or any set of ideals. He trades blood for money."
General Shepherd on Vladimir Makarov, Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2

Edited by DemonDuckofDoom on Aug 18th 2020 at 5:54:48 AM

ImperialMajestyXO Since: Nov, 2015
DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#225619: Aug 18th 2020 at 6:04:18 PM

Crap, missed that. How's this?

"I can't believe I get paid to do this! I love watching you prawns die."
Koobus Venter, District 9

DrUnknown Since: May, 2020
#225620: Aug 18th 2020 at 6:12:18 PM

[tdown] to the Koobus Venter quote. Sounds like it fits more with Psycho for Hire instead.

falcontalons from Earth-2 Since: Apr, 2019
Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#225622: Aug 18th 2020 at 6:27:05 PM

[tup] Holmes and the Handler.

  • Gun: Sergeant Hollister, is Magruder's top military man and enforcer of his operations. A racist, renegade confederate, Hollister leads a barbaric militia to war against and persecute the Apache people, having a hand in the steamboat massacre. He takes numerous apaches prisoner in his war camp, having them enslaved, tortured and even murdered, with flayed and burned bodies found in his camp. Taking Cole and his friend Soapy captive, he contemplates stringing their guts around the camp for trespassing, sarcastically acting like a gracious host. When he's overthrown, and mortally wounded in a fight with Cole, Hollister rigs himself up with dynamite in a last ditch effort to kill him.

Edited by Beast on Aug 18th 2020 at 6:30:12 AM

"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
Tyk5919 Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin Since: Mar, 2011 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin
#225623: Aug 18th 2020 at 6:29:53 PM

[tup] for the Handler.

[tdown] for the District 9 quote. Think that exact line was brought up here before.

I write stories and shiz. You can read them here.
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#225624: Aug 18th 2020 at 6:52:10 PM

Weren't we trying to relax on the volume of quotes being proposed anyways after we put in more stringent requirements to make sure they actually demonstrated all aspects of this trope?

G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
The 47th President
#225625: Aug 18th 2020 at 7:08:48 PM

[tup] Hollister, Bob, Holmes, and an easy [tup] to the Handler

My sandbox of EPs and other stuff

Total posts: 326,048
Top