During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Yes to Kantaka and while I'm doing my present for Duck over on MB... I remember this on the Monster end of the work's page:
- Drive Angry: Jonah King is a satanic cult leader obsessed with his own power and leading a group of psychos slavishly devoted to him. He lured the criminal John Milton's daughter into his cult. After Milton's sudden death, King kills her husband, takes her baby girl—Milton's granddaughter—to use in a sacrifice, and forces Milton's daughter to give him a blowjob at gunpoint. She bites his dick off, after which he personally cuts off her head and keeps her femur as part of a cane he uses. When the resurrected Milton reveals King's status as a eunuch, King immediately shoots the only cultist who could confirm it. He also briefly kidnaps Piper, Milton's female companion on the ride, but when she proves too much trouble to convert, he decides to kill her and defile her corpse afterwards.
Okay... "bites his dick off"? That needs to go in the entry? Anyone mind if I change that bit of edge I don't wanna cut myself on to "and attempts to rape Milton's daughter though she castrates him, causing King to decapitate her and take her femur to use as a cane."? I find it a tad classier.
I don't think it needs to be that truncated, he attempts a rape and gets castrated, which angers her to decapitate her, I think mine says it fine.
Edited by 43110 on May 21st 2020 at 1:51:35 PM
Alrighty...for Duck then I got a double...
What's the work?
Escape from LA is the sequel to the 1981 film Escape from New York. Snake Plissken is a hard-bitten former special forces soldier named Snake Plissken. A man who believes in nothing, thought dead and betrayed, his faith in his country shattered...Since saving one President years ago, the current one is a despotic theocrat who turns America into an even worse nightmare, separating LA from the rest of the world after earthquakes and floods. The President, now elected for life, bans and I quote Wiki: "tobacco, alcoholic beverages, recreational drugs, red meat, firearms, profanity, atheism, non Christian religions, and extramarital sex." Minorities, violators, etc are sent into LA....now, Snake is dispatched to recover the President's daughter Utopia, seduced by the revolutionary leader Cuervo Jones to recover a secret weapon. Now, I'll discuss two villains quickly. The President, and the Surgeon General of Beverly Hills.
Who are they?
The President is a dictator, a fanatical psychopath who enacts his will on America. All those things above? Banned. Loads of people, countless, are rounded up for being minorities, having the wrong religion and sent into LA to suffer and in most cases die. Oh, but you have an option...to die by electric chair. Many choose this, fried alive rather than go into LA. Now, Cuervo Jones' forces, plus Cuba and Mexico are plotting to invade America and the President wants to shut down their power, and their ability to function, slaughtering any who resist and with the consequences fully spelled out...Snake is sent in to recover Utopia.
Snake manages to go through a lot, but the President, impatient, at one point orders a full airstrike on LA to kill everyone and everything within. His adviser Malloy overrules him, but the President just gets more paranoid and vicious as things drag on. Finally, when Snake recovers Utopia and returns? The President orders Utopia fried in the electric chair and tries to have Snake killed when he doesn't play ball....only for Snake to reveal he has the real satellite code, and is only there in hologram. Snake opts to simply shut down the world to give humanity a chance to start over, much to the President's shock and horror.
The Surgeon General of Beverly Hills is a twisted man who dwells in Beverly Hills amidst a horde of mutants...nobody sets foot in Beverly Hills and gets out...he experiments on loads of people, taking people he abducts there and carving them apart to graft spare parts to his mutants. They hunt regularly for people and bring them back to be carved up. We see a massive operation, loads underground as the Surgeon General gloats over them...corpses on the walls he dismisses, heads in baskets...all before he gets to Snake and his current ally, deciding to carve them up and take their eyes and more when they're still alive. Snake thankfully gets free for them and takes the Surgeon General hostage, disabling or killing him with a blow to the skull.
Heinous standard?
Okay, next to Escape from New York? The president there was...a venal bureaucrat who didn't care about the people who died saving his hide, but he wasn't evil whatsoever. The Duke of New York is a powerful criminal who never does much by way of pure evil...Cuervo Jones is bad, but doesn't get up to near thr atrocity count. Okay, yes, Snake shuts down the planet, but the President for Life enacts a horrific dictatorship, explicitly goes for mass murder and the Surgeon General is a serial killer mad scientist. Pass.
Mitigating Qualities?
The President is just a vicious fanatic. He's got ntohing good to him, no care even for his daughter. The Surgeon General is just a mad scientist lunatic. The Surgeon General has very little screen time, but we see the operation, a ton of dismembered and dissected bodies and it's made very clear: nobody sets foot in Beverly Hills and leaves without being carved apart by him. So, no. Nothing good to either.
Conclusion?
And a yea to both, I'd say.
President and Surgeon. God bless Bruce Campbell, love that dude.
Also just want to mention that Escape also has the best/worst surfing scene in film history.
Edited by therealjackieboy on May 21st 2020 at 11:14:02 AM
It's Spooky Month!
To President Evil and Bruce Camp—Mad Doctor. Happy birthday, Duck! Time to open your (three) presents!
. All candidates originate from Outpost, a surprisingly good low-budget horror trilogy inspired by Wolfenstein. Interestingly, the first movie was released mere months before the arrival of Nazi Zombies. I'll start with the most important baddie.
Who is he? The trilogy's Greater-Scope Villain despite his limited screentime, Untersturmführer Klausener, a high-ranking Mad Scientist and pivotal member of the Black Sun's inner circle, led the mysterious Lazarus Project and developed a machine capable of giving birth to super soldiers in an effort to win the Second World War with the help of pseudoscience, overseeing the horrific experiments that were conducted in a Nazi secret facility, which included shooting test subjects to see if they would survive a bullet to the head and throwing people inside a chamber to fry their neural pathways; unfortunately for him, everything goes terribly wrong and the subjects are transformed into undead, nigh-unstoppable beings with a thrist for blood. Surviving the war but left wheelchair-bound, Klausener returns to mastermind his own neo-Nazi conspiracy to create the "Reich of a Thousand Years"... aka the Fourth Reich.
Manipulating a mercenary team from behind the scenes to set the events in motion while promising to go after their families if they rebel against his orders and plotting to release the monsters from their cage, all the mercenaries are killed and Klausener smiles as the backup soldiers get slaughtered as well, simply rejecting an opportunity to save them, having already succeeded in unleashing his former subjects on mankind. Klausener's machinations result in the monsters indiscriminately massacring countless combatmen and civilians alike around war-torn Yugoslavia, the military had to consider nuking the entire area with thousands of people still inside to save the rest of Europe and the world. The sequel ends with Klausener finally getting his hands on a key component of his machine, planning on replicating the entire the process in modern day. The prequel also reveals Klausener was already involved in some twisted experiments and the creation of zombified soldiers even before the accident happened.
Mitigating Factors? Nope, Klausener is a power-hungry Nazi and that's it.
Heinous? Huh, yeah. Klausener was direcly and indirectly responsible for most of the evil stuff that we see. Even the actions of the two other candidates can be traced back to him.
Conclusion?
Edited by TheMadCr0w on May 21st 2020 at 3:55:38 PM
Based on the EP,
to the President and
to the Surgeon General. Got to check those movies out.
Also got to see Drive Angry. Sounds utterly crazy (was just voting on it over on MB).
Again, Happy Birthday Demon Duck!
Since 6/4 will mark two weeks since the last new episode of GH (for the time being) aired, I might want to lead a discussion. Keep you all posted.
Edited by futuremoviewriter on May 22nd 2020 at 12:15:22 PM
Happy birthday, Duck! As promised ...
What's the work?
The Night Of The Demons trilogy is a series of movies spanning from the late 80s to the 90s, centered around the murderous exploits a demonically possessed woman named Angela Franklin.
Who is Angela Franklin? What has she done?
Just to get something out of the way: I'm talking about the possessed Angela, or perhaps more accurately, the demon possessing her. Not her seemingly nice Perky Goth, unpossessed counterpart. Now, starting with the first movie, she's a nice enough person who doesn't seek anything more than just scaring her party guests at Hull House, a funeral home surrounded by an underground stream ... and many legends.
So let's begin, shall we? It possesses Angela by way of her friend Suzanne, though in this one ... it really doesn't do enough to stand out from the other demons. All she really does is turn more people into demons, same as the others possessed. But by the time of the second movie, she seems to be the sole survivor, descending into Hell to become the bride of Satan. The first we see of the now-possessed Angela, she kills a couple of ... Jehovah's Witnesses, I think? ... who came to her door with the intention of converting her, but started to leave as soon as they saw her wedding cake. Which is topped by a figurine of her with Satan. Later on, in dialogue, it's revealed that she sent a gruesome card to her parents smeared with blood and dead insects, which drove them both to suicide, leaving her younger sister, Melissa, an orphan.
Shirley, the resident Alpha Bitch at the Catholic school that Melissa is attending drags the younger sister along to Hull House with the intent of pulling a really tasteless joke by pretending to sacrifice her. But it turns out they don't need a sacrifice at all, and Angela rapes one of Shirley's cohorts before turning him into a demon, and the manages to cross the stream by way of a possessed lipstick tube, which turns into a tentacle and has its way with Shirley. She manifests herself and causes a little bit of chaos at the dance party (didn't realize that repressed and troubled Catholic students were so into death metal), letting Shirley turn two of her friends, and later she appears to Melissa in her human form, comforting her before taking her off to Hull House with the intention of sacrificing her to prove her devotion to Satan. Her underlings start killing off and infecting the heroes of the story who went out to Hull House to save Melissa. Eventually, the survivors reach her, and she has Melissa laid out on an altar. Sister Gloria tries to convince her to unhand Melissa, agreeing to swap places with her on the altar, trying to force Melissa to kill her. Of course, this gives Melissa the advantage, and she stabs her sister, letting the rest of the crew finish her off ... but then she goes One-Winged Angel and makes one last ditch effort to kill them and almost succeeds, until Johnny breaks the boards off the window, forming a cross with the sunlight, seemingly destroying her once and for all.
In the third, a cop is sitting outside Hull House and meets her alive and well, and needless to say, she kills him. A group of absurdly unlikable teenagers come by the house to hide out, and try to intimidate her. The first of them, she takes out by ... giving his gun a blowjob and sucking out the bullets, then suckfacing with him and impaling him through the back of the head with her tongue. Which causes his mask to replace his actual head after he becomes a demon. She tricks Holly's friend Abby into accepting her offer to become sexier than her friend, and Abby mauls the Token Evil Teammate Vincent's girlfriend Lois, whose snake sock puppet merges with her hand. Only three people are left alive now: Vincent, Nick, and Holly, and Vincent manages to get a hold of her and hold her at gunpoint to try and force the officer on their case who suddenly showed up to leave them be. It takes a shotgun blast to the face courtesy of Nick for the cop to realize that she's a demon, and Angela infects Vincent. The three try to flee, but now they're surrounded by demons, so Angela tries to cut them a deal: hand over Holly, and she'll let them go. Of course, they come up with a plan, the officer gets killed, but the two run from Hull House which now somehow has a force field around it and not just a stream, and it vaporizes Angela on the spot when she makes a last-ditch effort to kill them ... but the end reveals that she's not so dead after all.
Mitigating factors?
My biggest problems are:
1. She never amounts to much. No apocalyptic designs or widespread chaos and mass murder (despite acknowledging the end of the world is coming soon), not even when she's actually let loose outside of Hull House. All she ever really does is kill people and turn them into demons, and even then, her numbers aren't very impressive at all.
2. Her characterization is inconsistent. Despite being on the promotional material for the first movie, she doesn't do much of anything different from the other demons. Hell, she wasn't even the first to be possessed. She's the bride of Satan in the second, but that's never mentioned again in the third, where she's suddenly decided to play it like a subtle version of the Collector.
3. The closest she reaches to sufficient heinousness is in the second movie, with the single rape, driving her parents to suicide (which is Offstage Villainy, but that it put Melissa in boarding school might say a lot), and attempting to kill her sister. After that, though, not much else is made out of her character.
Heinous standard?
Stands out in the second movie, the others ... not so much.
Verdict?
I'm leaning no, unfortunately. Though perhaps she could count for just the second movie, if that's possible. I know that was (seemingly) the case for the Warlock.
Happy b-day DDD. Papyru, mind doing the whole tree for the films? I'm not sure the order, so you can just do all 5.
Clone!Isaacs; Kantaka; LA duo (I'm a BIT wary on the Surgeon General, since LA seems like a Crapsack World anyway, but he seems to be even worse than usual); Klausener.
Abstain on Novak and Angela.
Another Witchblade EP
What is the Work?
Vampirella/Witchblade
is a trilogy of one shot crossover comics between the characters of Vampirella and Witchblade. Each one-shot focuses on an individual adventure of Vampirella and Sara Pezzini, from their meeting in "Brooklyn Bounce", to Sara helping Vampirella from being forced to a marriage with Satan's son in "Union of the Damned" to the final comic, where they deal with cannibal super models in "The Feast". I will be talking about "The Feast" now, since the villains of the other two one-shot crossovers are not heinous enough.
Now, "The Feast" starts with Vampirella and Sara raiding the place, where some guys were butchering vampires
and they found out that vampires were harvested for meat.
This leads them to my candidate - Rod Sterling.
Who is Rod Sterling?
The true leader of J.Holmes Modeling Agency, Rod Sterling at one point come up with a scheme to keep his models young and obedient. He hires people to hunt down otherwise innocent vampires and butcher them, so he could harvest them and turn their meat into an "Eternal Slender" product, which he feeds to unsuspecting women, transforming them into an undead, who obey his every order. Letting J.Holmes himself in on this scheme, he had him find the models, whom he can transform. When Vampirella ans Sara Pezzini pick
on his trail, intergrade
into
his
modeling
agency
and interrogated
J.Holmes, they find out about his scheme, as well as the fact that Rod feeds the zombified models to the vampires, so he could harvest more vampires later, sorta like "Recycling", and arrive
in his office to take him down. Rod orders
his now undead slaves to kill them, but after Sara and Vampirella easily defeated
them, he reveals that in reality he has a magic camera (which can transform into symbiotic weapon)
, which he used to steal the souls of his models, whom he transformed into undead slaves and used this to keep himself young. As he attempts
to kill Vampirella, Sara attacks him and tears off his weapon and kills him
with it.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
None.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
In this trilogy of crossovers, Rod Sterling is the worst, there is one demon, who blew up parts of the hospital and kill a few people and Vampirella killed one vampire, she was interrogated, despite promising to let him live for the answers, but Rod makes a unique niche in stealing the souls to keep himself young and "griding" dozens of otherwise innocent vampires into a meat, which he feeds to the innocent women, who became his undead slaves. And he plans to "expand" his business in the end.
Final Verdict?
What do you think?
Late happy birthday to Duck! :) Wish I had a EP for him too though.
And speaking of birthdays, today is my 22nd birthday AND graduation from school, even though I haven’t been able to go to school lately thanks to Covid. So yeah, today is a very special day for me. I’m very excited and nervous about it at the same time.
Happy b-day Micheal!
As for Angela, I'm not even sure a "single rape, driving her parents to suicide (which is Offstage Villainy, but that it put Melissa in boarding school might say a lot), and attempting to kill her sister" is enough. Especially as isn't this the series with the dude who put razor blades in apples?

Happy birthday, Ducky.
Edited by SkyCat32 on May 21st 2020 at 12:51:08 PM