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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
The 47th President
#211301: Apr 25th 2020 at 11:25:48 AM

[tup]Nemesis, Totentaz and Hastur & Yog Sothoth

My sandbox of EPs and other stuff
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#211302: Apr 25th 2020 at 11:35:51 AM

Also 1 for you. Hawkins and Harris will come a bit later but so that this can go in tommorow's batch.

  • "Away Game", by Seanan McGuire: Coach Harrison is a vile servant of Shub-Niggurath. Harrison worms her way into being the coach for cheerleader and football teams, tricking them into going to her cult which is disguised as a school where their consumed by her master. Trying to warp the minds of the heroines, Harrison intends to use them to fuel her master's endless appetite.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#211303: Apr 25th 2020 at 12:05:00 PM

Here's my batch. I wasn't sure if I should have added Narly's additional crimes from Revival. They seemed pretty small potatoes into his larger scale stuff IMO.

  • Toire no Hanako-san or School Mystery: The unnamed Child Murderer is a deranged predator terrorizing the neighbourhood. It is his murders that are blamed on the titular Hanako San spirit. At one point, the killer encounters Mizuno, who manages to escape, but left so traumatized she lost her voice. The killer than kills the school's pet goat, leaving its severed head to be found outside the school. When rumours spread that Mizuno herself in Hanako San, the killer overhears a plan between two students to lock her in the school bathroom over night. The killer shows up at the school, relentlessly trying to chase Mizuno and Takuya down, throwing Takuya's father down a flight of stairs for getting in his way, seemingly killing him.
  • Gnosticism Mythology: Demiurge or Yaldabaoth, is a take on the Old Testament God, used to explain the Problem Of Evil. A malevolent false god, Yaldabaoth is the source of humanities sinful nature and all the misery who takes joy in human evil, so long as he's worshiped as the Top God. Yaldabaoth created the physical realm, and humanity, as dubacherous and mindless creatures, before the higher gods took pity on them and granted them knowledge and souls, thus access to the true spiritual world. The materialistic Yaldabaoth would prefer to manipulate the world in wickedness, keeping humanity in the dark of the spiritual world. This puts him in direct conflict with his mother Sophia, who in some versions was destroyed by her son, with her remnants becoming humanities souls.
  • Trash Dispoal: The self proclaimed "Fear Bringer" is a deranged misanthrope who sees it as his calling to dispose of people he sees as trash, giving accounts of his crimes and motives. Starting out as a teenager, he drugs a pregnant girl at his school into overdosing, framing her boyfriend and taking pride that that he was murdered in prison. When a girl takes credit for "exposing" the boyfriend, the Fear Bringer messily sexually assaults her, and circulated pictures of the mess around the school, ruining her life and reputation. At some point, he tricks artists into burning down his families house for an art project, framing them for the deaths of his parents while acting as the victim. His other crimes include killing an entire family, including children and a baby, because the kids were being bullies, and framing a priest for being a child molester for trying to rehabilitate criminals. He goes on to question the reader if these are the people in the world who deserve to die, and asks why he's considered wrong for killing them at all.
  • Does Anyone Remember Channel 42 ?: The One Who Walks In The Void is a horrific otherworldly being that attaches itself to an earnest TV Station producer, Jonathan Torrence. Convincing Torrence that it is God, and making him his servant, it has Torrence kill numerous people, especially children as human sacrifices. After Torrence commits ritual suicide, the being takes the form and personality of Stitches the Clown, creating a twisted broadcast of shows where he tortures, mutilates numerous people and creatures on his shows. As Stitches, he uses his show to try to teach kids how to kill, commit cannibalism, and even prepare to surgically remove the brain of a captive child. It is implied that the people appearing on his shows are souls it collected from sacrifices. Seeking a greater audience, Stitches and his slaves would stalk and terrorize people who view the show to get them to spread the word, before cowardly begging Agent Helsing to spare his life when the latter realizes his weakness.
  • Revival
    • Yog Sothoth is one of the highest ranking and seemingly omnipotent Outer God, who looks down on everyone and see's Nyarlathotep's attempted apocalypse as the time to take the universe back from lesser beings. Yog Sothoth decides to pick off where Nyarlathotep left off by attempting to destroy the world before, being banished; during which he attempts to kill the Loud siblings by erasing them, from youngest to oldest. Returning in the sequel, Yog Sothoth takes the form of a female humanoid and kills Cthylla by ripping reincarnated Cthulhu out of her womb. From there Cthulhu - essentially reduced to an innocent child - is raised by Yog Sothoth to face Hastur; these include having the infant Cthulhu constantly attacked and mutilated by monstrosities, always stopping short of death; as well as forcing him to slaughter the loyal, sapient Deep Ones, who raised him as family. Teaming up with the Loud's to stop Hastur, when the latter is defeated, Yog Sothoth reveals his true intentions is to use Cthulhu as a weapon and bring about a new apocalypse of his own.
    • The Loud House: The King In Yellow: Hastur, the envious, and hateful half brother of Cthulhu, is portrayed as an arrogant but weak god who thinks he's entitled to the world. Seemingly killed when humanity fought back against him, Hastur seeks out Cthulhu's daughter Cthylla, planning to kill her and prevent Cthulhu from interfering with his plans; to that end he wipes out a civilization of Deep Ones trying to protect her. Recovering in Royal Wood, Hastur forcibly twists and mutates helpless victims into his slaves, often killing them at the smallest slight. Hastur plans on spreading his sign across the world to force this fate onto everyone, and recruits Dr. Moist into his plans, needlessly slaughtering his staff. Hastur arranges to have Lisa Loud kidnapped to have her create a device that would broadcast his sign around the world, and tries to drive her mad by revealing his face. When the broadcast begins, that alone causes mass death and destruction; the second part of his plan is to torture Nyarlathotep's daughter Mia into ushering in the pantheon to tear the universe apart.

"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
falcontalons from Earth-2 Since: Apr, 2019
#211304: Apr 25th 2020 at 12:08:05 PM

[up]What was the vote tally on the Fear Bringer? Several people voted him down because they thought the story was schlock.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#211305: Apr 25th 2020 at 12:09:32 PM

Welp, that'll make 65 surprised

Revival duo after Nyarly?

Also, for the nosleep and You Tube stuff, mind having links to the works?

Is the School Mystery the 1995 one, 1998 one, or 1997 series?

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#211306: Apr 25th 2020 at 12:14:04 PM

I am certain we downvoted fear bringer. Dude comes from a 2000 word story. That's honestly really miniscule.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#211307: Apr 25th 2020 at 12:15:40 PM

We absolutely downvoted that one.

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#211308: Apr 25th 2020 at 12:15:53 PM

Yeah. Fear Bringer was downvoted.

nwotyzal Since: Sep, 2019
#211309: Apr 25th 2020 at 12:17:50 PM

earlier on the thread, there was a debate whether to delete Layla and Enchantress what were the result of both of those?

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#211310: Apr 25th 2020 at 12:19:21 PM

The first was still ruled a keep. The other....Did Warthog ever come back to us on whether she had agency.

Tbh she doesn't sound specially heinous for an evil sorcerer in fiction but that could just be me.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#211311: Apr 25th 2020 at 12:19:28 PM

Yeah, not trying to be a dick but I hardly recall anyone upvoting it, that one definitely didn't make the cut.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#211312: Apr 25th 2020 at 12:20:48 PM

The main problem of the Enchantress, IMHO, is the style of the game isn't really conducive to her really having a personality. I was fine with SNES!Malebolgia, because he was manipulative.

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#211313: Apr 25th 2020 at 12:22:26 PM

Theirs also emperor Mateus from final fantasy 2 but the fact the games been remade into more advanced looks probably helped.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
papyru30 from Colorado for summer break Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
#211314: Apr 25th 2020 at 12:23:59 PM

With the Enchantress I think we decided to hold off until someone got all of the extra lore in the King of Card's campaign since we were unsure if she's Made of Evil or not.

Edited by papyru30 on Apr 25th 2020 at 1:24:16 PM

Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#211315: Apr 25th 2020 at 12:24:12 PM

I must have forgotten he was downvoted. He was brought up when we where debating The Crucible's Abigail Williams.

I'll look back at the dicsussion to do a tally.

"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
falcontalons from Earth-2 Since: Apr, 2019
#211316: Apr 25th 2020 at 12:25:34 PM

[up]If you're doing a tally, I'm switching to a no on him, so please count me as a down vote.

KingofNightmares Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#211318: Apr 25th 2020 at 12:41:25 PM

Mateus is fine, as an RPG is more conducive to expanded personalities than a Platform Game, IMHO. Hell, Golden Axe only got by since a version has full cutscenes.

Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#211319: Apr 25th 2020 at 12:52:21 PM

I looked back at the Fear Bringer discussion. Few people where voting for or against it at the time because The Crucible Discussion started on the same. As it stands the current tally is.

[tup] MGD. Bullman. Cloister the Stupid. NattesNovel. G Editor. Demon Duck.

[tdown] Libaryseraph. This was also the last vote in the Fear Bringer's discussion. Everything else became consumed by the Abigail discussion, which took up quite a few pages.

Switch to [tdown] Falcontalons and Knight of Nightmares.

Edited by Beast on Apr 25th 2020 at 2:56:05 PM

"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
falcontalons from Earth-2 Since: Apr, 2019
#211320: Apr 25th 2020 at 12:54:35 PM

[up]There were more down votes, starting here. I counted 43110, Scraggle, AustinDR, miraculous, Lightysnake, and Bullman, which makes 6 up votes against 9 down votes.

[down][down][down]They came several pages after Library gave her down vote.

Edited by falcontalons on Apr 25th 2020 at 1:04:48 AM

nwotyzal Since: Sep, 2019
#211321: Apr 25th 2020 at 12:55:42 PM

[up][up]I voted yes

Edited by nwotyzal on Apr 25th 2020 at 12:58:56 PM

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#211322: Apr 25th 2020 at 12:55:45 PM

So looks like it's the 1995 movie, and I'm placing those 2 after Nyarly.

Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#211323: Apr 25th 2020 at 12:59:04 PM

Hastur and Yog Sothoth go after Nyarlathotep, yes.

[up][up][up] How did I miss that ? Anyways I guess he's a cut.

I don't particualry mind either way. The Fear Bringer is someone outside of my standards anyways. I only EP'd him for someone else. I normally don't do requests either.

Edited by Beast on Apr 25th 2020 at 3:02:26 AM

"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#211324: Apr 25th 2020 at 1:05:10 PM

have an interesting one, now...after I move on to follow Totentanz...First? From the Tzimisce clanbook, Totentanz's Childe, Wiessrarech

Who is Weissrarech?

A vicious Tzimisce and Ductus (pack leader), embraced into the Clan by Doktor Totentanz specifically for her racism as one of the glatzen, or Skinhead...embraced after the fall of the Berlin Wall, to continue the Nazi struggle. Weissrarech's savagery is informed by European immigration and she decides to concentrate her monstrosity there. Quoth the book:

Weissrarech concentrates her efforts on the dispossessed population, a group of kine everyone ignores. Whether her packs raid slum apartment towers in Marseille and Berlin, attack West African harvesters in the Italian and English countryside or assault Bosnian Refugee Camps in Croatia, Weissrarech brings with her an impressive crusade of young Sabbat Tzimisce and antitribu skinheads.

Weissrarech runs amok with her pack, massacring and killing not only Camarilla vampires, but specifically targets humans other vampries ignore, the poor and the dispossessed on racist grounds. Her name, after all, means 'White Vengeance,' and she slaughters in immense numbers while following in the footsteps of her monstrous sire.

Mitigating Qualities?

There's not much to Weissrarech but what's there is fucking horrific. She chose a name that means 'White Vengeance,' and continues to be a Neo-Nazi serial killer as a vampire. Her body count, like Totentanz is huge and while she doesn't have the sheer quantity of her sire, the quality at play? She targets immigrants, refugees, goes out of her way to slaughter blacks, romani and Jews in major numbers and turns the areas into warzones. It's a touch of sheer vileness that other Sabbat simply lack, being more indiscriminate monsters and consider racism to just be sort of silly human things.

conclusion?

I'd say to keep her for this rather atrociously evil niche she carves out.

falcontalons from Earth-2 Since: Apr, 2019

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