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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

MGD107 Since: Feb, 2015
#211126: Apr 24th 2020 at 7:00:06 AM

[tup] to Isla.

Glad to hear your feeling better Mir, hope you continue to improve.

AlmightyKingPrawn I can chase the wind, I can race the rain from Down at Fraggle Rock *clap clap* Since: Oct, 2019 Relationship Status: I love you for psychological reasons
I can chase the wind, I can race the rain
#211127: Apr 24th 2020 at 7:56:12 AM

[tup] D'Arque and Isla

She/her. Profile pic is by Richard Michael Gomez @StarmansArt. Please watch Fraggle Rock: Back to the Rock. https://youtu.be/Vm92JNgPbqk
CloisterTheStupid from Oop North Since: Jan, 2019 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
MasterN Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button from Florida- I mean Unova Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#211130: Apr 24th 2020 at 8:09:29 AM

[tup] D’Arque, Ende, and Isla.

One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#211131: Apr 24th 2020 at 8:12:36 AM

My next...from A Twisted Tale, book 4: Part Of Your World.

The premise? Ariel, the Little Mermaid lost her bet. Defeated by the machinations of Ursula the Sea witch, she failed to win the heart of Prince Eric, ensnared by Ursula's cheating as 'Princess Vanessa'....King Triton traded his life for his daughter's, enslaved by Ursula as a mute Ariel is left to sadly rule Atlantica. But Ursula isn't satisfied at all, and plots much darker things...

Now...

Who is Ursula?

The sea-witch, known for her faustian bargains, which she inevitably cheats at and imprisons her victims as pathetic little sea polyps. After having cheated Ariel and enslaved Triton, Ursula rules above the waves in Prince Eric's kingdom, as Princes Vanessa, her husband magically enslaved. Now, I should note Eric has apparently never consummated the marriage and lives separate from her. Though it's implied this isn't for lack of trying as he's hinted to have kept a part of himself shielded from his wife and held on to that level of integrity at least.

And as an intro? Ursula intends on expanding the kingdom...by conquest, with no care at all for civilian lives that are lost in the princess. Now, Ariel is convinced to go to explore the human kingdom of Tirulia and recover her voice, seeing Ursula still reigning there, before she steals the necklace back and destroys it to recover her voice. Now, devoid of magic up above, Ursula begins to research ways to rectify this, that range from "the proper sacrifice of a small child" which she clearly has no issues with....now, Ariel begins reconnecting with Eric when his mind is his own again, as he tries to wrestle control from Vanessa...also noted? Despite knowing that sea creatures are sentient? She happily eats them.

Ursula then reveals she's found a way to use powers on land: a book she found from Carcosa, which gives her access to the powers of the Elder Gods. Going full Lovecraft, she knows the sacrifice of many people can appease the Elder Gods....now having been vexed by Ariel, Ursula wants payback since she can't start her wars. She plans to annihilate the merpeople, total genocide of them, while Ariel is left to know her people are exterminated and then she can play with humanity with her darker powers....and to use a sacrifice of a thousand people along with Triton,....beautiful quote?

Soon these Elder Gods would come and take the people of Tirulia as her offering and feed upon the soul of Triton. In return they would grant Ursula the unthinkable: power over two demesnes, two worlds that had always been separated under ancient, inviolate law. She would be the mightiest creature Gaia had ever seen—or bowed down to.

Hideous shrieks from beyond the stars rent the atmosphere, preparing the way for their singers to come through.

The crowd went deliciously mad. Like a mermaid's song turned inside out, the verses ripped into their skulls through their ears. People screamed, trying to block out the sound with their hands. The)- sank down to the ground, and Ursula saw precious, bright-red drops of blood start to seep between their fingers.

Well, all right, she conceded. It might hurt. A little...

And Ursula? Will make herself a god of the sea and land....Ariel manages to trick Ursula and engages her in battle, Ursula furiously saying she'll just kill all of humanity and the merpeople with the Elder Gods. In the struggle, Ursula tries to kill Eric and Ariel, but Eric manages to disarm Ursula's servant Flotsam and plants hi knife in Ursula's heart, ending in her death. The world is saved, Triton is freed and Ariel and Eric are finally together.

Heinousness?

Only villain and hahahahahaha...trying to start bloody wars, human sacrifice, mass death, trying for genocide of human and mer alike...yeah, what the heck else is there to say here? Ursula obliterates the standard. Savagely and without mercy.

Mitigating Qualities?

She doesn't even care about her pet eels here. No, Ursula is as evil as it gets, and willing to exterminate entire races for power. She has no loyalty to the Elder Gods, caring only for her own power here. She's openly cruel here, with not a smattering of goodness to her at all.

Conclusion?

Keep. And yes, the Lovecraft mythos is now a disney property.

SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#211132: Apr 24th 2020 at 8:14:22 AM

[tup] Ursula. Disney owns Cthulu? I guess that means that they get first dibs on The Neverkind Saga.

Edit: [up] I think that it would be worthwhile to use Humor Mode when cracking jokes. That legit confused me. Jokes can be a hit and miss with people on the Autism Spectrum, and even some neurotypicals.

Edited by SkyCat32 on Apr 24th 2020 at 11:57:18 AM

therealjackieboy from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#211134: Apr 24th 2020 at 8:17:22 AM

[tup] Ilsa. I accidentally almost spelled with an "E".

[tup]Ursula. I thought Lovecraft Mythos where in the public domain.

Edited by Beast on Apr 24th 2020 at 10:23:25 AM

"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#211135: Apr 24th 2020 at 8:18:09 AM

[tup]Maleficent , D'arque and Ursula.

What interesting sounding stories.

Does Jafar from the Aladdin one count ?

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Clown-Face Wild Child from Canada Since: Dec, 2015 Relationship Status: In another castle
Wild Child
#211136: Apr 24th 2020 at 8:20:49 AM

[tup]Ursula.

Why so serious?
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#211137: Apr 24th 2020 at 8:21:59 AM

Okay, Lovecraft is public domain and it should've been kinda obvious I was joking.

Jafar doesn't count. He has a redeeming quality or two. Prince Hans isn't bad enough.

Edited by Lightysnake on Apr 24th 2020 at 8:22:20 AM

Michealthehero21 Since: Jan, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#211140: Apr 24th 2020 at 8:25:39 AM

Since she doesn't care about the eels, sure to Ursula. Disney and Mythos pages?

Any other keepers?

Edited by ACW on Apr 24th 2020 at 11:26:05 AM

Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#211141: Apr 24th 2020 at 8:26:49 AM

It's just you cannot tell with what Disney owning and buying. I hear they want to buy the sun.

Moving on, but also speaking of, Austin finished one of his Cthulhu Mythos fics yesterday. I'll be handling the EP's tomorrow.

Edited by Beast on Apr 24th 2020 at 10:31:28 AM

"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#211142: Apr 24th 2020 at 8:27:46 AM

Why would this go to the mythos page? It's a few lines, just Disney.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#211144: Apr 24th 2020 at 8:30:07 AM

Since the Elder Gods are mentioned...

How are these books anyway? They seem interesting.

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#211145: Apr 24th 2020 at 8:31:56 AM

A brief mention of the Elder Gods does not make it part of the Mythos.

Can we not turn a fun EP into an exercise in pure exasperation for me, please?

Edited by Lightysnake on Apr 24th 2020 at 8:32:09 AM

falcontalons from Earth-2 Since: Apr, 2019
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#211147: Apr 24th 2020 at 8:40:50 AM

Alright, sorry.

How are the books? Worth reading, or nah?

ImperialMajestyXO Since: Nov, 2015
#211148: Apr 24th 2020 at 8:42:15 AM

Speaking of the Mythos, why did we decide Monster.Cthulhu Mythos would be literature-only, again?

papyru30 from Colorado for summer break Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
#211150: Apr 24th 2020 at 8:43:10 AM

Yes to Ursula. Little Mermaid and Lovecraftian Elder Gods... kind of makes sense as a combination, though I never expected an official Disney work would combine the two.


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