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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

falcontalons from Earth-2 Since: Apr, 2019
#205801: Mar 17th 2020 at 5:51:23 PM

[tup] to Sheridan and Andrews. Abstain on Tharquin.

EDIT: Changing to a yes on Tharquin after thinking about it some more, for the same reason as Scraggle.

Edited by falcontalons on Mar 17th 2020 at 5:59:40 AM

SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#205802: Mar 17th 2020 at 6:18:02 PM

Leaning [tup] Tharquin, since he chooses to embrace his abhorrent beliefs despite being shown their falsehood.

Edit: Definite yes, based on the points made below.

Edited by SkyCat32 on Mar 17th 2020 at 9:23:18 AM

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#205803: Mar 17th 2020 at 6:19:40 PM

I did the extra liberty of looking at the fic's character page too. Tharquin employs open flexibility in his "righteous cause"—he's willing to let go of Shapeshifters he tortures for the sake of public appearance—and he's called out in-universe as a Straw Hypocrite who's apparently one-half the member of the very things he's trying to destroy.

I'm not buying into any of that indoctrination stuff. He's a keeper.

Edited by Scraggle on Mar 17th 2020 at 7:26:55 AM

TheImmortalAngelNewton The MILF Virus Since: Aug, 2015 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The MILF Virus
#205805: Mar 17th 2020 at 6:25:25 PM

[tup] Lester, Michael and Alistar.

Allow me, take my hand and never let go, promise? - Giselle
TommyFresh Since: Aug, 2013
#205806: Mar 17th 2020 at 6:35:22 PM

[tup] Sheridan, Micolash, Andrews, and Tharquin. [tdown] to Bellamy. Having read the story I agree with Master N, it felt pretty ambiguous whether or not the baby was actually communicating with the mom. Even if we assume the baby was evil, I don't think it really does enough. Even if we grant that its resources are miniscule.

MasterN Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button from Florida- I mean Unova Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#205807: Mar 17th 2020 at 6:48:15 PM

[tup] Tharquin.

~ACW, please go ahead and put the Charlotte Ermengarde writeup in Complete Monster Drafts in the batch.

One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.
Libraryseraph uu~ from Canada (Handed A Sword) Relationship Status: Raising My Lily Rank With You
uu~
#205809: Mar 17th 2020 at 7:51:01 PM

[tup] to Andrews and Tharquin

HAPPY HALLOWEEN FOR MARIA
finalsurvivor1 Since: Jan, 2012
#205810: Mar 17th 2020 at 8:03:35 PM

Here's Garrard. Put him here when the entry's ready.

  • Garrard from the In-Game Novel Red Moon Rose is the true mastermind behind the Vampire Murders. One of the few remaining Elder Vampires, Garrard keeps a low profile by disguising himself as a military officer while going on a mass murder spree every decade to satiate his bloodlust. Years before the events of the novel, Garrard kills a man and his wife who were cooperating with the Vampire Hunter Rose; while he intended to kill their young son Alphonse, circumstances led to Garrard adopting the orphan in order to throw off the trail. When he took in another orphan, Elroy, Garrard treated him slightly worse than Alphonse to make Elroy easily corruptible and obsessed with pleasing Garrard. Shortly after making Elroy a vampire, Garrard sets him on the capital of Heimdallr to drain the blood of dozens of young women and turn them into undead, cannibalistic slaves. When Alphonse and Rose team up and defeat Elroy, Garrard reveals his true colors and kills Elroy, draining his power while emphasizing his love of manipulation and drinking blood.

DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
UltimateDemonBeast65 Since: Feb, 2018
#205812: Mar 17th 2020 at 8:46:47 PM

Since no one has decided to correct the error that movie Violator has in its entry, I'll do it instead. How does this sound?

  • Live-Action Film: Clown/Violator is as monstrous as his comic counterpart. The chief lieutenant of the devil Malebolgia, who sent him to Earth to start Armageddon, he's a revolting demon who gets off on violence and depravity, even at the expense of his allies. He makes a deal with black ops security chief Jason Wynn by offering him dominion of the world in exchange for creating a bioweapon that would kill most of humanity, after first having it tested on thousands of people. Malebolgia can then use the souls of the dead as his army to invade and destroy Heaven. Clown initially orders the death of Al Simmons/Spawn at Wynn's hands, recruiting Simmons after his return to Earth to lead Hell's army. He convinces Wynn to attach the virus to his heart rate after letting Spawn kill Wynn's top assassin, Jessica Priest, then manipulates Spawn into killing Wynn to release the virus. When this fails, the frustrated Clown tries to rape Spawn's ex-fiance Wanda in front of Spawn while forcing him to watch, and promises that he'll slaughter the rest of Wanda's family—including her and Terry's 4-year old daughter Cyan—when he's done.

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#205813: Mar 17th 2020 at 8:51:42 PM

My next Clark Ashton Smith example (probably my favorite for reasons that will soon be obvious) comes from the story "The Garden of Adompha." My candidate is, of course, Adompha.

Who is Adompha? What has he done?

Adompha, the Villain Protagonist of this story, is the vile ruler of the isle of Sotar. Adompha possesses a hidden garden secret to all but himself and his court magician, the equally-vile Dwerulas, and rumors pervade about the land as to what is inside of it. Particularly since people in the isle has a tendency to die or vanish in mysterious circumstances should they be disfavored by Adompha or Dwerulas.

The true purpose of the garden is perhaps more grisly than any story surrounding it. Adompha and Dwerulas' victims all end up as fodder for the garden itself. All the plants in the garden are people, all the victims of Adompha and Dwerulas fused with the plants, whole or in pieces. And there's a lot of them:

Thus were preserved the carefully chosen souvenirs of a multitude of persons who had inspired Dwerulas and the king with distaste or ennui. On palmy boles, beneath feathery-tufted foliage, the heads of eunuchs hung in bunches, like enormous black drupes. A bare, leafless creeper was flowered with the ears of delinquent guardsmen. Misshapen cacti were fruited with the breasts of women, or foliated with their hair. Entire limbs or torsos had been united with monstrous trees. Some of the huge salver-like blossoms bore palpitating hearts, and certain smaller blooms were centered with eyes that still opened and closed amid their lashes. And there were other graftings, too obscene or repellent for narration.

The victims are left not quite alive or dead but left in a state of "obscure sentience," forever bound by Dwerulas' magic as the cruel playthings of Adompha. Adompha, however, isn't satisfied even after having butchered countless innocents to fill the garden with their body parts. Adompha has one of latest wives taken to the garden—after lasting a "seldom-equaled" period of eight nights in Adompha's bed—to have her soft hands grafted to the plants and her body itself fed to the hand-plant to nourish it. While Dwerulas gets to work binding the body, Adompha, on nothing more than an impulse and a sudden feeling Dwerulas has lost his usefulness to him, murders his court magician by braining him with a spade. Adompha at first intends to set up Dwerulas' head among the plants, only abandoning the idea because the spade didn't leave much of Dwerulas' head.

Adompha, with a newly-cultivated dread about him after having killed Dwerulas, returns to his garden one day to relax again among the flowers of his atrocities. Suddenly, the plants begin to converge on him after subtle warnings—Dwerulas, having been buried in the garden, sets up one last posthumous curse to take his twisted master with him to the grave. Adompha is shredded apart by the plants, all of his victims taking revenge on him as one, the only mercy to his agony the soft, massaging hands of the servant girl he killed on his back as Adompha is taken apart...

Any mitigating factors?

Not a single one. Adompha is just a greedy tyrant who, although admittedly afraid of Dwerulas, only fears him for the reasons of personal health. Adompha kills him not out of standard but merely out of impulse and Adompha's opinion Dwerulas knows too many royal secrets for his own good.

Conclusion?

Easy keeper.

Edited by Scraggle on Mar 17th 2020 at 9:54:29 AM

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
GeorgieEnkoom Emperor Georgie Artémis Enkoom Evulz II from Somewhere. Since: Feb, 2017 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
Emperor Georgie Artémis Enkoom Evulz II
#205815: Mar 17th 2020 at 9:09:44 PM

Sure to Adompha.

Another for now before letting the others catch up...

What's the work?

Sacrifice (archive) is a horror one-shot written by Jinxyy and released only two months ago, in January 4, 2020.

See, Rebecca Cecilia Mallory is, like Chayne Summers, a bit too eager to find a way to resurrect her recently deceased daughter Anastasia Hope Mallory. She does. The issue? It's a Deal with the Devil.

Who's Satan? What has he done?

Satan agrees to resurrect Anastasia, but of course there has to be a price.

By price, I mean first losing painfully her eyes. Then she thinks it's enough... But then Satan tells her the price must be bigger because there are millions who cannot see like her. Cue the same invisible force that removed her eyes now painfully ripping off her ears.

Still not enough, Satan reasoning that there's plenty of people who can't see nor hear. Cue the invisible force ripping off Rebecca's tongue. And then moving on to her nose.

Still not enough. Rebecca thinks that Satan will kill her... But he says that there's no need for her to die. Just another sacrifice is required. Cue Rebecca being permanently paralyzed.

This time, however, it's enough. Satan fulfills his end of the bargain and resurrects Anastasia. No Came Back Wrong, or anything like that, if you're wondering.

In fact it's probably worse. Rebecca has been reduced to someone unable to speak, move, talk, smell or hear. But the vibrations of the scream are enough for her to realize her daughter is horrified by her new "look" and fled (not that Rebecca would be able to communicate to her in any way). While she's condemned to a And I Must Scream fate until she dies.

Heinous Standard?

Tortures a woman and dismember her while leaving her alive in an And I Must Scream situation, before bringing back her daughter, with the full knowledge that she'll be horrified by her mother's new appearance. No bodycount, but the sheer physical and psychological torture is, I believe, more than enough.

Generic Doomsday Villain issues?

Nope. He's a Soft-Spoken Sadist, who, while he remains calm for most of the story, sadistically chuckles upon resurrecting Anastasia, only announcing what was going to happen next when daughter and mother would reunite.

Redeeming qualities? Freudian Excuse?

Hashe.

Any other mitigating factors?

None that I can think of. Rebecca is sufficiently developed in my eyes for the story not to be grimdark stuff : she developed a severe case of misotheism, blaming God for killing her daughter and wanting to bring her back to any cost. Because God took her life, she refuses out of spite to ask God to resurrect her, instead turning to Satan to bring back Anastasia.

Verdict ?

Your call.

Edited by GeorgieEnkoom on Apr 12th 2022 at 5:48:38 PM

J’m’arrête pas tant qu’j’vois pas des lignes sur les moniteurs (Not stoppin 'til I see Flatlines)
IukaSylvie from Kyoto, Japan Since: Oct, 2017 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
ImperialMajestyXO Since: Nov, 2015
#205818: Mar 17th 2020 at 9:48:38 PM

[tup] to Tharquin, Adompha and Satan.

MasterN Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button from Florida- I mean Unova Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#205819: Mar 17th 2020 at 9:51:14 PM

[tup] Adompha and Old Scratch.

About Garrard, I find it funny that the CM who represents the third portion of the Trails Series is not from the actual plot at all, unlike Georg Weissman/Alba and Joachim Gunter.

Edited by MasterN on Mar 17th 2020 at 10:03:25 AM

One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.
G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
TheMadCr0w (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Get out of here, STALKER
KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Shin Megami Tensei IV
#205822: Mar 17th 2020 at 10:33:10 PM

So, I saw Daimos after playing Super Robot Wars A and well, King Olnan is a sure keeper but his entry for some reason lacks his biggest crime.

Before being killed, Olban reveals that he keeps most of the population of his planet frozen and threatens to cut their life support. Once he is legally wounded, Orban mocks his killer and reveals that he connected his life signs with the colony, ensuring that after his death, the other Brahmins would fall to Jupiter and die.

Trying to murder your own population out of spite. That...definitely deserves to be on the entry

Edited by KazuyaProta on Mar 17th 2020 at 1:04:09 PM

Watch me destroying my country
captainmarkle Limited Patients from Behind you Since: Feb, 2011 Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
#205823: Mar 18th 2020 at 12:13:08 AM

[tup]Michael Andrews

[tup] Dr. Lester Sheridan

[tup] Micolash

[tup] Tarquin

[tup] Satan

Reluctant abstain on Bellamy. It sounds nasty, but there's a bit too much ambiguity.

Trans rights are human rights. If you don't think that, please leave.
PureGrainAlkaSeltzer The Lord Of Walruses from 1200 Pennsylvania Ave Since: Apr, 2019 Relationship Status: Getting away with murder
The Lord Of Walruses
#205824: Mar 18th 2020 at 12:39:27 AM

[tup] to Andrews, Sheridan, Tarquin, Adompha, and Satan

Edited by PureGrainAlkaSeltzer on Mar 18th 2020 at 12:17:02 PM

I have no idea what I am doing
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#205825: Mar 18th 2020 at 1:57:11 AM

[tup] Andrews, Sheridan, Tarquin, and Satan

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."

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