During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
ACW: Danes is a pedophile which is very unique for the franchise and he has next to no resources. Even most of the other human keepers have more resources than him. If this was Law and Order or Criminal Minds he wouldn't make it. However for a universe like Doctor Who, he keeps. And we do see enough evidence of it. We've been over this before when I made the rewrite.
Edited by Bullman on Mar 16th 2020 at 6:01:39 AM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread@finalsurvivor1: I don’t see the issue. Feel free to EP your candidate
Keep Danes. He’s unique enough to stand out, with his rape of a child
My sandbox of EPs and other stuffACW: Yes his crime if raping a child is very unique. Again if this was a crime drama or something I would happily cut. But that is very unique for the franchise and again he's got literally no resources.
Look I'm not going to keep debating this point, especially when I don't even like the season and don't really care either way. I have said my peace.
Edited by Bullman on Mar 16th 2020 at 6:12:50 AM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup threadACW: If people decide he keeps, I can rewrite him again if you want. Though I don't really think he needs a rewrite myself.
Edited by Bullman on Mar 16th 2020 at 6:18:33 AM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread@MGD: I don't see a need to change the picture; it represents the trope well, and I don't think it's necessary to have an iconic villain provide the page image.
Keep Danes; serial child rape seems a unique niche in the Whoniverse, and Torchwood seems standalone enough from Doctor Who that I think we can judge it on its own merits. I also don't think he needs another rewrite.
Edited by falcontalons on Mar 16th 2020 at 4:26:36 AM
I can't comment on Big Finish, I never listened to a single one.
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup threadCut the King.
What do people think of this image of Face from the Punisher comics (warning, its gruesome):
Apparently that image is the character page for Punisher villains under Face's profile:
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Characters/ThePunisherVillains
Edited by Overlord on Mar 16th 2020 at 4:36:49 AM
The Big Finish website
does have the audio for the series, you just gotta pay up to listen to each installment of each series
I also found this on the MonsterVerse page
- Alan Jonah, a misanthropic sociopath who originally planned to use Ghidorah to purge humanity and save the environment. When Ghidorah is revealed to be an alien with an endgame to destroy all life on earth...Jonah is perfectly fine anyway to let him have his way.
did I miss something or should I cut it. While he does sound bad... Ghidorah, just Ghidorah
Edit: thank you Austin DR
Edited by nwotyzal on Mar 16th 2020 at 5:05:36 AM
Cut that. He doesn't count at all. He has some redeeming qualities and isn't heinous enough.
Edited by Bullman on Mar 16th 2020 at 7:11:50 AM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup threadRotten Potatoes edited Muzan's entry on the YMMV subpage of Demon Slayer: Kimetsu no Yaiba, and I don't think it was approved by the thread:
- Muzan Kibutsuji is the first and mightiest demon. Obsessed with his own perfection, Muzan corrupts others into demons and develops the system where demons prey on humans, leading to countless innocent deaths, including the family and siblings of the young hero Tanjiro Kamado, as well as the demonic transformation of his young sister Nezuko. When encountered, Muzan escapes notice by turning an innocent man into a demon and siccing him on his wife before killing several other humans in a fit of pique when they trouble him. Muzan orders countless humans slaughtered, and when his subordinates, the Lower Demon Moons, disappoint him, Muzan massacres the survivors, deciding they are too weak to survive. And not to mention, he is a corrupt influence who took advantage of Kyogai, Gyutaro, Daki/Ume, Tamayo, Kokushibo/Michikatsu, and Akaza/Hakuji's respective weakness and emotional trauma in order to put them under his will. Throughout the dark world of Kimetsu, Muzan repeatedly shows the monstrosity of demonkind.
I don't think Ghidorah is an issue with Jonah. That's a Textbook case of recourses as Gidorah is a powerful Kaiju whereas Jonah is just a human.
The issue with him is he has mitigating qualities, such as his backstory of being jaded with the Govermant after fighting in wars.
Things are really about to get Fun around hereI got one answer already, but I'd like a couple more opinions to my question last page
before I go forward with my proposal.

ACW: As we're reformatting the page, would it possible to change the main image. I mean Mrs Gillyflower is an easy keeper, but she's a pretty insignificant MOTW in the scheme of things.
It kind of feels like it should be someone more important or at least more iconic.
Can't comment on Danes, I never saw Miracle Day.
Edited by MGD107 on Mar 16th 2020 at 4:09:17 AM