During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Well we have photographic evidence so why not. The Shooter duo are similar.
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button
This
, this
, and this
might help. The videos are of the evidence room.
Also, none of the photos seen in the videos actually show Merrick engaging in murder, and none even show the victims. Not even a single corpse is shown. The photos are mainly of his associates. So 'photographic evidence' is right out. Only a few police reports. This is textbook Offstage Villainy, and should be an instant disqualifier.
Edited by MasterN on Dec 28th 2019 at 5:14:42 AM
One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.A corpse isn't needed, we just need evidence of the crime itself.
In Extremely wicked, shockingly evil and vile we never see a corpse or see Ted murder anyone, but there's enough evidence of the murders he counts.
EDIT:The thing about not seeing his victims is actually of concern, second opinions on that?
Edited by Kylotrope on Dec 28th 2019 at 5:24:29 AM
Things are really about to get Fun around hereOkay that is not okay. If that's true. I'm fine cutting.
Any more votes on Larry /Eric ?
We actually do seem him kill Somone their. Plus the film is ABOUT his crimes so hi can't argue offstage villainy as we know about his victims well we learn this from some random looking arpund the dudes place. If we don't get a single name or photo of one of his victims I'm not fine keep in him up.
Edited by miraculous on Dec 28th 2019 at 5:25:28 AM
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."I'm for Keeping Merrick, having played the game myself. Merrick is no Jefferson, but he's a different type of scumbag altogether. He attempts to kill several teenagers, brutalizes others and breaks the arm of a young teen after assaulting the boy's older brother (or breaking said brother's leg), stabs his partner and tries to kill him for the heinous crime of preventing Merrick from murdering a teenage girl, tortures Sera and threatens to rekindle her drug addiction, and implies he'll do the same to Chloe after beating her. And despite there being no pictures of his previous victims, his evidence locker has a detailed report of how he clubbed someone to the point of hospitalization with a fire poker, and his evidence bags of a knife and bullet casings have the name of a victim on them, sooooo
Onscreen murders don't matter; Merrick tries several times to kill and assault teenagers, so though I'd argue the "sexual assault" part is reaching, Merrick has more than enough in attempted murder and general douchebaggery for me, especially since he's an entirely different villain than Jefferson.
Edited by Ravok on Dec 28th 2019 at 6:11:15 AM
No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!It's very much a case-by-case basis. If it comes to a point where it's a recurring topic and it genuinely bogs down the thread, we slap them on the list. Coming up a few times with annoyed comments here and there isn't necessarily protocol for the Resolved Items list; we're sparing with additions for a reason.
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Would you think that Ruuvitar from the Elder Scrolls Online could count as a CM? Someone tried to propose this character earlier but did not do a proper effort post and I would like your opinion.
Edited by Draxterrus on Dec 28th 2019 at 10:51:36 PM
Humanity is defined by its absurdity, and I am no exception.If the original troper won't step up to EP him, I can look closer there. I never found out about him, but I don't think any other villain in Elder Scrolls gets to that level of Would Hurt a Child. At the very least, I can confidently say that would stand out.
Edited by Scraggle on Dec 28th 2019 at 8:00:42 AM
Berserk Button: misusing Berserk Button
About Merrick. I did link three videos on this post
, all of which show off the evidence room, the part in doubt here. So if you want to take a look and have a better informed opinion, go ahead.
Also, as another comparison, consider Colonel Hopkins. At first I doubted he really qualified- his actions in the present mostly just seem like standard Big Bad stuff. Then I remembered what he did in the past- massacred am entire city. We see this through Noel's flashbacks showing off the pile of dead bodies, however briefly, but this is clear evidence, and it is what ultimately pushed Hopkins past the baseline.
Merrick has no such thing. None of the photos are related to his crimes. Much in the way that Lisbeth could be considered a 'bog-standard' cult leader, I see Merrick as a bog-standard crime boss. Essentially, his onscreen crimes amount to injuring a kid and trying to kill the heroes- which, as has been pointed out before, is standard villainy. His actions are awful, but, even when taking resources into account, he just does not measure up to Jefferson.
Edited by MasterN on Dec 28th 2019 at 7:10:06 AM
One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.I'm going to go with Duck and just stay away from Merrick. I don't care either way, and I'm not going to play the game anytime soon.
Edited by Bullman on Dec 28th 2019 at 9:10:58 AM
Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread

Several sexual assaults and murders that are never shown.
One of these days, all of you will accept me as your supreme overlord.