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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#192651: Nov 23rd 2019 at 3:44:41 PM

[tup]Madeline

Yeah Chase doesn't count. He was legit twisted by his abuse and being sexually groomed as a child by his mother.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#192652: Nov 23rd 2019 at 3:45:43 PM

[tup] Madeline.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#192654: Nov 23rd 2019 at 3:47:30 PM

Ah,yes that was who I was thinking off.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Libraryseraph uu~ from Canada (Handed A Sword) Relationship Status: Raising My Lily Rank With You
uu~
#192655: Nov 23rd 2019 at 3:50:22 PM

[tup] to the Mandarin

Abstain on Madeline, due to the heinous standard

HAPPY HALLOWEEN FOR MARIA
falcontalons from Earth-2 Since: Apr, 2019
#192656: Nov 23rd 2019 at 3:53:38 PM

Yes to Madeline (can't wait to see the Enfant Terrible get effortposted, assuming she counts), but not feeling the Mandarin image; I don't think it's clear enough.

Edited by falcontalons on Nov 23rd 2019 at 3:53:49 AM

k410ren Since: Jan, 2016
#192657: Nov 23rd 2019 at 3:53:49 PM

No problem with Mandarin.

Is it possible to put my kill tally in a Sandbox, just for fun?

Edited by k410ren on Nov 23rd 2019 at 6:54:45 AM

"I'll show you the Dark Side." CM actors and kills
Sircray Since: Apr, 2018
#192658: Nov 23rd 2019 at 3:54:21 PM

And yeah skeleton king doesn't count as his backstory is really, really awful.

Yeah.

There was an episode where the Alchemist and the Skeleton King were shown fighting each other ("Abomination!"/"There is nothing you can do to stop me, you pathetic shell!") in the Dream Land, which could indicate that they are independent entities like Angel and Angelus or Abel Plenko and the Riverton Ripper, but even if that was the case, the Skeleton King came off as being just plain Made of Evil.

Interestingly, Skeleton King is voiced by Hamill.

And he sounded almost exactly like the Hobgoblin.

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#192659: Nov 23rd 2019 at 3:54:28 PM

Oh I know what's happening in it since I've seen the show but I think anyone who hasn't probably wouldn't

Edit: I meant the pic that Georgie showed that people aren't confused by this post.

Edited by miraculous on Nov 23rd 2019 at 3:55:28 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Shin Megami Tensei IV
#192660: Nov 23rd 2019 at 3:55:07 PM

[tup]Mandarin

[tdown] Madeline Bullock

[tdown]Admiral Chang Wei

[tup] Sebastion Koss

Watch me destroying my country
Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Enid Sinclair
#192661: Nov 23rd 2019 at 4:02:49 PM

Abstain on Madeline though leaning yes.

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#192662: Nov 23rd 2019 at 4:05:43 PM

Abusing pregnant women and mutilating teenage mother's is pretty bad even for this series guys. Or you raping her son for decades. Not sure what you have a problem with exactly ?

Can I get an exAct reason since I've read most of the novels in this series and that's still easily bad enough.

Edited by miraculous on Nov 23rd 2019 at 4:11:17 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#192663: Nov 23rd 2019 at 4:12:07 PM

I haven't even read the novels, and I still question how the fuck baby trafficking, on top of what mir mentioned, is insufficiently heinous.

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Enid Sinclair
#192664: Nov 23rd 2019 at 4:12:11 PM

@miraculous: I abstained because I don't know the series or genre well enough. However if those crimes are unique. Sure to her. That was my first impulse, but I second guessed my instinct.

Edited by Bullman on Nov 23rd 2019 at 6:15:47 AM

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#192665: Nov 23rd 2019 at 4:14:11 PM

Yeah, if it were just murders, it wouldn't be enough, but I THINK (I could be wrong) Human Trafficking is rare.

G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#192667: Nov 23rd 2019 at 4:16:39 PM

There's also the slavery, mutalations, and sexually abusing her son his entire life.

I think acw your maybe underplaying her a bit having read it.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
GeorgieEnkoom Emperor Georgie Artémis Enkoom Evulz II from Somewhere. Since: Feb, 2017 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
Emperor Georgie Artémis Enkoom Evulz II
#192668: Nov 23rd 2019 at 4:16:40 PM

[up][up][up]True. In fact, I'm leaning yes if only for that, but for now I'm still abstaining.

Edited by GeorgieEnkoom on Nov 23rd 2019 at 1:45:31 PM

J’m’arrête pas tant qu’j’vois pas des lignes sur les moniteurs (Not stoppin 'til I see Flatlines)
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
AlmightyKingPrawn I can chase the wind, I can race the rain from Down at Fraggle Rock *clap clap* Since: Oct, 2019 Relationship Status: I love you for psychological reasons
I can chase the wind, I can race the rain
#192670: Nov 23rd 2019 at 4:24:05 PM

[tup] Mandarin

Edited by AlmightyKingPrawn on Nov 23rd 2019 at 7:24:43 AM

She/her. Profile pic is by Richard Michael Gomez @StarmansArt. Please watch Fraggle Rock: Back to the Rock. https://youtu.be/Vm92JNgPbqk
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#192671: Nov 23rd 2019 at 4:25:02 PM

I mean she exceeds most villains in this series which is all that really matters.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Sircray Since: Apr, 2018
#192672: Nov 23rd 2019 at 4:30:44 PM

That being said, I've found an image of Mandarin... True, when he was still a good guy, but still pulling something quite depraved. Up to you if you like the image or not.

Here's cleared up versions.

Since it was brought up, I also have these:

Edited by Sircray on Nov 23rd 2019 at 8:44:24 AM

ImperialMajestyXO Since: Nov, 2015
Michealthehero21 Since: Jan, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#192674: Nov 23rd 2019 at 4:49:38 PM

Those Mandarin images look good. Especially that third one.

TiMBer1566 kittykat from Virginia Since: Nov, 2018 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
kittykat
#192675: Nov 23rd 2019 at 4:56:31 PM

Does a villain finding a evil act disgusting, not because they find it going to far or overly immoral, but just plain gross count as Even Evil Has Standards? And if it does, can it apply to a CM anyway?


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