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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#186901: Oct 12th 2019 at 11:45:28 AM

Wait, we don't meet Jack at all? Not even through an intermediary?

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#186902: Oct 12th 2019 at 11:51:14 AM

So unless I've missed something he died a century and a half before the story and never appears in person and his personality is something you need to incur from what little we know about him rather then you know there.

Edited by miraculous on Oct 12th 2019 at 11:54:40 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#186903: Oct 12th 2019 at 11:54:24 AM

He's believed dead in story, but at the same time they make it clear his spirit still lingers and haunts the town. Those pumpkins with people's faces carved on them just sprout from the ground.

ACW: The only intermediary is the stories narrator who describes Jack and his apparent personality in the second person.

Edited by Beast on Oct 12th 2019 at 1:56:48 PM

"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#186904: Oct 12th 2019 at 11:55:23 AM

[tdown]pumpkin then

Sounds way too ambiguous.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#186905: Oct 12th 2019 at 11:55:41 AM

No to Jack. If you ever say "we don't actually meet him," that's an automatic no for me. The trope that fits more is Ultimate Evil.

falcontalons from Earth-2 Since: Apr, 2019
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#186907: Oct 12th 2019 at 12:03:23 PM

What Lighty said. Radical Destruction Bringer gets a pass because it has intermediaries.

Edited by ACW on Oct 12th 2019 at 3:04:42 PM

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#186908: Oct 12th 2019 at 12:10:02 PM

He also has you know a personality rather then hints of one we need to incur from second hand sources.

Edited by miraculous on Oct 12th 2019 at 12:10:59 PM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Awesomekid42 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: It was only a kiss
#186909: Oct 12th 2019 at 12:16:39 PM

Don't we actually have a candidate who we never meet though? Some pedophile from a creepypasta called Pen Pal?

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#186910: Oct 12th 2019 at 12:17:17 PM

We have literal letters from that guy, don't we?

CloisterTheStupid from Oop North Since: Jan, 2019 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Awesomekid42 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: It was only a kiss
#186912: Oct 12th 2019 at 12:23:35 PM

[up][up] From what I looked up, the only letters from the stalker that the protagonist gets are photos the stalker took

TheMadCr0w (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Get out of here, STALKER
#186913: Oct 12th 2019 at 12:37:51 PM

[up] Actually, he does make a physical appearance, albeit very briefly.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#186914: Oct 12th 2019 at 12:40:11 PM

Works for me. We have MANY villains who appear very briefly (Criminal Minds, Bellisarioverse, etc).

DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
DelphineTheDelphox I thought sharks were my friends. from The Alola Region Since: Jul, 2019 Relationship Status: Squeeeeeeeeeeeee!
I thought sharks were my friends.
#186916: Oct 12th 2019 at 12:57:38 PM

Sure to Frosty.

RIP KissAnime.
Riley1sCool Since: Dec, 2014
#186917: Oct 12th 2019 at 1:12:54 PM

This entry looks unapproved on Deadbolt.

  • Complete Monster: Madam Stela has no endearing qualities whatsoever. Puff is a Harmless Villain by the rest of the game's standards, as a lowly accountant for his gang. Roland cares about his men and stays away from the other factions because he wants to stop them from exploiting his fellow zombies. Ibzan is surprisingly sympathetic for all of the horror that he causes, given his tortured existence before and after he left the Fire to become lord of the Dredged. Madam Stela despises the undead, including her own minions, who she summarily sacrifices to make Ash, and murders her husbands on a whim after the most insignificant slight or difference. All so she can selfishly profit from the success of Ibzan's plans.

I'd say she counts, except we don't see many of her deeds onscreen. Permission to remove?

DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#186919: Oct 12th 2019 at 1:36:26 PM

Go ahead and remove

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
lrrose Since: Jul, 2009
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#186922: Oct 12th 2019 at 2:51:35 PM

I found whatever the hell this is on Chwe Goleadau

  • Complete Monster: "The Enemy," aka Schaden, has no remorse and desires to learn about pain, doing things such as torturing and disfiguring the protagonist, and using illusions and mind control to make everyone hate him. These action however, are but a mere prelude to when he find out he intends to create a "World of Pain," which involves reducing every single living being in Equestria to nothing but an eternally tormented, howling, horribly conscious biomass. Finally, it decides to up its apocalypse class from at most a Class X to at least a Class X-5.

The entry is uh weird. Plus I uh have no clue what this work is.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#186923: Oct 12th 2019 at 3:05:43 PM

Okay, that took a little bit of research, but here you go. Since it's not on the fan works page, I'd just say add that YMMV to the Cut List.

[down] Yeah. Looks like the YMMV was last updated nearly 4 years ago.

Edited by ACW on Oct 12th 2019 at 6:10:00 AM

chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#186924: Oct 12th 2019 at 3:06:19 PM

[nja]

My best guess it was added back before the thread purged most of the Pony fanfic villains, and the YMMV page was orphaned afterwards.

Edited by chasemaddigan on Oct 12th 2019 at 6:06:45 AM

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#186925: Oct 12th 2019 at 3:21:29 PM

Okay, so I'll just request locking the Simon Green page when I submit the batch Monday. I DID take care of the Reborn! stuff, the Bombshells stuff, and the Batman stuff.


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