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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

SkyCat32 The Draftsman of Doom (Five Year Plan) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
The Draftsman of Doom
#162026: May 8th 2019 at 12:04:26 PM

I have not effortposted anyone named Max, but I have a goal to find such a candidate.

My sister would have been named Zach if she were a boy, so I affectionately call her Zacky.

Edited by SkyCat32 on May 8th 2019 at 3:06:34 PM

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#162027: May 8th 2019 at 12:05:38 PM

Moving on, does anyone have any more votes for Cinnabar?

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#162028: May 8th 2019 at 12:06:46 PM

Yes to the ghost pirate.

Vorgitch. It may depend on if he was planning to kill all the other kids or not.

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
futuremoviewriter Since: Jun, 2014
#162030: May 8th 2019 at 12:09:24 PM

@Sky Not sure I could find one who would count that hasn’t been discussed already. There’s Vincent Ludwig from The Naked Gun and the one played by Tom Cruise from Collateral, but neither of those count though (and neither probably will due to reasons of work can’t support a CM and redeeming qualities respectively).

I’m done now.

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#162031: May 8th 2019 at 12:14:14 PM

Jeeeeeez, this thread's impossible to keep up with lately. Yes to all of Lighty's FF examples.

Brainulator9 Short-Term Projects herald from US Since: Aug, 2018 Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
Short-Term Projects herald
#162032: May 8th 2019 at 12:16:18 PM

[up] Are there any threads that move faster than this? I swear you all move at breakneck pace.

Contains 20% less fat than the leading value brand!
futuremoviewriter Since: Jun, 2014
#162033: May 8th 2019 at 12:19:23 PM

[up]Things do slow down on occasion. Could be that it’s very late at night where I am when that usually happens.

Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#162034: May 8th 2019 at 12:22:50 PM

Catching up.

[tup] Carnus.

[tup] Killnor.

[tup] Cinnabun.

"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
Michealthehero21 Since: Jan, 2019 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
#162035: May 8th 2019 at 12:28:21 PM

[tup] to everyone i’ve missed, including Frost, kinda feel bad for Sub Zero at this point, especially since his student turned into an complete and utter monster.

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#162036: May 8th 2019 at 12:32:30 PM

So what order are we putting the new MK entries. There obviously going to the bottom of the video game tree but is it kronika first since only the new timeline version of Frost has been approved or have frost go before kronika if were doing chronologcial order anyway even if her quantifying stuff came later.

Edited by miraculous on May 8th 2019 at 12:33:01 PM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
erazor0707 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
MGD107 Since: Feb, 2015
#162038: May 8th 2019 at 12:44:38 PM

[tup] to The Sheriff of Nottingham, Frost, Lord Carnuss Charavask, Lord Kelnor and Franklins and Captain Cinnabar.

Mir: Vorgitch, well he killed five people in a random massacre years earlier. Kills two people to escape prison, another to get a gun, then kills the teacher and shoots four children. So thirteen in total, in two killing spree's each in less than a day.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#162039: May 8th 2019 at 12:47:03 PM

I ask again: Did Vorgitch intend on killing all his child hostages?

Also, looks like Bruner was grandfathered in. I remember this guy was voted down for not being heinous enough, but if Bruner "only" killed his victims, either Malik should be reevaluated, or Bruner should go.

FWIW, Masucci and Rausch are clear keepers, and Volsky not only killed a kid but tried to blow up a police precinct so he's probably okay.

Edited by ACW on May 8th 2019 at 3:52:37 PM

G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
The 47th President
#162041: May 8th 2019 at 1:05:41 PM

[tup] to the sherif, Frost, and the FF candidates

My sandbox of EPs and other stuff
Overlord Since: Mar, 2013
#162042: May 8th 2019 at 1:29:43 PM

Yes to Lord Carnuss, Lord Kelno, Franklins and Captain Cinnabar.

Edited by Overlord on May 8th 2019 at 2:10:03 AM

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
CloisterTheStupid from Oop North Since: Jan, 2019 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
#162044: May 8th 2019 at 1:34:16 PM

[tup] Carnuss, Kelnor, Franklins and Cinnabar.

ImperialMajestyXO Since: Nov, 2015
#162045: May 8th 2019 at 1:38:42 PM

[tup] to Carnuss, Kelnor, Franklins and Cinnabar.

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#162046: May 8th 2019 at 1:54:34 PM

@ACW: Just going by the wiki, it looks like the threat was at least made and it seemed intent on carrying it out (if he was shooting the kids?).

futuremoviewriter Since: Jun, 2014
#162047: May 8th 2019 at 1:58:09 PM

Bruner has the added cruelty of withholding the info as to where the bodies are because he’s gonna be executed and being incredibly gleeful about not giving the families any peace. He also lets his attorney in on the info who believes he has to keep it secret. Thus, the attorney either reveals the info and potentially loses his law license or refuses and goes down as an accomplice (the latter happens).

Edited by futuremoviewriter on May 8th 2019 at 2:27:21 AM

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#162048: May 8th 2019 at 2:07:14 PM

If that's the case, I'm fine with keeping Brunner. For accuracy's sake, does he rape?

ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#162049: May 8th 2019 at 2:08:23 PM

Yes to candidates I missed

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#162050: May 8th 2019 at 2:11:50 PM

Here's a Fighting Fantasy quote from Xakhaz: "The descendants of those who imprisoned me here shall die-quickly, if they grovel for mercy. All will make a useful contribution, however. They are the raw materials for my army of conquest!


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