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Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

    Effortpost template 
What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by nombretomado on Mar 31st 2020 at 8:15:08 AM

Michealthehero21 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Michealthehero21 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Apr 9th 2019 at 4:49:06 PM

Oh, I just looked up the discussion date, and today is the discussion for Final Fantasy XV Episode Ardyn. Seeing that no reserved it, and having played the episode myself, no one minds if I proceed to reserve the discussion, I have a lot to say about it.

erazor0707 The Unknown Unknown Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
The Unknown Unknown
Apr 9th 2019 at 5:02:22 PM

[tup] Shadow Man.

[up] Go ahead. Been curious to see how Ardyn holds up with this DLC.

Copyright? Plz, I'm a troper.
Apr 9th 2019 at 5:14:04 PM

Oh, I'll be chiming in there.

DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
TommyFresh Relationship Status: Maxing my social links
Apr 9th 2019 at 5:39:10 PM

[tup] Morgo, the High Priest, and the Shadow Man.

Having played Episode Ardyn as well, the discussion will definitely be interesting.

Apr 9th 2019 at 5:42:43 PM

[tup] to The High Priest Of Chaos and The Shadow Man. When did this series get so fantastical?

Kylotrope The Perfectionist from Honolulu Hawaii
The Perfectionist
Apr 9th 2019 at 6:00:46 PM

[tup] to Shadow man

Evolution Requires Sacrifice
Scraggle Musha ring dum a doo dum a da from Calgary Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Musha ring dum a doo dum a da
Apr 9th 2019 at 6:07:30 PM

Yea to G's Call of Duty ones. I kinda feel, insofar as I even have a niche here with the breadth I've proposed from, I'm the obligatory "Lovecraft" guy.

There's whiskey in the jar-o
Beast from Ontario, Canada Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
Apr 9th 2019 at 6:13:24 PM

[tup] High Priest and Shadow Guy.

I guess I'm the one who just proposes whatever's on his plate.

Mr. Peanut; corporate fatcat, colonizer, slave owner, once cucked a guy. Least we forget.
G-Editor It's his favorite from North Korea Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
It's his favorite
Apr 9th 2019 at 6:15:22 PM

[up][up] Funny since one of my COD candidates is very Lovecraft influenced. say have you played any Call Of Duty games especially Call of Duty: Black Ops III since its the most Lovecraft influenced?

Edited by G-Editor on Apr 9th 2019 at 3:15:32 AM

What happens when a dictator hears a Katey Perry song.
Scraggle Musha ring dum a doo dum a da from Calgary Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Musha ring dum a doo dum a da
Apr 9th 2019 at 6:16:00 PM

Never touched the series extensively.

There's whiskey in the jar-o
Tyk5919 Badger in a Nice Suit Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Apr 9th 2019 at 6:26:28 PM

[tup] Black Ops. duo. Just make a damn zombie series already, Activision. You may as well at this point.

Suppose I'm the talking animal/dragon/dinosaur/werebeast guy when it comes to niches. Although I've noticed I've done an alarming amount of Karma Houdini villains...

I write stories and shiz. You can read them here.
DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
Apr 9th 2019 at 6:26:29 PM

My miche is B-movies and Golden Age comics.

Ongoing Projects
G-Editor It's his favorite from North Korea Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
It's his favorite
Apr 9th 2019 at 6:35:07 PM

My cliche seems to be Live Action TV shows and AAA video games (especially NCIS, Assassins Creed, and as of recently Call of Duty). Though I did post various anime one before.

What happens when a dictator hears a Katey Perry song.
AustinDR Experience perfection. from Fresh and ready for life.
Experience perfection.
Apr 9th 2019 at 6:36:05 PM

For myself, it's movies.

Why you little-!
ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
Apr 9th 2019 at 6:39:32 PM

Come to think of it... My niche seems leaning towards Seasonal Animes as I reserved some of it and possibly going to cover Ghostbuster stuffs... But that was Overlord's niche more than anything.

But I might wanting to get out of my comfort zone and hopefully there will be a franchise or niche suitable to my comfort and cover more than just animanga proposals

And yea on Shadowman I guess.

Edited by ElfenLiedFan90 on Apr 9th 2019 at 8:40:56 PM

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
AustinDR Experience perfection. from Fresh and ready for life.
Experience perfection.
Apr 9th 2019 at 6:50:53 PM

My only real issue is that with things like seasonal anime, it's leaning slightly towards preventing others from reserving it.

Why you little-!
SumDumNerd Peekin' at you... from behind you Relationship Status: Drowning in your pond, hoping you'll notice me
Peekin' at you...
Apr 9th 2019 at 7:13:01 PM

[tup] to the Shadow Man

I've been poking around to see if I could find any more theme park monsters, but the market's mostly saturated with just killers with no personalities, groups, or amoral monsters nowadays.

Read Kingdom Hearts: Forgotten Worlds here.
Michealthehero21 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Apr 9th 2019 at 7:46:53 PM

Alright, and now for the discussion itself, here we go.....

Final Fantasy XV is an 2017 action rpg game which stars an young prince named, Noctis Lucis Caelum, and his bodyguards/best friends, Ignis Prompto, and Gladiolus, as they begin the journey for Noctis to become King after his father was killed by the imperials in their invasion of the kingdom. Our good friend, Lightysnake had already discussed the main game a while back, but today, we will discussing the final dlc of the game, Episode Ardyn, which stars current CM, Ardyn Izunia, my personal favorite Final Fantasy Villain, the big bad of the main game, and the villain protagonist of the DLC as it gives us the complete details of Ardyn’s origin story, and boy it’s a doozy.

Many years prior to the events of Final Fantasy XV, Ardyn Izunia, known back then as Ardyn Lucis Caelum, was once an kind hearted, noble, and idealistic healer originally meant to be the ruler of Insomnia who wanted to cure his people of the Starscourge turning them into daemons, unlike his envious brother, Somnus, who outright burned the people infected with the Starscourge, as shown in animated Episode Ardyn Prologue. Ardyn was also revealed to have an fiancé, then oracle Aera, who he clearly loves as seen in his interactions with her, with one example involving Aera telling Ardyn that she will always remember him. Of course, during his healing of the people, he is infected with the Starscourge himself, but keeps it hidden, believing it to be treatable, as he and his brother await for the gods’ decision of which one will rule insomnia, with Ardyn hoping that the crystal chooses him to save Eos, and the people consider Ardyn an hero for his actions.

One day, Ardyn traveled to crystal when he received word that he would be king. Unfortunately, it turns out to be a trap, as Somnus smugly reveals that the gods chose HIM to be king, and accuses Ardyn to be an traitor due to his Starscourge infection, and fights Ardyn for the throne, with Somnus eventually overpowering Ardyn. But before Somnus could deal the finishing blow, Aera sacrifices herself to protect Ardyn by getting in the way Somnus swung his blade, killing her in the process, to Ardyn’s horror and grief as Somnus mocks Aera’s sacrifice and tells Ardyn to forgive him as he must accept his kingly calling. Ardyn’s Starscourge infection to fully manifest, as Ardyn, as he is being RUTHLESSLY stabbed and assaulted by Somnus and Gilgamesh, approached the crystal with Aera’s body in the hopes of healing her and finding out the gods’ true decision... Only for the Astrals to violently reject him and cast him aside, rejecting him because of his Starscourge infection that he absorbed during his healing of the people. As Adryn realizes that the gods forsaken him, Somnus executes Ardyn on the spot and ascends the throne as founder king. Ardyn couldn’t exactly die however due to the Starscourge infection, as it rendered him immortal, leaving Somnus to have Ardyn imprisoned in angelgard, and had all traces of him erased from history. And all of that was from the animated prologue.

The actual DLC continues to show us Ardyn’s tragedy by revealing that Ardyn is haunted by visions of the memories of Aera’s death. One vision is an retailing of her death from the prologue, but the next vision he receives is even worse. In it, Ardyn finds An wounded Aera, who tearfully tells Ardyn that she had told Somnus that the gods chose him as king, resulting in Somnus attempting to kill Ardyn so he could usurp the throne. Aera then proceeds to blame herself for everything that happened, but Ardyn tells her she is not to blame, before yelling at the gods to tell him why they burdened them with this cruel fate. Ardyn tearfully attempts to heal Aera as she appears to be infected with the Starscourge, or at least that what it appears like, but she pushes him off, and demands that he “punish her for her sins,” and kill her, in which Somnus appears and cruelly tells Ardyn to kill Aera as an dagger suddenly appears in Ardyn’s hands. Ardyn refuses, declaring that he was meant to SAVE lives, not take them. Somnus then reminds him of how he “saved” an man by unintentionally him turning him into an daemon. (I should probably mention that vision 2 takes place during an certain section of the dlc, but we’ll get to that later.) Aera continues to beg Ardyn to kill her, declaring that he must live, but Ardyn tearfully states he can’t live without her, and then Somnus proceeds to try to force Ardyn to stab Aera, leading to an QTE. If Ardyn fails, he will be forced to stab Aera as Somnus mocks him and laughs, leaving Ardyn in mourning. If Ardyn succeeds, Somnus will just kill Aera himself anyways, as Ardyn screams, “NOOOOOOO!!!!!” Either way, the vision will end with Ardyn refusing to forgive Somnus for what he did, and swears to destroy everything that Somnus builted in revenge for his actions, and rejects the gods as he declares that the path he now treads is with blood and darkness.

Many years later, Ardyn is freed from his imprisonment by the imperials led by their scientist, Verstael, though they are soon attacked by insomnia guards, though Ardyn soon fights them off, ending with him bestowing the Starscourge onto the last one of them and absorbing his memories as stated above, much to Ardyn’s horror before he falls into unconsciousness. After the first vision soon in the game, Ardyn wakes at the imperials’ home base, where after an discussion with Verstael, and killing an few more insomnia guards, during of which he has an vision of Somnus mocking him, he infects the astral Ifrit with the Starscourge to serve him in his revenge against Somnus, learning that he was indeed the one chosen to be king, which leads into the aforementioned vision 2, which ends in Ardyn, as I mentioned above, declaring to have his revenge on Somnus for taking everything from him.

Sometime later, he became the head Chancellor of the imperials, where he infected many humans and absorb their memories so he could learn much of Lucis as he could. However, doing so warped his mind, and was no longer able to separate the memories of those he infected from his own. He then invades Insomnia during Founder King’s Day alongside Ifrit, so he can force current king Regis to summon the old wall, so Ardyn can settle the score with Somnus. Upon defeating Regis, he summons Somnus and fights him, where Somnus reveals that he secretly regretted what he did to Ardyn and admits that he was jealous of Ardyn outshining him, but nevertheless states that he did what needed to be done. After Ardyn defeats Somnus, the latter states that he does not ask for Ardyn’s forgiveness... but his understanding. Ardyn then becomes furious that Somnus would dare ask him for his understanding after taking EVERYTHING from him, before Somnus wishing that Ardyn would find peace as he disappears.

Ardyn then attempts to kill Regis, but is suddenly brought before Bahamut, where he reveals the horrifying truth before everything that happens in both the dlc and the main game. Ardyn was NEVER meant to be the chosen king, but rather as the limitless shadow covering the world in darkness that Noctis must slay so he can lead the world into the light while also freeing Ardyn of his curse and satisfying his revenge, basically making Ardyn an sacrificial lamb, just like Noctis was, which enrages Ardyn, as this means the gods had screwed over both Noctis AND Ardyn for their own desires. Ardyn can then choose to either submit to his fate, or an attempt to defy. If he submits, he will break down in despair and ask Aera and Somnus if they knew about all of this, only to be met with silence. If Ardyn attempts to defy his fate, Bahamut will force him to submit in an rather cruel way, by having him bounded and then having an illusion of Ardyn’s love interest, Aera, stab him repeatedly, and coldly tells him that his fate is preordained. Regardless of which choice Ardyn makes, we are then treated to the scene where Ardyn fully becomes the villain we see in the main game, where he murders an vision of Aera and Somnus who are cooperating in this vision, referencing Ardyn’s feelings of betrayal, as he gives out an sinister laugh that, as the tearjerker page points out, carries an tinge of sadness and despair because of how broken the former healer had become.

When Final Fantasy XV, i did find that his fate, or what we knew of it at the time was horrifying, but not enough to consider exactly sympathetic, even coming across as petty, especially in the Episode Ignis DLC, where he accuses Somnus of stealing the throne from him. But after playing Episode Ardyn, everything makes sense now, and now I can’t help but feel plenty of sympathy for Ardyn, especially since everything he loved was taken away from, he truly was the kind healer he was stated to be, his brother, Somnus, really was an dick and he did indeed took the throne away from Ardyn, and that becomes more tragic as it was confirmed that Ardyn and Somnus used to love each other, being very close when they younger, he genuinely loved Aera, and I found the second vision of him relieving her death very heartbreaking, especially when he was FORCED to stab Aera, and finally the gods screwed him over BIG TIME, and turned him into an sacrificial lamb for their cause, all of this makes Ardyn’s cry of living in the darkness for ages during his final battle with Noctis much more heartbreaking than it originally appeared. And with all of that, I just can’t see Ardyn as an CM anymore, in fact, I feel like that gods FORCED him to become an monster, arranging everything so that Ardyn would become the villain he is today, while forcing him to relieve the death of his beloved fiancé TWICE, and the fact that Ardyn’s mind was warped by memories of the people he infected doesn’t help matters. With all of this, i would personally decide to cut Ardyn Izunia from as an Complete Monster, he’s an great villain, especially after the DLC, but as of this moment, I don’t think I can see him an CM anymore, but rather, as an tragic villain who’s life was screwed over by the gods themselves. But of course, what do you guys think of all of this?

Scraggle Musha ring dum a doo dum a da from Calgary Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
Musha ring dum a doo dum a da
Apr 9th 2019 at 7:49:00 PM

Yeah, sadly? I have to vouch for Ardyn as a cut. Too much for us to brush away, now.

There's whiskey in the jar-o
Apr 9th 2019 at 7:51:16 PM

I'd say that warrants cutting Ardyn.

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