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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

TheImmortalAngelNewton The MILF Virus Since: Aug, 2015 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The MILF Virus
#154951: Mar 20th 2019 at 6:17:51 AM

[tup] Voicu, Artie and Drucilla.

Allow me, take my hand and never let go, promise? - Giselle
AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#154953: Mar 20th 2019 at 7:18:54 AM

Yes to the folderized Kamen stuff, BTW.

Should I PM Reddish for Thunderbird And Weeklymermaid for Trunchbull?

VeryVileVillian Since: Dec, 2017
#154955: Mar 20th 2019 at 7:36:06 AM

Someone posted unapproved entry on "Metro: Exodus":

Complete Monster: The cannibals. While they may have had to become cannibals to survive, as there weren't enough food stocks in the Ark, and the HEAVY radiation in the surrounding area kept them trapped, they took it way too far. By the time Miller's group finds them, they had actively turned to gleefully mocking their victims and relishing in their horror. The Ark facility being decorated in human corpses and viscera from countless victims. On top of that, they could have left the Ark using the various vehicles that their victims used to reach them. Out of all the human antagonists in this game, you will not need to feel guilty for killing these guys by the score. Its telling that there isn't even an option to avoid killing most of them, in a game that often provides a way to go through a group without hurting a single soul.

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#154957: Mar 20th 2019 at 7:41:28 AM

Cut. If there's a leader than maybe they could count but not all of them

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#154958: Mar 20th 2019 at 7:45:58 AM

They do have a leader. PM the troper and see if they think the leader counts.

I sent the PMs BTW. Tomorrow I'll work on the Goosebumps page; shall I do a Spawn page too?

[down] I also feel like more may be on the way. Who knows if there are more crossovers, plus that upcoming (supposedly VERY dark) film with Jamie Foxx and Jeremy Renner (!).

Edited by ACW on Mar 20th 2019 at 10:54:52 AM

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#154959: Mar 20th 2019 at 7:48:33 AM

You know what sure go ahead. I think 9 sounds like a decent number to make a page from.

[up]Btw how about the dialogue describing Malebogia from this comic I found online as a quote. Malebogia.

Edited by miraculous on Mar 20th 2019 at 8:12:32 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#154961: Mar 20th 2019 at 8:13:51 AM

[up][up] [tup][tup][tup] To that quote. Apparently it's God himself speaking.

Any good images? Maybe of Clown/Violator?

EDIT: Oh, and I know Silent Hill now has 8, but I'll wait if and when Tyk does that other comic guy first.

Edited by ACW on Mar 20th 2019 at 11:37:11 AM

AgeOfTropeEmpire Handsome Head of Hyperion Since: Nov, 2018
Handsome Head of Hyperion
#154962: Mar 20th 2019 at 8:46:42 AM

Now for Napier from Gotham Noir, who I'm unsure on but believe he's worth discussion.

Who is Jack Napier? What has he done?

Jack Napier is a high-ranking member of Mayor Dehaven's criminal underworld, and also serves as a middle man between Dehaven and rival crime boss Tony Zucco.

Due to his criminal activities separated from either gang, however, Napier is ultimately busted by attorney Harvey Dent, who makes a deal with Napier to allow him to not only walk free, but continue his criminal ways, so long as Napier serves as a mole for him in Dehaven's enterprises.

Napier agrees, though constantly on edge that Dehaven will find out his snitching. When Gordon lets slip that Napier is indeed the mole in an attempt to save his family, Dehaven has Napier beaten and his cheeks slashed ear to ear and left for dead.

Though rushed to the hospital and saved, Napier goes on a rampage before they can repair his cheeks, and he murders two guards and goes on a shooting spree throughout the hospital, killing many innocents.

Later tracking down Gordon's wife and child, Napier strings them up in the middle of a dance club, planning to wait for Gordon to arrive then murder them while he watches as revenge for Gordon being the one to oust his status as a mole. When a guard spots him, Napier gleefully flings him off a railing to his death.

Though he attempts to gun down Gordon's family, Napier is taken down by Batman. However, in a last ditch attempt, Napier manages to crawl over to a stray gun and fires on Gordon's daughter, and Gordon takes the bullet, dying in his wife's arms while Napier laughs away.

Does Napier have a Freudian Excuse or other mitigating features?

No redeeming features, he's a criminal-turned-psychopath who first only cares about getting away with his crimes, then with getting revenge on Gordon.

For an excuse, he doesn't have one for being a criminal, but when he gets left for dead and his cheeks slashed, he "snaps" and goes on a Roaring Rampage of Revenge on Gordon, wanting to make Gordon pay for getting Napier assaulted and mutilated.

This is definitely something of an excuse for his crimes that would make him a CM, which is why I'm hesitating a bit, but I also don't think that it justifies a shooting spree or targeting Gordon's family, when he knew the risks of being a criminal, and the only reason he was still in the position to get punished by Dehaven was because he wanted to continue his criminal activities instead of letting the charges against him stick.

Whether the excuse disqualifies him or not is up to the reader.

Is Napier sufficiently heinous?

Definitely, he's fully complicit and enabling Dehaven's criminal activities, goes on a shooting spree of a hospital, tries to make Gordon watch as he kills the man's wife and child, and then even after being beaten he makes on final attempt to gun down Gordon's child, killing Gordon in the process.

Final Verdict?

I'm unsure at the moment, so I'll leave this up to the thread for now.

ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#154963: Mar 20th 2019 at 8:58:04 AM

I might say yes on Napier... That's a pretty huge Disproportionate Retribution at least for me...

Alright, Expect an EP soon enough from me but I got a question for you: This candidate in question starts of as a Well-Intentioned Extremist as he wants to annihilate humanity because in his point of view, they are incapable of feeling, understanding and respecting the Earth's nature and humanity are only contribute to their destruction. And as a result, he then tries to make a world with people just like him to create a future utopia.

Yes, this is the redeeming quality that give me a bit of severe pause until the end when this candidate in question obtains a bigger power, he claims that he is the savior and anyone who defies him—including the ones who joins his side and the ones who are just like him—shall be burned to crisp. That and around 1000 years ago, I feel that humans have a right to be scared with him considered that he tried to start a rebellion. So with that being said, does the final parts that he appear in subvert his WIE nature or not?

Edited by ElfenLiedFan90 on Mar 20th 2019 at 10:58:58 PM

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#154965: Mar 20th 2019 at 9:01:11 AM

[tup]Napier

Since he was already a crook beforehand.

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Enid Sinclair
#154966: Mar 20th 2019 at 9:10:13 AM

Yes to Napier.

I was thinking about looking into Lubdan from the Leprechaun series. Specifically the first film and the 2018 direct sequel that ignores the rest of the films. Do you guys think I should give it a try or would it be a waste of time.

Edited by Bullman on Mar 20th 2019 at 11:11:22 AM

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#154967: Mar 20th 2019 at 9:11:09 AM

[tup] to good old Mistah J.

"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#154968: Mar 20th 2019 at 9:11:12 AM

[up][up] Waste of time. He is Played for Laughs way too often. There was a comic book series based on the films, so...make of that what you will.

Edited by AustinDR on Mar 20th 2019 at 9:11:28 AM

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#154970: Mar 20th 2019 at 9:14:13 AM

Anyone wanted to answer my question :3

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Enid Sinclair
#154971: Mar 20th 2019 at 9:17:53 AM

[up] I think so. Though I would have to see a EP to make a full decision.

Edited by Bullman on Mar 20th 2019 at 11:22:19 AM

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
Tyk5919 Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin Since: Mar, 2011 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin
#154972: Mar 20th 2019 at 9:28:14 AM

@ACW: We'll see about Whately. There's a difference between reading a crappy NoSleep story and reading a comic where you can't tell what the fuck is going on because of its "art style." just bugs me

Still seems like Jack Napier counts, even with his "mitigating" factors. So [tup] for him.

I write stories and shiz. You can read them here.
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#154974: Mar 20th 2019 at 9:36:11 AM

[up][up] Ah, Ben Templesmith. His art style is...unique, to say the least.

Edited by ACW on Mar 20th 2019 at 12:36:23 PM

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#154975: Mar 20th 2019 at 9:47:58 AM

Speaking of Spawn, let me de-pothole

  • Spawn: Clown/Violator is as monstrous as his comic counterpart. The chief lieutenant of the devil Malebolgia, who sent him to Earth to start Armageddon, he's a revolting demon who gets off on violence and depravity, even at the expense of his allies. He makes a deal with black ops security chief Jason Wynn by offering him dominion of the world in exchange for creating a bioweapon that would kill most of humanity, after first having it tested on thousands of people. Malebolgia can then use the souls of the dead as his army to invade and destroy Heaven. Clown initially orders the death of Al Simmons/Spawn at Wynn's hands, recruiting Simmons after his return to Earth to lead Hell's army. He convinces Wynn to attach the virus to his heartrate after letting Spawn kill Wynn's top assassin, Jessica Priest, then manipulates Spawn into killing Wynn to release the virus. When this fails, the frustrated Clown tries to rape Spawn's ex-fiance Wanda in front of Spawn while forcing him to watch, and promises that he'll slaughter the rest of his family-including Spawn's 4-year old daughter Cyan—when he's done.


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