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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#144076: Jan 14th 2019 at 7:33:35 AM

[up][up]Who?

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
11111001011 11111001011 from Peachtree City, GA Since: Dec, 2018 Relationship Status: Abstaining
11111001011
#144077: Jan 14th 2019 at 7:39:36 AM

She was a character from Skin Trade who sold her daughter for trafficking and was upset when Min only made $700.

Help me!
Tyk5919 Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin Since: Mar, 2011 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin
#144078: Jan 14th 2019 at 7:45:48 AM

@11: I've seen the movie. No one counts.

I write stories and shiz. You can read them here.
ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#144079: Jan 14th 2019 at 7:48:15 AM

@11 As far as I remembered regarding Human Trafficker that doesn't count... Muon Nerima from Doreiku comes to mind. The dude's head of a Prostitution ring but doesn't count because he redeems himself at the end and even before that, he had a pretty good relationship with his granddaughter

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
11111001011 11111001011 from Peachtree City, GA Since: Dec, 2018 Relationship Status: Abstaining
11111001011
#144080: Jan 14th 2019 at 7:53:40 AM

Human trafficking always sounded like a nasty profession from what I read.

Help me!
Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#144081: Jan 14th 2019 at 8:19:05 AM

Yes to Egon.

"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
TheMadCr0w (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Get out of here, STALKER
KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Shin Megami Tensei IV
#144083: Jan 14th 2019 at 8:27:57 AM

Regarding unnecesary long entries, I found this on Locke & Key. Who EP it?

  • Complete Monster: The unnamed demon who possessed teenager Lucas "Dodge" Caravaggio is a sadistic and cruel monster who is behind all the bad happenings in the story. Originally a seemingly animalistic entity, the demon, taking the name "Dodge" after possessing Lucas, develops human-like emotions and personality, which only enhance his capacity for wickedness. An emotionally manipulative psychopath, the demon happily commits various atrocities throughout the story, from turning an emotionally unstable teen into a Serial Killer, to physically and emotionally abusing a woman before mind raping and eventually ruthlessly murdering her, to deliberately forcing a recovering alcoholic into a drunken stupor simply to strain her relationship with her daughter. Eliminating anyone who could oust him as a monster, the demon goes to any lengths to silence those suspicious of him, from destroying their minds, leaving them as empty shells, to outright killing them, with children being no exception. After possessing a young boy named Bode, leaving his soul trapped as a ghost unable to interact with his family or ask for help, the demon first kills the boy's best friend who gets suspicious of him, then uses a shadow army to capture hundreds of people, killing any of them who resist, and reveals his master plan: To bring forth a select group of his kind who will assist him in taking over the world, massacring any humans who resist and turning those who survive into his tortured slaves, all for his newly-developed god complex. Though originally having no morality, the demon showed that after possessing Dodge he had become fully aware of morals and good in the world, but chose to turn on his whole race and become a god to rule over humanity because he simply liked being evil.

287 words? This comic just had 6 volumes. Even my longest entries are 250 max...Except Gabriel Miller for Sword Art Online. You know, I will do a rewrite for him.

Also, I don't think Gabriel is a Ax-Crazy, he is mostly cold, so I erased that pothole. And Omnicidal Maniac is valid there? He don't want to kill everyone, he just want to kill the Underworld (Alicization is how the project is named, but the virtual world is know as Underworld)

  • Sword Art Online: Gabriel Miller, psychotic even as a child, is also known as Subtilizer in GGO and Vector in the Underworld. The boss of Glowgen Defense Systems, Gabriel manages to assault the Ocean Turtle and enter into the Underworld in the super-account of Vector, god of darkness, intending to capture the only fully-developed Artificial Fluctlight and brainwash her into be his submissive wife and "start a new life in a new world". With his new godlike powers, Gabriel turns the turbulent Seven Lords Assembly of the Dark Territory into his personal dictatorship, taking advantage of the flaws in the data of the habitats, who are forced to follow the "rule of the strongest". When the wall of the Human Empire collapses, Gabriel leads the invasion, using risk strategies, causing unnecessary deaths on his own side, as he believes their sheer numbers and experience are the only things he needs to win, eventually using members of his own army as Demihuman sacrifices to empower his sorceress. Contacting his allies in the Real World, Gabriel summons hundreds of unaware players that kill several A.I.s believing that they were inside just another game. "Dying" after forcing a AI to sacrifice his own life, Gabriel returns with his GGO account and mocks said AI for his sacrifice before fighting Kirito and torturing him. A cold sociopath, Gabriel goes so far as to think of the possibility of destroying the Underworld and killing every IA in it after his victory.

Post it on the drafts ACW?

Edited by KazuyaProta on Jan 14th 2019 at 11:34:39 AM

Watch me destroying my country
Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#144084: Jan 14th 2019 at 8:32:24 AM

[up] I think those were by Ravok. He ain't around anymore but writing big was kind of his thing.

"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#144085: Jan 14th 2019 at 8:34:45 AM

Yea, I feel that the writeup was made by Ravok or Occassional Exister but I can be wrong

@Kazuya I think the longest you've ever done as far as I recall was Lord Drakkon

Edited by ElfenLiedFan90 on Jan 14th 2019 at 11:35:56 PM

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Shin Megami Tensei IV
#144086: Jan 14th 2019 at 8:35:53 AM

[up][up] I can't blame him, I like doing the same...Wait, the entry had two Big Bad potholes.

[up] Add me to try to trim it.

Edited by KazuyaProta on Jan 14th 2019 at 11:41:18 AM

Watch me destroying my country
ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#144087: Jan 14th 2019 at 8:48:49 AM

@Kazuya Prota Nah I think it's cool if you leave him as he is due to how uber evil the candidate that you propose is.

Your entry btw:

  • Lord Drakkon is an Evil Counterpart of Tommy Oliver who chose to serve Rita Repulsa instead of joining the Rangers, assisting her in conquering the world and destroying the Power Rangers, with him personally killing Zordon, Jason and Billy and becoming a White Ranger after stealing their powers. Killing Rita after she taught him magic and calling himself Lord Drakkon, he uses the Power Coins to create the Ranger Sentries and kept control of his world. When Kimberly tries to avenge her loved ones, Drakkon brainwashes her and uses her as his Ranger Slayer. Defeated due to overconfidence, Drakkon is teleported to the main world and is incarcerated by the Promethea Company. When Saba tries to execute him, Drakkon kills him and uses his remains to create portals to kill the Tommy of the main world before searching Ninjor and tricking him into rebuilding his Morpher to recover part of his powers, before imprisoning and brainwashing him. In a crossover with Power Rangers Hyperforce, Drakkon uses and beheads one of the hostages to force them to help him to get the Serpentera before heavily injuring one of their members while they try to avoid it before escaping. Invading the worlds from multiple series to get their Morphers, Drakkon kills multiple versions of himself until almost defeated, saved by his loyal servant Finster 5, who Drakkon kills after Finster tells Drakkon, for his own safety, to stop empowering himself. A cruel tyrant secretly envious towards his counterparts, Lord Drakkon destroyed the multiverse to create a world where everyone loved him.

Edited by ElfenLiedFan90 on Jan 14th 2019 at 11:49:37 PM

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
therealjackieboy from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
#144088: Jan 14th 2019 at 8:56:19 AM

So last year, I did an EP for a J-sploitation film called Bloody Chainsaw Girl. Just found out last night that it's getting a two-part sequel/kinda reboot (since the cast members are being replaced) that's coming out this year, and Nero's apparently coming back (despite the fact that she got chainsawed in the stomach, but whatever). You know damn well I'll be covering those films when they received English subs.

It's Spooky Month!
lakingsif Since: Dec, 2012 Relationship Status: Wanna dance with somebody
#144089: Jan 14th 2019 at 9:00:14 AM

Okay. Bandersnatch; apologies for the length, I'm going to try EP three in one:

What is the work? We all know Black Mirror, but Bandersnatch is a standalone film about 19-year-old Stefan, living in a London suburb and wanting to make video games. Unfortunately for Stefan, he is being controlled. All of his choices are neurotically influenced, either by his own illness or by outside forces (it's interactive, the viewer can control the direction of the story). These forces seem to be destroying Stefan's life, since all their inputs have a negative effect, for no identified reason. There are three main forces controlling Stefan in most versions of the film: You, PACS, and the Bandersnatch curse. The last one doesn't seem to be malicious - it's a curse, it exists, in these storylines it's more or less Stefan's fault for making Bandersnatch to begin with. The other two, however? They have a conscience that isn't being used.

Who is You/the controller & what have they done? I'll be using the term "the controller" because the viewer/You are also a character. It's the You that is a character in the film, obviously.

An omniscient force, the controller is a person from the future. They are using an entertainment system called Netflix, a service that allows them to enter the minds of people from the past and influence their actions, watching the person and the outcomes of their influence for fun, whilst aware that these people are real and the actions have real consequences for this other person. And the person from the past doesn't know they're being used; they haven't signed up for this, they aren't aware. Unsatisfied with simply controlling someone else's life and forcing them to do things that are out-of-character, the controller gives more and more sadistic instructions to Stefan entirely for their own entertainment: they isolate him to increase his stress level, they stop him from taking his medication, they manipulate events around him to make him suspicious of government conspiracies and worry about himself going insane. They delight in Stefan finding out that he's being controlled, finding ways to give him signs that he's nothing but a meat puppet for their sadistic will, going so far as to either ruin the game he's been passionate about for a long time or force him to be a serial killer.

Mitigating factors None? There's not much information given about the controller, only what they tell Stefan "I control you", and the malicious actions they compel him to do.

Heinous standard Of the antagonists you can get depending on what choices you make, there's two really evil ones. Both are designed as conscious humans who are willingly ruining Stefan's life. The controller does it for their own entertainment, whilst the PACS people are implicitly doing it as a psychological experiment. Being evil for fun seems arguably worse.

Conclusion Probably one of the most evil villains Black Mirror has, it's You, just as Charlie Brooker intended.


Who are PACS "Dad" and PACS Haynes & what have they done? In the storylines where Stefan discovers that PACS is real, he finds evidence showing that his Dad and his therapist are, actually, part of the Programme and Control "conspiracy". They're scientists and actors who have been experimenting on him since he was a child, and have planted themselves in his life as the only people Stefan has regular contact with. They influence his choices through a combined effort of some unknown means (possibly implanted) and regular psychological interference - via his therapy sessions. They've also given him intense distress and guilt due to a "trauma initiation" that Stefan recovers a recording of: his "Dad" actor regularly took away his security blanket rabbit toy whilst psychologically abusing him as a child before hiding it on the night before Stefan was due to take a trip with his "Mum"; Stefan can't find it and holds back his "Mum" (also an actor) who, he is told, catches a later train that gets attacked. Because of this, he's emotionally insecure and feels guilty for his "Mum"'s death through to adulthood. Since his parents are actors, it's also possible that they kidnapped a child for this, or went to find orphans to study the effects of being emotionally vulnerable and completely isolated in life.

Mitigating factors Implied that they're torturing him as part of a long-term psychological experiment. No info is given on this (it's not truly confirmed), so it might be for the good of humanity, but we can't know (and, honestly, good people don't tend to experiment on unknowing humans).

Heinous standard As above.

Conclusion Still very evil.


OH MY GOD; MY PARENTS ARE GARDENIIIIINNNNGGGGG!!!!!
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#144090: Jan 14th 2019 at 9:08:34 AM

I'm...unsure. With "the Controller", it seems to run into the issue we have with why most video game PlayerCharacters can't count.

lakingsif Since: Dec, 2012 Relationship Status: Wanna dance with somebody
#144091: Jan 14th 2019 at 9:15:42 AM

[up]The actions and story of the controller, as well as Stefan's situation, are all pre-recorded. The actual viewer doesn't have a lot of choice, and I deliberately excluded anything that the real person viewer can have some input on (always inconsequential) — like, in video games you may be given the choice to make your PC murder 100 people, but it's not necessary. Nothing here is optional. Once you've hit that storyline, that's the storyline.

Edited by lakingsif on Jan 14th 2019 at 9:17:23 AM

OH MY GOD; MY PARENTS ARE GARDENIIIIINNNNGGGGG!!!!!
11111001011 11111001011 from Peachtree City, GA Since: Dec, 2018 Relationship Status: Abstaining
11111001011
#144092: Jan 14th 2019 at 9:19:18 AM

Player Characters can count (the Crusader and Galvis come to mind), but I think they actually have to be in the game. I'm leaning [tdown] to the trio.

Edited by 11111001011 on Jan 14th 2019 at 12:19:59 PM

Help me!
Awesomekid42 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: It was only a kiss
#144093: Jan 14th 2019 at 9:30:11 AM

You know, I'm curious. How many video game CMs do we have that are the main protagonist of the game they're in? I know about The Crusader, Ellen and Galvis. There was also Lucius before he got redeeming qualities in the third game. Anyone else?

Edited by Awesomekid42 on Jan 14th 2019 at 12:31:41 PM

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
Overlord Since: Mar, 2013
#144095: Jan 14th 2019 at 9:42:32 AM

Yes to Egon, Kevin and Luke, Jacques, Sorch, Iron Beak.

No to Bonnie and Controller.

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Enid Sinclair
#144096: Jan 14th 2019 at 9:43:52 AM

I have watched/played it and no to the Bandersnatch trio.

Edited by Bullman on Jan 14th 2019 at 12:44:46 PM

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
11111001011 11111001011 from Peachtree City, GA Since: Dec, 2018 Relationship Status: Abstaining
11111001011
#144097: Jan 14th 2019 at 10:16:42 AM

Found a pothole in Taco Man:

Help me!
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#144098: Jan 14th 2019 at 10:19:43 AM

Black Mirror's standard is too high and the whole setting of Bandersnatch is just too weird for them to really keep.

And cut that above. That's not the kind of thing we need as an entry.

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#144099: Jan 14th 2019 at 10:20:42 AM

[tdown]Trio

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#144100: Jan 14th 2019 at 10:31:19 AM

[tup] Egon

[tdown] Bandersnatch trio. Too fuckin' weird and ambiguous.

@11: Having seen Skin Trade? Nobody counts. The Dragovich cartel care about each other, and Min's mom dpesn't actually appear, she's just mentioned in Min's backstory.


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