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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
TheMadCr0w (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Get out of here, STALKER
Overlord Since: Mar, 2013
#141879: Dec 30th 2018 at 3:55:59 PM

@ ACW, should we put this Batgirl motion comic under Batman comics or under animation due to being a motion comic with limited motion and voice acting.

papyru30 from Colorado for summer break Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
#141880: Dec 30th 2018 at 4:03:43 PM

[tup] to Mike, just make sure to mention that that this is the theatrical cut in the write up.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#141881: Dec 30th 2018 at 4:10:01 PM

I'm thinking Firefly goes to comics. It is a motion comic, but emphasis on comic, and it started out as a regular comic.

As for Myers: Sure to him (I didn't bother reading what he did...it's Myers). Just mention which version it is; I'm unsure how to do the branching out though.

EDIT: Maybe this?

  • Halloween franchise:
    • Main entry
      • In the 1981 sequel, Michael Myers pursues Laurie, his sister in this continuity, to a local hospital, massacring the staff before attacking Laurie again. H20 TIMELINE.
      • Mention 1981 sequel, then separate entry.
      • 2018 film.
    • Wynn
    • Cochran

Edited by ACW on Dec 30th 2018 at 7:13:09 AM

MGD107 Since: Feb, 2015
#141882: Dec 30th 2018 at 4:21:37 PM

[tup] to Firefly and Michael Myers.

Have to say, as Michael is one of my favourite villains, their is something gratifying about getting to vote him up three times. Great choice to end the year Beast.

As for the rape scene, I don't think its moral. More the idea of Michael wanting to do something as ordinary as sleep with someone, goes against the idea of how inhuman he is.

TheImmortalAngelNewton The MILF Virus Since: Aug, 2015 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The MILF Virus
#141883: Dec 30th 2018 at 4:31:12 PM

[tup] Mr. Lynn and Mr. Myers

So I discussed pretty briefly proposing The Clown, Kenneth Chase/Jeffrey Hawk, from Dead by Daylight, and here it is. With new information, this is my 2nd time bringing this killer clown and hopefully he can stick.

Who is The Clown what does he do?

Jeffrey Hawk was originally named Kenneth Chase, a child from the rural states born from a mother who died at childbirth. Resentment grew from his father which eventually drove him to alcoholism and seperation. As he grew up, Kenneth began collecting feathers as one of his ways to entertain himself through staring and licking them. He eventually became fixated on collecting feathers from a living bird, and after using a trap to capture the bird he tried to collect them. However when the bird was in his grasp, he played around with it and eventually killed then collecting a feather enjoying that the birds life was in his hand.

When he started growing to adulthood, he began hunting down other creatures such as dogs, raccoons and squirrels and then eventually man. He kidnapped a young man and after killing him, took one of his fingers as a prize. When his father found out and reported it, Kenneth ran and eventually entered a travelling circus group to hide, taking the name Jeffrey Hawk.

While traveling with his new family, Jeffrey began becoming bored with his now peaceful life and started going to his old ways of killing for fun. Taking costumes from his fellow performers as a disguise, he hunts down other victims from elders, to young men and women, and even children and taking their fingers as prizes. He would then take these fingers, and lick and taste over and over again because of its "amazing" taste. One day one of his would be victims was able to escape and report it to the police. Running away from the law, Jeffrey went around the country pretending to be a clown in other carnivals or circuses, and using that to lure in more victims. Eventually the Entity in the mist offered him a chance to be one of his killers, and without hesitation took it.

Now in the game as the killer named The Clown, he now hunts other potential victims using intoxicating gases to slow his opponents and chasing them with his faster then normal speed. Whenever he cuts his opponents, he laughs and giggles unlike other killers then the killers and when he does his one-hit kill, he stomps his victims down and then take their finger while licking it's blood.

Heinousness:

One of the killers who truly standout for a list of things.

1) He's one of the few killers who had no brainwashing/influence done on him by The Entity, and in fact was one of the few willing in committing his murders.

2) He's the only none-influence killer that resorted to cannibalism, even though it's just fingers it still counts.

3) He's the only killer with confirmed children as victims, essentially making The Clown the only one who eaten children.

4) He has one of the longest killer spree, from his youth till he became a much older man.

5) His signature is shown off in the game with his mori, killing the survivor with a curb-stomp and then cutting their finger to suck it.

Mitigating Factor:

It was stated that it was the heinous level of Dead by Daylight is highly polluted, by there is new information that deludes these standards and make it easier to stand out. Most of the killers here are actually victims of the dark influence of The Entity, stated that many of them were brainwash in some way to their crime in a developers live-stream. So killers who are clearly not a victim of this would become more heinousness then the crowd of murderers, and The Clown is very one of them.

Final Verdict:

Brought him back with new information, and hopefully it's enough to bring this guy up.

Edited by TheImmortalAngelNewton on Dec 30th 2018 at 4:33:33 AM

Allow me, take my hand and never let go, promise? - Giselle
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
papyru30 from Colorado for summer break Since: Aug, 2016 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
lrrose Since: Jul, 2009
KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#141889: Dec 30th 2018 at 4:43:51 PM

[tup] to Hawk.

@MGD: It's just that with Michael being evil personified, I thought hed be the kind of guy who does something heinous - like inscestous rape - for the sake of being evil because it wouldn't be something you'd put past him. Also another side note; I always thought that Steven Lloyd shouldve become the new protagonsit - ever since I found out Michael was his father I always thought "Yup, that's the kid whose gonna kill him."

Edited by Beast on Dec 30th 2018 at 6:44:16 AM

"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
Awesomekid42 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: It was only a kiss
#141893: Dec 30th 2018 at 5:42:38 PM

Yes to the clown.

Here’s an effort-post for a manga I just finished.

What’s the work?

The Devil Survivor manga is a, you guessed it, manga adaptation of the Strategy RPG, Devil Survivor. Released in America in late 2015, it’s an 8 volume manga that, while having changes in how it tells the plot here and there, the manga chooses to follow the Gin ending (using Haru’s song to banish the demons) with pieces of the Naoya ending (the main protagonist becoming King of Bel and going to the Demon World).

For those who don’t know what Devil Survivor is about, the protagonist (namd Kazuya Minegishi in the manga) and his two best friends, Atsuro and Yuzu, gain modified COMPS (gaming devices that also act as cellphones) that have the ability to summon demons, and tell predictions of the future. Not long afterwards, the three find themselves trapped in Yamanote Circle, a lockdown being established by the government under the orders of Angels.

In addition, several demons known as Bel, fragments of a demon who previously ruled the world that was defeated by God, are at war with each other to be King of Bel, attempting to kill the other Bel and absorb their essence. And the manga’s adaptation of the first Bel, Beldr, is quite more vicious than his game counterpart.

Who is he? What does he do?

As stated earlier, Beldr is the first Bel demon fought by the protagonists, and serves as a major Wake-Up Call Boss for them. Prior to the story, Beldr made a pact with nearly every object on earth that they wouldn’t harm him, granting him invincibility to nearly everything. The only exception being the Mistletoe, also known as the “Devil’s Fuge”, and so, Loki tricked Beldr’s brother into killing him with a spear made from mistletoe. An attempt to revive him was made as, if every living creature cried he would be brought back, but a single old woman refused to cry, and so, Beldr wasn’t revived.

We cut to the time in the story where, while he’s not quite revived, Beldr is more than capable of appearing on the mortal plane. He makes a plan to revive himself, to feed off the despair and souls of innocents, while turning the world into one of sorrow. He makes his first move by sending a group of his demons to try to slaughter innocents at a concert to built up grief. Kazuya, Atsuro, Yuzu, and Keisuke (an old friend of Atsuro’s) arrive as the former three got a notification that over 50 people will be killed in that area. They fight off and defeat the demons, bu Kazuya notices a strange black fog. He warns his friends, Keisuke, and Midori (an idol who was holding said concert) to get down as the threat isn't over yet. They survive, but all of the other innocents have their life force sapped out of them, and into Beldr, who arrives at the scene. (A scene very different from the game, where it’s just random demons attacking and are foiled)

Atsuro uses his skill, Analyze (how he gets the resistances and weaknesses of demons) on Beldr, and finds out he’s immune to everything. Beldr smugly says that it was bold of Atsuro to do that, and sets him on fire, intending for him to slowly burn to death. Atsuro’s demon at the time, Waira, knocks him away but is consumed by the flames. Beldr then summons more demons and creates a wall of fire across the city block to kill more innocents and trap the heroes.

Kazuya tries to fight Beldr so that his friends can escape, but is easily defeated. His friends escape on Keisuke’s demon, Suparna, but Yuzu’s demon, Pixie, is killed by Beldr. Beldr then tortures Kazuya, talking about the pleasure he takes in the fear and despair he’s feeling. However, Kazuya unknowingly awakens signs of his own Bel powers and, at the cost of his own demon (a flame entity) fires a huge amounts of flames to kill Bel’s demons, and create enough of a distraction to escape.

Beldr spends the rest of the day, and most of the next day going around, slaughtering innocent civilians, and absorbing their souls. Eventually, he goes to the cemetery for his overall plan: Absorb the souls of over 300 people in Tokyo to revive himself before leaving the Yamamoto circle and turn the world into an apocalypse, ensuring that everybody in the world feels grief. Kazuya, Atsuro, Yuzu, Keisuke, Midori, and Kaido all fight Beldr, with Kazuya barely killing the demon when Jack Frost (Midori’s demon) freezes the surviving sliver of Mistletoe, which Kazuya impales Beldr with before absorbing his soul. Loki then shows up in human form, explains Beldr’s past, and how he intended to turn the world into one of grief and despair even after being revived.

Heinous by the standards of the story?

In the manga, Beldr’s surprisingly second only to God in heinousness. The manga doesn’t mention Belberith wishing to kill all humans like in the game, and all the other Bel are pretty bog standard in villainy. The government trying to kill everybody in the Yamanote circle blows game Beldr out of the water, but with Beldr’s motive of essentially ending the world, he shoots up a lot more.

Freudian Excuse?

His brother being tricked into killing him isn’t played for sympathy remotely, and deciding to bring the apocalypse even after being revived throws it out the window.

Any other mitigating factors?

Nope. The manga shows how demons have moral agency (such as Atsuro’s demon doing a Heroic Sacrifice or how fellow Bel, Belial, has his own code and is a Graceful Loser) and unlike in the games where Beldr was pretty much a GDV, Beldr shows a clear personality as a cruel, arrogant, sadist.

Final Thoughts?

[tup]

KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#141895: Dec 30th 2018 at 6:10:25 PM

[tup] Beldr.

"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
FriedWarthog Since: Jun, 2014 Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
#141898: Dec 30th 2018 at 6:49:53 PM

Yes to Michael Myers, Beldr, the Clown, Firefly (Which is satisfying to say after his DCAU counterpart didn't make the cut despite the close vote), Bodfel, the Doctor, and that really awful Killraven duo.

So uh... real sorry about the giant absence all of a sudden. Business, sickness, shame over the King's Effortpost causing a ruckus, and renewing my focus on my writing all took my attention away from here. I know I've got some writeups to submit, but first, a question:

I finished the Spider-Man PS 4 DLC missions a while ago, and the discussion date is on the fourth of January. I can wait until then if needed, but if no one objects, how would people feel if I were to submit an effortpost for the villain on New Year's Day, just as a cool way to ring in 2019? Again, if people don't think it's kosher I can handle being told no, but since the discussion date would be pretty close anyway, I figured it wouldn't hurt to ask since I don't plan on this being a regular thing.

Awesomekid42 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: It was only a kiss
#141899: Dec 30th 2018 at 6:55:10 PM

I feel like it would be best to wait since the 4th still works for you, but I could go either way.

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010

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