TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

Go To

During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#136301: Nov 14th 2018 at 1:44:21 PM

Go for it Mir. I can then have him and Eddie off the Drafts page.

Also, people, please: If you effortpost and writeup someone on your pending list, please then remove it from said list.

PolarPhantom Since: Jun, 2012
#136302: Nov 14th 2018 at 1:57:34 PM

Fredric Downing seems bad enough for his tier. Like, he's not Wesker level. He's more Goldman level. So I think he can count.

PatheticKing Since: Sep, 2018
#136303: Nov 14th 2018 at 2:29:09 PM

[tup] to Dr. Downing and the Yule Man.

miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#136304: Nov 14th 2018 at 2:38:06 PM

Would anyone mind changing the J Ag header from this:

JAG and its related series, including the More Popular Spinoff NCIS, have been around long enough to have some really monstrous characters.

To this:

The agents of JAG and its related series, including the More Popular Spinoff NCIS, have faced various terrorists and criminals over the years with these being the most monsterous.

The original strikes me as a bit too simple and doesnt quite work for the franchise and this doesn't extend it by much.

Edited by miraculous on Nov 14th 2018 at 2:39:31 AM

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Kylotrope Barb(Its a thread joke you wouldn't get it) from Honolulu Hawaii Since: Apr, 2018
Barb(Its a thread joke you wouldn't get it)
#136305: Nov 14th 2018 at 2:52:20 PM

[tup] to miraculous proposed changes.

Things are really about to get Fun around here
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#136306: Nov 14th 2018 at 3:00:42 PM

Let me tweak that a bit:

The agents of JAG and its related series, including the More Popular Spin-Off, NCIS, have faced various terrorists and criminals over the years. These are the most monstrous.

Also, tomorrow I'll submit this:

And the Disney stuff (Frollo's just a placeholder for now; if anyone's got a condensed McLeach go for it). Disney Animated Canon, by release date

  • Pinocchio: The Coachman runs Pleasure Island, a too-good-to-be-true amusement park for troublesome children. Presenting a guise as a kindly old man, he laces the cigars and beer of the children with a substance that transforms the children into donkeys whenever they act like jerks. The Coachman then sells them as normal animals into harsh working environments and keeps the boys who can still talk within a pen with no indication of their fates afterwards. Even Honest John and Gideon, a pair of con artists, are visibly terrified by him and his actions.
  • The Black Cauldron: The Horned King is an evil, sorcerous lich who wants to use the Black Cauldron to conquer the world with his army of the undead, the Cauldron-Born. Stopping at nothing to achieve his goal, he's willing to kill innocents, has his loyal henchmen killed to create more skeleton warriors, and tries to sacrifice his own servant, Creeper, to power the Cauldron. Desiring to be seen as a god-like figure by what's left of the Earth, the Horned King remains one of the darkest villains in a Disney movie to date.
  • The Rescuers Down Under: Percival C. McLeach is one of the few humans in the series who seems to be aware that the animals are sentient. This does not stop him from, in his own words, "tearing off their hides" to make a living. When Cody interferes with one of McLeach's operations, the poacher kidnaps him, tosses knives at him, and locks him in one of the cramped cages he keeps the animals he's captured in, and uses him as bait to lure the eagle Marahute into his clutches; he subsequently instructs his monitor lizard sidekick, Joanna the Goanna, to devour the eagle's eggs, rendering the species rarer and thus more valuable. When the Rescuers visit McLeach's hideout they find he is keeping three talking animals prisoner, intending to turn them all into luxury goods; McLeach himself is observed giving orders to Frank the Frilled Lizard, confirming that he knows they can understand him. When Cody proves too much trouble, McLeach ties Cody to a crane and lowers him into a river filled with crocodiles, only to raise him back up, then almost does it again, just to toy with him. When the power on his half-track goes out, stopping him from lowering Cody, McLeach takes out a gun and shoots the rope holding him above the river.
  • The Lion King: Scar is the envious younger brother of King Mufasa who, upon losing his position as next in line to the throne by the birth of his nephew Simba, sought to take it by force. First tricking the young Simba and his friend Nala into entering the Elephant Graveyard to be killed by his hyena henchmen, Scar next orchestrates a wildebeest stampede and tosses Mufasa to his death after he attempts to rescue his son. Blaming a grief-stricken Simba for his father's murder, Scar forces him into exile before commanding the hyenas to finish him off. Upon taking control, Scar's incompetence as king leads to a famine, with Scar uncaring that he is sentencing everyone to death, even striking Mufasa's widow Sarabi unconscious when she criticizes his rule. Upon Simba's return, Scar takes advantage of Simba's lingering guilt over his father's death to attempt to execute him publicly, pausing only to mockingly reveal his role in Mufasa's death. Later, to save his own life, he attempts to foist the blame on his hyena henchmen before attempting to kill Simba, even after the latter spares his life.
  • The Hunchback Of Notre Dame: Judge Claude Frollo is the self-proclaimed Minister of Justice, but is in truth a corrupt, deeply-prejudiced, Egocentrically Religious official. Frollo holds the gypsies scattered around Paris in deep contempt, and seeks to eradicate them. Killing a young gypsy mother on the steps of Notre Dame, Frollo then attempted to drown her infant son for his deformities, only being stopped by the archdeacon. Solely for fear of being punished for his crimes, Frollo takes the boy in, naming him Quasimodo and raising him in isolation, teaching him to think of himself as a monster. Frollo lusts after the gypsy dancer Esmeralda, resolving to force her to be his, or kill her. Frollo terrorizes Paris while searching for her, imprisoning many gypsies and having a massive portion of the city burnt down. He finally besieges the gypsy hideout and captures them all, including Esmeralda. Accusing Esmeralda of witchcraft, Frollo attempts to publicly execute her when she rejects his advances before launching an attack upon the cathedral when Quasimodo rescues her. When Esmeralda seemingly dies, Frollo asks a mourning Quasimodo for forgiveness, only to try and stab him when he lets his guard down. He finally pursues Quasimodo and Esmeralda onto a balcony and attempts to murder them both. Perhaps Clopin puts it best, when he asks, "Who is the monster and who is the man?"
  • Mulan: Shan Yu views the Emperor of China having built The Great Wall as both an insult and a challenge. As a violent Blood Knight, Shan Yu leads his horde of Huns to invade, relishing when China knows he's there. After capturing two Imperial spies, Shan Yu releases them with a message for the Emperor—but has one of his archers kill one anyways as you only need one man to deliver a message. Shan Yu later ambushes the armies of General Li at a village, resulting in a mass slaughter, not only of the soldiers, but every civilian as well, with no children spared either. Even after his army's downfall, Shan Yu attacks the Imperial Palace with his remaining men and takes the Emperor hostage, furiously trying to kill him when he refuses to kneel to Shan Yu.
  • Atlantis The Lost Empire: Commander Lyle Tiberius Rourke is a tomb-robbing mercenary (or, as he insists, "adventure capitalist") solely in the Atlantis operation for profit. The leader of the expedition sent to find Atlantis, Rourke maintains a gruff, militaristic indifference to the lives of those lost to the Leviathan and upon seeing the Heart of Atlantis, plans to confiscate it and sell it for double the money he'd receive. Knowing full well this will kill every Atlantean, when he's confronted on this Rourke threatens to shoot Princess Kida and shortly thereafter murders her father, never dropping his friendly façade. Rourke was concerned for little else but himself and the potential profit he could reap from Atlantis, to the point where he tosses Helga off a blimp to her death for a minor benefit to his escape, and was greedy enough in the end to make his entire party turn against him.
  • The Princess And The Frog: Dr. Facilier, the Shadow Man, is a "very charismatic" conman and voodoo sorcerer who employs his demonic "Friends on the Other Side" for his own ambitious ends. Facilier tricks Prince Naveen into giving him his blood, cursing the prince into the form of a frog, while roping his greedy valet Lawrence into posing as the prince to marry into the inheritance of New Orleans's wealthiest sugar baron Eli "Big Daddy" LeBouff, ensuring Facilier can murder LeBouff and Naveen after to secure the fortune for his own. Plunged deep into debt to his "Friends" with his soul at stake, Facilier sinks to his lowest when he offers up the souls of New Orleans's citizens to his demonic "Friends" to glut themselves on, and even cold-bloodedly kills Ray the firefly when he poses an obstacle to his plans. Defined by his thirst for power, even Facilier's elastic, unmistakable charm can't disguise the monster he truly is underneath his conman facade.

ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#136307: Nov 14th 2018 at 3:06:22 PM

Sure on Downing and Yule Man.

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Shin Megami Tensei IV
#136308: Nov 14th 2018 at 3:19:52 PM

  • Eudemon Quest/Huan Jie Wang: Xue Ya is a demon intending the resurrection the evil Dragon King. Sending a spy inside the Tian Wu academy, he also sends students to aid her to pass the tests by injuring other contenders. When The Protagonist Chu Xiao Gou is revealed to have the Dragon King sealed inside him, Xue Ya sends his spy to protect him. Eventually launching a invasion to the Tian Wu academy, Xue Ya starts killing a guard before sending his followers to kill as many students as possible before fighting against the School Chairman, actually the Feng Tian Qing/ Eudemon King. Defeated for him, Xue Ya uses his loyal spy as a Human Shield and hostage, threatening to rip her neck.

This is fine for the drafts?

[tup] The Yule Man

Edited by KazuyaProta on Nov 14th 2018 at 6:21:36 AM

Watch me destroying my country
ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#136309: Nov 14th 2018 at 3:23:05 PM

Speaking of last C Ms for now from the franchise.... Anyone have some opinions on Belok Rhal and Naga Sadow from Star Wars franchise? Just asking if they had brought up in this thread before and can match the current Heinous Standard of Star Wars.

Edited by ElfenLiedFan90 on Nov 14th 2018 at 6:23:32 PM

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#136310: Nov 14th 2018 at 3:25:41 PM

[up][up] Should it go under Eudemon Quest or Huan Jie Wang? Also, did not-a-Dragon King get approved? Finally, you may wanna specify that it's the anime (or whatever the Chinese equivalent is).

HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#136311: Nov 14th 2018 at 3:31:28 PM

IIRC Sadow flunked heinousness next to Exar from the same series.

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#136312: Nov 14th 2018 at 3:32:09 PM

I’m not ENTIRELY sure I agree but it was discussed and ruled.

hegelvonaxel Since: Feb, 2018
#136313: Nov 14th 2018 at 3:41:59 PM

[tup] Downing and Yule.

Who is for you the most evil CM among the minor villains? For me it is Rorge from A Song of Ice and Fire

Speaking of which, can we put Show!Ramsay above Gregor and Craster, since he is more important villain?

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#136315: Nov 14th 2018 at 3:44:55 PM

[up][up] sigh Yare yare daze.

Most evil minor villain? Anjuro Katagiri, Shou Tucker, That Naruto Anime exclusivr villain. Is that answer your question?

And to move on other topic... Opinions on Belok Rhal?

Edited by ElfenLiedFan90 on Nov 14th 2018 at 6:47:47 PM

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
TheImmortalAngelNewton The MILF Virus Since: Aug, 2015 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The MILF Virus
#136316: Nov 14th 2018 at 3:51:20 PM

Yule Mask and Downing.

Most evil minor villain? That villain in the first season of Bleach, and the guy from Cowboy Bebop (Not Vicious of course.)

Also about Resident Evil, there's one more villain I'm aware that could make the cut. I just haven't read the manga to make an EP and too busy to read it for now.

Edited by TheImmortalAngelNewton on Nov 14th 2018 at 3:53:31 AM

Allow me, take my hand and never let go, promise? - Giselle
TommyFresh Since: Aug, 2013
#136317: Nov 14th 2018 at 3:59:26 PM

[down] Xue Ya, Downing, and Yule Man. Abstain on Chrysalis.

G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
The 47th President
#136318: Nov 14th 2018 at 4:04:14 PM

the most evil minor villain CM? that's a toughie but for me it would have to be Shou Tucker from FMA, The Fan Zone Killer from Dying Light, and The Cook from Far Cry 5

Edited by G-Editor on Nov 14th 2018 at 2:04:26 AM

My sandbox of EPs and other stuff
username2527 Since: Nov, 2013
#136319: Nov 14th 2018 at 4:16:12 PM

TBH, I find Shou Tucker's heinousness a bit overrated. Calling him the most evil minor villain in fiction is kind of a stretch, Tucker is kind of low tier even in general CM terms, and while his action is horrible, especially since it is toward a family member it was done out of desperation.

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#136320: Nov 14th 2018 at 4:17:48 PM

I think Tucker mostly stands out in context. Nobody was expecting that kind of twist way back when with FMA.

lrrose Since: Jul, 2009
#136321: Nov 14th 2018 at 4:18:18 PM

Up with Downing and the Yule Man.

ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#136322: Nov 14th 2018 at 4:19:37 PM

Oh fuck! Given my username, I forgot about The Unknown Man from Elfen Lied. Guy despite his minor appearance, manages to stand out for his depravity.

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
bobg Since: Nov, 2012
#136323: Nov 14th 2018 at 4:24:06 PM

Any more votes on Chrysalis? She did try to have her hive feed off a baby, and she did try to kill two young teens, one of them being her own son. This is in addition to several Kick the Dog moments; taunting Discord by revealing that she was the reason he originally got turned to stone, lying to Screwball that Mothball never loved her and was just using her (and using the fact that she now knew of Zany as evidence of this), having her changelings take on the forms of the Mane 6's families to invoke Break Them by Talking, and mocking Discord when she has seemingly managed to kill Fluttershy.

Two more things I forgot to mention; first, when she threatens to kill Screwball if Mothball does not tell her everything he learned about Screwballs family, she implies that she would first torture her for information, saying "If I cannot get the information from you, I can go straight to the source". Second, while posing as Zany, she had two of her changelings pose as Fluttershy and a stallion to make it look like Fluttershy was being unfaithful to Discord. She did this so Discord would start misusing his powers again in anger and the Mane 6, Fluttershy included, would have to turn him back to stone. Screwball makes it back just in time to stop that from happening. Chrysalis seemed very gleeful to see Fluttershy being forced to turn Discord back to stone. Sorry I forgot these things

jjj
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#136324: Nov 14th 2018 at 4:28:23 PM

I'll say yeah to the last two and does anyone have an opinion on Laude now that the points seem to have been made? I really don't know the work so I'm going to abstain (forget if I voted for him when he originally went up).

Most heinous minor villain? Well of my own if level-long villains count I'd say Cassus Vicus is up there for what he does to his citizens for thousands of years and the Vapor Lord, what with his keeping of comatose children for decades to feed off of.

[up] No to Chrysalis.

Edited by 43110 on Nov 14th 2018 at 7:28:57 AM

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#136325: Nov 14th 2018 at 4:30:02 PM

Yea to the Yule Man.

Fanfic!Chrysalis... ergh. I think she just flunks heinousness, to be honest.

Most heinous minor villain? Hmm. Helgenish from Octopath is a recent stand-out to me.

Edited by Scraggle on Nov 14th 2018 at 5:31:53 AM


Total posts: 326,048
Top