TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

Go To

During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#133426: Oct 18th 2018 at 6:29:12 PM

[up][up] Lighty and I will start that midnight sharp, don't you worry. Two keeps.

Edited by Scraggle on Oct 18th 2018 at 7:29:40 AM

ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#133427: Oct 18th 2018 at 6:30:01 PM

@Minister Of Sinister Yeah... Although is it okay to pull out my writeup? Its okay... It'll be safe in my Discord server and will update it as the time goes on.

Edited by ElfenLiedFan90 on Oct 18th 2018 at 8:30:22 PM

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
erazor0707 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
JHT Aspiring Writer and Animator Since: Oct, 2018 Relationship Status: Abstaining
Aspiring Writer and Animator
#133429: Oct 18th 2018 at 7:05:22 PM

[up][up][up]Everyone on the internet has been shipping Eddie and the Symbiote.

I'm a Spider-Man fan, so I know how...close...the two are, but it isn't that bad, is it?

Edited by JHT on Oct 18th 2018 at 10:05:45 AM

Kylotrope Barb(Its a thread joke you wouldn't get it) from Honolulu Hawaii Since: Apr, 2018
Barb(Its a thread joke you wouldn't get it)
#133430: Oct 18th 2018 at 7:15:16 PM

Eh. It depends on how you view it. For the most part it's like the comics but there are some Ho Yay moments here and there

Things are really about to get Fun around here
JHT Aspiring Writer and Animator Since: Oct, 2018 Relationship Status: Abstaining
Aspiring Writer and Animator
#133431: Oct 18th 2018 at 7:18:31 PM

[up]I really wouldn't consider it Ho Yay when the other is pretty much sentient liquid with no real gender

Stellarvore Since: Apr, 2016
#133432: Oct 18th 2018 at 7:25:41 PM

Okay! I've got a new candidate. His type has sort of become my specialty.

What's the work?

Hell House LLC 2 is the underwhelming sequel to the underrated Hell House LLC. A group of filmmakers go to investigate the disappearances of a number of a previous film crew Abaddon Hotel, where 15 people were killed in a freak accident at a Halloween attraction, the eponymous Hell House. Meanwhile, sinister forces are at work that appear to be luring people into the hotel.

Who is he? What has he done?

Andrew Tully, the owner of the Abaddon Hotel, is a leader of a Satanic cult (surprise, surprise). Prior to the events of the first movie, he would take his guests and trap them in rooms (modeled after the ones in H.H. Holmes' murder castle) where they would be killed and sent to the Lake of Fire. Sometime later, he ordered his followers to commit a mass suicide, and the first film says that he killed himself as well, but he's alive and well in the second. The hotel's more recent victims' ghosts lure people right into Tully's hands.

Tully makes a bargain with Alex, who started Hell House with his crew, to help him get more money. Over the course of the month as they remodel the place, the crew starts being tormented by some bizarre apparitions. On opening night, a group of tourists "check in", and 15 of them are killed by some horrible unseen malfunction. After the "accident", Alex demands that his crew stick around, only for them all to be haunted by those apparitions and eventually killed. The movie ends with Mitch Cavanaugh — one of the documentarians investigating the events going to Hell House — with his fellow investigator, who ends up dead.

Come the second movie, a lot of thrill seekers have gone to the hotel and never come out. Tully appears on a talk show, impersonating an ornery politician who's angry with Cavanaugh for trying to give the town of Abaddon a bad name. Cavanaugh reluctantly goes to the hotel with another crew lead by Jessica Fox to search for some incriminating evidence on Tully, among them a paranormal investigator who is — along with his cameraman — ironically the first to die, being hanged after contacting the spirits of the hotel. The crew gets chased by some ghosts, then eventually caught and brought to none other than Andrew Tully himself, who acts like a gracious host at first, but is quick to anger whenever they do something that pisses him off.

He gives a speech about how his followers had willingly entered the Lake of Fire, and killing off each crew member one by one until only Cavanaugh and one other are left, and he gives Cavanaugh the choice to either be die himself or Molly, the only other living non-skeptical crew member, to be killed, while the other goes free. The results are unseen, but either one or both of them are killed. Finally, Tully sent the footage of this movie to owner of the Wynn Media Group to lure more people into the hotel.

Mitigating factors

None, really. He only made his deal with Alex so that he could lure more "guests" in, all to sate his own lust for power. And even then, he went back on his bargain, and Alex just ended up dead with the rest of his crew. He probably also only offered to spare someone at the end of the second movie for the same reason. The only thing that strikes me as remotely mitigating is that Hell certainly seems to have a foothold in the town, and in the hotel in particular, so it seems like he might be at least somewhat under its influence. He's said to have seen himself as a modern-day Dante, which suggests that he's probably not just brainwashed or possessed or anything. Furthermore, he doesn't do much directly, but the only reason the hotel is actually haunted is because of him. Oh, and he probably doesn't have many altruistic goals, either, seeing how the spirits in the hotel are nothing but malevolent, and his methods are plenty horrible.

Verdict

Keeper. It is supposed to be part of a trilogy, but really, I don't see Tully finding redemption anywhere in the cards.

Edited by Stellarvore on Oct 18th 2018 at 10:34:38 AM

JHT Aspiring Writer and Animator Since: Oct, 2018 Relationship Status: Abstaining
Aspiring Writer and Animator
#133433: Oct 18th 2018 at 7:27:00 PM

[tup]Andrew

KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
MasterJoseph Frolaytia X Qwenthur of Heavy Object from Not telling. Since: Mar, 2018 Relationship Status: All I Want for Christmas is a Girlfriend
Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#133437: Oct 18th 2018 at 7:35:36 PM

Alright, y'know what? It's midnight somewhere, let's do this.

What's the work?

Venom' is a 2018 film starring Tom Hardy as Eddie Brock, a reporter who's kind of a loser...Eddie, by chance comes into contact with an alien being known as The Symbiote, a creature of an alien race that attaches itself to a user...it's also carnivorous, feeding on its host and/or others. Eddie...also makes a few reckless decisions that cost him his job. Chief among them is his interview with the CEO of the Life Corporation, billionaire philanthropist Carlton Drake...who has brought the Symbiotes to earth...

Who is Carlton Drake?

The brilliant, daring CEO of Life Corporation who may have done some human experimentation a few....dozen times. Nobody's perfect right? So, Drake? Drake begins to experiment with the Symbiote, bringing in large groups of homeless people...he gives them speeches about the importance of all they're doing,speaking gently to a man named Isaac by reminding him of the biblical story of Isaac and Abraham, and saying that the true hero was Isaac accepting the sacrifice....when the Symbiote horribly kills the man, Drake remarks "next subject" with all the emotion of ordering a tire replaced.

Dora Skirth, one of Drake's scientists, is getting appalled later as Drake runs through innocent test subject after innocent test subject. One of Eddie's acquaintances, a woman named Maria is the latest host, and Dora helps Eddie break into Life's building to find the information...however, Maria has been 'burnt out' by the Symbiote and transfers to Eddie. Drake kills Dora for this by exposing her to his last captive Symbiote, and tries to have Eddie recaptured with the Symbiote, which is of course, Venom...and reveals to Eddie that they're kind of the advanced scouts of an invasion force who swoop into new planets and devour all life.

The last Symbiote, their leader Riot, escapes detection and eventually gets to San Francisco by body hopping...until it seizes on Drake. However, Drake? Turns out to enjoy it. In fact, Drake's god complex seizes over and he becomes Riot's willing partner and collaborator, helping him massacre scientists and more with the intention of leaving in a probe to collect the rest of the Symbiotes and bring them to earth...resulting in a widespread massacre of all humans....Venom and Eddie engage him and Riot, ending as they sabotage the probe and flee...leaving the rocket to explode, and Drake to be incinerated in the fire, saving the earth as Venom and Eddie remain bonded and became the city's protector. A lethal protector, if you will...

Heinous standard?

Drake's...bad. Human testing, murder, sacrificing innocent homeless people to the Symbiote (which he does a fuckton of) and y'know, trying to destroy humanity. The only one in the film who kind of rivals him there is Riot himself, and they're willing partners in the endeavor by the end. Neither overshadows the other. Easy pass.

Mitigating Qualities

He talks a lot about bettering humanity and the world and so forth...thing is? Drake...seems to have a serious god complex. All his talk about solving the world's issues? Is his ego speaking. He's obsessed with doing things for his own benefit, giving that inspiring biblical talk to poor Isaac...before seeing him killed without batting an eye. When he realizes the power of Riot, they bond and Drake happily sells out the world to its end. That's who and what Drake truly is under it all. No affection for Riot, just an alliance of convenience. Like the only time he seems to show concern for someone lse is when Riot shows up in his host, a little girl and Drake goes to ask her what's going on...but given his character before and after? I'm not inclined to think he's actually got a oft spot for kids there. Basically, he's a sociopath with a god complex.

Conclusion?

Oh, yes here. Scrags has Riot well in hand.

JHT Aspiring Writer and Animator Since: Oct, 2018 Relationship Status: Abstaining
Aspiring Writer and Animator
#133438: Oct 18th 2018 at 7:48:43 PM

[tup]Drake

erazor0707 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Overlord Since: Mar, 2013
G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
The 47th President
#133442: Oct 18th 2018 at 7:57:52 PM

[tup] To Andrew and a definite [tup] To Drake

My sandbox of EPs and other stuff
ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#133444: Oct 18th 2018 at 7:59:57 PM

Yes to Andrew and Drake... How's the movie @Lightysnake @Scraggle

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#133445: Oct 18th 2018 at 8:00:14 PM

yes to Tully and a yes to the boring-ness that was Drake.

[up] lemme chime in: not fantastic.

[down] chiming in again: yes there.

Edited by 43110 on Oct 18th 2018 at 11:01:06 AM

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#133446: Oct 18th 2018 at 8:00:35 PM

[up][up] Stupid, pointless, poorly-written, and utterly ridiculous. And I loved every single moment of it.

And yes there! Anyways, my half of our duo tonight, Riot.

Who is Riot? What has he done?

Riot? Is what Venom calls a "team leader," a powerful, silver Symbiote with eyes on Earth. Riot's one of the four Symbiotes that the Life Foundation brings to Earth. The rocket crashes with most of the Symbiotes recovered and brought back to the Foundation's laboratories... but Riot escapes, killing the driver of the car he's in and possessing the other. For the next few months? Riot travels across Malaysia, surfing from body to body while fatally feeding off of his hosts. In a Malaysian square, Riot, in his host body, develops a taste for a merchant's wares and brutally murders the man when he tries to drive him off. When the locals try and attack him for this? Riot promptly massacres everyone in the vicinity excepting a frail old lady... which Riot then proceeds to body-jack as well. In the Malaysian airport? Riot's final target is a little girl.

Riot, feeding off of the little girl, makes his way to America where the other Symbiotes are, where he ambushes and takes over Carlton Drake. Drake, though? Ends up being a perfect match for him. Riot coldly dismisses the other Symbiotes who had died, revealing he's got millions more coming to Earth. Riot's plan? Launch another rocket to the Symbiote's homeworld... and bring back his kind in droves, feasting on all humanity and conquering the planet. After unsuccessfully interrogating Eddie Brock for the location of Venom, Riot decides to go ahead with the plan. When the crew operating the rocket informs Drake that there's going to be a hold-up with the launch? Riot takes over his body and proceeds to massacre all the dozens there, deciding to just activate the rocket on his own.

Riot is confronted just before the launch by Venom himself, whom Riot decides to kill himself when Venom makes it clear his sympathies now lie with humanity and even trying to cannibalize him. Thankfully, Venom and Brock's determination ends up sabotaging the probe... leading to a gigantic, fiery explosion that incinerates Drake and Riot with him.

Any mitigating factors?

Well... mmm... nope. His character's not rich but it's there — he's got the arrogance, the sadism, and the pointless, abundant cruelty you'd expect for someone who's basically a distilled expy of Carnage in this continuity (saving Cletus' actual cameo in The Stinger) and he has no care whatsoever for his own kind, unhesitatingly trying to kill Venom himself the moment he turns on him and dismissing the others who died on Earth. Oh, and the standard? Riot easily, easily clears separate from Drake. He possess and devours old women and little girls from the inside out, massacres dozens of innocent people, and tries to kill all humanity. Clear here.

Conclusion?

Easy keep. Pleasantly surprised this film gave Lighty and I two keepers.

Thoughts?

Edited by Scraggle on Oct 18th 2018 at 9:03:32 AM

Overlord Since: Mar, 2013
Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Clown-Face Wild Child from Canada Since: Dec, 2015 Relationship Status: In another castle
Wild Child
#133450: Oct 18th 2018 at 8:07:56 PM

[tup]Drake and Riot.

Why so serious?

Total posts: 326,048
Top