During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
And let's not forget Hans Gruber. The closest he gets to sadism is when he's about to kill John... which goe right out the window.
Man, The Woobie will be a nightmare since it's way more subjective than CM and MB characters.
What isn't subjective is GDV. And that would be hard to clean up because there are few people who want to deal with boring villains.
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How dear you, good sir!
GDV Are perfect villains! As someone who grew up playing Kirby, I demand an apology!
Edited by JHT on Oct 15th 2018 at 6:55:46 AM
Ah, Kirby, A perfect example of how a GDV can still be pure Nightmare Fuel.
Also, new seasonal candidate!
What's the setting?
Van Helsing is a 2004 action flick with eponymous vampire hunter Gabriel van Helsing in the title role, a remagined version of Abraham van Helsing from Stoker's Dracula... now, I'm not talking about the movie today. After the movie's release, Dark Horse released a one-shot side comic called Van Helsing: Beneath the Rue Morgue taking place where Helsing was in Paris, shortly after he killed Mr. Hyde. Dogged by authorities, Helsing finds himself chasing an invisible monster into the sewers where he finds the laboratory of... Dr. Moreau.
Who is Dr. Moreau? What has he done?
So Dr. Moreau's as we all know him in essence. Underneath the streets of Paris, it seems, Moreau has been raiding corpses from the morgue, as "clay" for his experiments, and... well, if you know Dr. Moreau?
Van Helsing finds a zoo's worth of chimerical abominations Dr. Moreau's made, half-men, half-animal, liminal between both and suffering every single moment of their tortured existences. Moreau shows himself to Helsing, hearing the clatter with the invisible beast captured... just to his plan. The invisible beast was a monster spawned from the mutated cells of a toad to create a body like that of the gill-man, shut inside with Moreau shut in a human heart. When Helsing coldly informs him that said monster broke out and murdered two women? Moreau's snide and dismissive, glorying over his twisted mad science farm and countless he's left in agony within for him to experiment on and lord over, aiming to create a "new world" — out of spite, as he says.
The worst part? Said invisible monster... the spirit of one of the murdered women speaks to Van Helsing. Dr. Moreau personally murdered the man who's heart he stole from the beast and locked it inside the body, resulting in a creature with a broken, tortured mind who was drawn to his family by his lingering humanity — but ended up slaughtering them in his agonized insanity. The spirit implores Helsing to put down the beast, but he's more interested in seizing Moreau for his affront against the hand of God. Moreau escapes, and floods the entire laboratory to kill Helsing, drowning all of his experiments to no concern of his except "so much work destroyed, oh well"... the last page of the comic sees Moreau setting sail away from the rigidity of civilization to continue his mad experiments alone in peace. Somewhere in the south seas...
Any mitigating factors?
No. Moreau obliterates the standard for his own work and setting and he's easily characterized enough for a twenty-four page comic. Nothing to talk about.
Conclusion?
Keep.
Edited by Scraggle on Oct 15th 2018 at 5:21:21 AM
Yes to Moreau! Glad you liked it, Scraggle! Bout time we had a CM from the Van Helsing franchise.
One more I'll be watching this season to look into? Thunderbolt Fantasy. now writeups:
- The Dead Matter: The wicked vampire Vellich seeks to cause a zombie apocalypse to control the world and recover his powerful artifact,t he dead-controlling scarab. Murdering the assistant of the hunter Ian Mc Allister, Vellich begins to track the scarab to the young woman Gretchen, leaving a trail of corpses in his wake before torturing Gretchen with a vision of her dead brother, attempting to murder her and her friends. Vellich later usurps his rival Sebed by tearing him apart from the inside out, stopping at nothing to seize the scarab and his power anew.
- The Dark One: Marcel Hart, a satanist teen, is a vicious child who causes deaths for his own amusement, murdering multiple people via magically induced 'accidents' to sacrifice them to Satan. When his own parents have issues with him, Marcel kills them as well, in addition to a young woman he was sleeping with via a rather public murder. Staying with his parents' friends, the Gorlays, Marcel plots to sacrifice them to his master as well, children included.
- Entombed: Eli Lealan is the head of a Satanist sect that practices human sacrifice. Lealan kills multiple people with his coven, enslaving and tormenting their souls while even brutally murdering children in the sacrifices. Lealan intends to free and summon Satan himself to set him upon the world, even betraying a loyal follower as a sacrifice by having her hanged in pain and terror while relishing it all the while.
- Demons: Dale Winderson is a Corrupt Corporate Executive who preys on the insecurities of the young man Stephen. Having once raped a woman and tricked Stephen's father into taking the fall for it, Winderson plans to use Stephen's gifts to unlock the secrets of the artifact, the Black Pearl to call demons to the world, offering the entire town Ash Valley to be massacred by the demons. Winderson intends to ascend to near godhood by offering the entire world to the demons, not caring what they will do to so many innocents as long as he profits.
- Night of the werewolf: the savage Angus Broon is a savage werewolf who relishes his power over his village. Slaughtering livestock and people alike, Angus kidnaps a woman named Ingrid to become his werewolf bride, though he later uses her as a human shield when things are tough. Angus happily murders all in his path when he finds out werewolf hunters are coming for him. The beastly Angus goes on a killing spree in the village to satiate his village and kill his pursuers.
- The Pluto Pact: The wicked sorcerer Balzur practices human sacrifice, tormenting countless innocents and sacrificing children in horrible pain to the dark god Pluto. Vowing to return, and doing so years later in the guise of a pharmaceutical executive named Dyne, Balzur continues his gruesome activities before attempting to set off a nuclear apocalypse, intent on making all humanity his sacrifice to his master Pluto.
- Monster Force: The Dark Town is a living and malevolent entity that takes the shape of a town to lure in prey, while it sadistically relishes in their fear as it drains their lives and souls, the fate that befalls two luckless travelers in the opening. The Dark Town has been traveling for centuries, depopulating entire towns that it lures into its borders before devouring them, vanishing to repeat the cycle anew before trapping the Monster Force themselves.
- Dungeons and Dragons: The wicked Damodar is the right hand man of Profion, seeking to dominate all Izmir. Damodar kills those in his path to recover a map that leads to the staff of dragons, torturing the heroine Marina for its location as well. Seemingly slain, Damodar returns a century hence while killing more people to obtain the Dragon Orb to awaken an evil dragon deity. Killing and torturing even more people, Damodar requests the dragon burn all Izmir to massacre the people, all for petty revenge on their ancestors for his first and well deserved end.
Edited by Lightysnake on Oct 15th 2018 at 4:21:28 AM
Yea on that Van Helsing candidate... As for other non sadistic CM...Is Gruber, Wraith and Neil Cassidy considered as one?
Also, for the topic on the discussion... I'm just gonna snatch Dragalia Lost as I play the game and several mangas such as Marry Grave, Kimi wa 008, Memesis and so on.
Edited by ElfenLiedFan90 on Oct 15th 2018 at 6:24:03 PM
"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."Griffith is almost a non-sadistic CM. An odd case because other than the rape, he'd qualify. He was always a cold, irredeemably evil sociopath, but then the Eclipse happens, and he's a level above. After that, Griffith almost settles down his sadism in order to be a Villain with Good Publicity.
Edited by Riley1sCool on Oct 15th 2018 at 4:28:32 AM
What about Knight of Cerebus? I have seen that trope misused on sooooo many character pages. It is suppose to be for a character that consistently darkens the tone of a lighthearted work, but I have seen people put characters from works that aren't even lighthearted or were Played for laughs. Like I think even Eric Cartman is under it.
Ko C REALLY needs a cleanup.
Wraith's got some traces of sadism, even if he's not overly sadistic about him. "Oh, yes, satisfaction. What else, indeed, is more gratifying than seeing the ever-insubordinate Nick Logan pay the consequences for his rash actions?" he muses, as he tries to blow up the moon while forcing the heroes to watch a simulation of the carnage.
Moreau.
Ok second thought I guess I'll give the killer from The Man That Only Monsters fear a shot as soon as I re-read it. Almost tempted to do the same with A Story to Scare My Son but there's way too much in the ambigouity.
"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."Here's Damodar; it's added to the D&D reformat:
- The wicked Damodar is first the right-hand-man of Profion, seeking to dominate all Izmir. Damodar kills those in his path to recover a map that leads to the staff of dragons, torturing the heroine Marina for its location as well. Seemingly slain, Damodar returns a century hence while killing more people to obtain the Dragon Orb to awaken the evil Faluzure, the Dragon God of Decay and Undeath. Killing and torturing even more people, Damodar requests the dragon burn all Izmir to massacre the people, all for petty revenge on their ancestors for his first and well-deserved end.
to Moreau.
Actually Eric Cartman's no longer consider as a Knight of Cerebus (in spite of his horrid actions many of them were still Played for Laughs). Honestly the only one in South Park that I would consider to be a KoC is Lennart Bedrager.
Also I definitely agree Knight of Cerebus needs to have a cleanup if it already doesn't.
Edited by G-Editor on Oct 15th 2018 at 1:40:10 AM
My sandbox of EPs and other stuff

How many votes did Audrey Redheart get?