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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Enid Sinclair
#132726: Oct 13th 2018 at 2:28:32 PM

I think he has crossed the line with Dayu, but I agree that with Serrator around he could be cut.

Edit: However now that you mention Vrak did do something similar. So yeah cut away.

Edited by Bullman on Oct 13th 2018 at 2:35:26 AM

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#132727: Oct 13th 2018 at 2:42:58 PM

Talking Xandred over with Mir a bit I'm all for a cut.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#132728: Oct 13th 2018 at 2:45:54 PM

Can Serrator be trimmed? His entry's 285 words.

ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#132729: Oct 13th 2018 at 2:51:47 PM

Sure on the manager and as for Xandred? Yeah, easy cut and I wont gonna cry on him being cut.

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
FriedWarthog Since: Jun, 2014 Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
#132730: Oct 13th 2018 at 3:11:17 PM

Late yes to evil Tommy Oliver, and yeah, cut Xandread. I'm not super familiar with Power Rangers but I was never quite sold on him from what his entry showed.

Anyway, yesterday I deleted an effortpost I wrote for a Mega Man villain: Sirius from the third Mega Man Star Force game. I'm sorry about that, but I felt I made a huge mistake in proposing him. Honestly, I feel I ended up overselling Sirius' heinousness unintentionally and felt super guilty about it: he sucks planets into a black hole... but you're never actually explicitly told that the people there die. Just that he keeps EM beings and the planets themselves, but you never actually see them: his black hole is a dark void with not much of anything in it. And compared to Gemini and especially King who have a lot of incredibly cruel, personal moments of villainy, Sirius doesn't really do much: he's onscreen for a total of maybe, what, thirty seconds, and that's it.

I mean, when you get down to it? The plot about him sucking planets into a black hole and enslaving people is basically just window dressing for a superboss, and the amount of vagueness in regards to his body count makes me feel that he has too much ambiguity on his side to the point that it hurts his case. So sorry about the trouble I caused yesterday.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#132732: Oct 13th 2018 at 3:27:34 PM

[up][up] Dude, it's cool. In the future though (and this applies to anybody): It's probably better to just say why you were wrong without deleting the effortpost.

G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
The 47th President
#132733: Oct 13th 2018 at 3:37:44 PM

[tup] to the manager.

I'm all for Xandred getting cut (To be honest , I always thought Serrator to be much worse than Xandred. Ironically I prefer Serrator to be the Big Bad rather than Xandred):

Now as the one who got Serrator approved and wrote-him up, I can take care of re-writing him and de-potting him. So here it is

  • Serrator, The Nighlok King, introduces himself slaughtering Master Xandred's army of Moogers. Under Xandred's services, he sadistically torments the Rangers and forces people on an island to fight each other to the death. He latter betrays Xandred, attacking his Co-Dragons Octoroo and Dayu, admitting to have turned the latter and her beloved Deker into accursed Nighloks for all of eternity taking pleasure at their suffering. Serrator's plan would be revealed wanting to crack the Earth so the Netherworld to flood it, in an attempt to take over both worlds, uncaring about the billions of lives lost in the process, human and Nighlok alike, cementing himself as the vilest foe both heroes and villains had ever faced.

How does it look?

Edited by G-Editor on Oct 14th 2018 at 9:32:58 AM

My sandbox of EPs and other stuff
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#132734: Oct 13th 2018 at 3:39:30 PM

Looks good. Drafts please, and I'll clean it up a bit.

BTW, here are the de-potholed NCIS entries:

  • Malcolm Tallridge and John Bordinay, from season 1's "Ambush", are the heads of a dangerous militia group called "Enhancing Law Enforcement", a group known for killing immigrants or anyone who remotely looks like one, and a group which has stolen several anti-tank missiles. Tallridge, the leader, would order the hits, while Bordinay, described by Special Agent Mike Renko as a "paranoid nut job", served as his second-in-comand, and would carry them out without the slightest hesitation. Their actions resulted in the deaths of over a dozen immigrants, including three children, who were chased into the desert and died of thirst. They are also just as brutal and ruthless to their men; when a member, Scott Reilly, brings in NCIS agent Callen into their fold without their knowledge, they have Reilly killed without a second thought.
  • "The Phantom", real name Tom Smith, was a notorious Serial Killer who appeared in season 1's "Random On Purpose". Taking great pleasure in killing throughout his life, he started killing animals as a child, before moving on to humans as an adult. He traveled to many small cities where he would use his job as a receptionist to lure anyone, regardless of age or gender, into traps and kill them in various fashions. His killings grabbed the attention of Abby Sciuto, who travels to Los Angeles when she heard of his latest kill taking place there. When he notices Abby, he kidnaps her where he tell her about all of his murders and how she and him have a "connection" and Abby, in disgust, responds by calling him a creep. Feeling insulted, Smith then tries to decapitate her with an axe before being killed by the Los Angeles team who came to rescue Abby.
  • Tahir Khaled is a terrorist and war criminal from Sudan—demonstrated by a mass grave of his victims appearing in his first appearance—who serves as Agent Sam Hanna's Arch-Enemy. First appearing in season 3, he brutally murders three CIA agents and tortures Sam for information. He later arranges for his sister Jada, whom he also regularly abuses, to be killed, only to have a recently-rescued Sam save her. Upset only because Jada will testify against him, Khaled sought vengeance against Sam during season 7 by targeting the latter's loved ones, ranging from launching a missile at his family's home to appearing at his son's school with the intent to kill him, while callously killing innocents along the way. Upon being arrested, he arranges for his escape near the end of season 8 by kidnapping Sam's wife, Michelle, to use as a bargaining chip for his release. Despite being released, Tahir kills her anyway via asphyxiation, then proceeds to steal her body and start to desecrate it. When Tahir manages to lure Sam to him in a bus, he attempts to detonate a bomb he placed inside said bus, intending to take Sam as well as everyone else in the bus with him to the grave. Though lacking the body count of some other villains, Tahir Khaled makes up for this with his petty cruelty against Sam and his family and friends, cementing him as one of the franchise's most personal foes.
  • Operatives "Lin" and "Davis", from season 3's "Quid Pro Quo", are agents from the Chinese government tasked in finding a subject to test a super virus the government recently created, though they go way beyond what was assigned. Upon arriving in New Orleans they kidnap three American citizens, then proceeded to burn them alive, two so they could take their identities and the third simply because they could. They then storm into a local bakery and force the baker to poison a cake with their virus, only to kill him with the virus once they are done with him. They ship the cake to a Navy base, killing seven Navy personnel, and later infecting Medical Examiner Loretta Wade with the virus. Despite already testing their virus, they decide to unleash their virus onto the air and into the city, attempting to kill hundreds if not thousands. This fails, and the team attempts to capture them alive due to their knowledge of where they are keeping the antidote. This results in one operative dying attempting to kill them, and the other committing suicide just so they could not find the antidote.
  • Mr. John Stone appears in the last episodes of season 3 working for Mayor Douglas Hamilton, as well as one of the main investors of the latter's project to turn the neighborhood of Clearwater into a naval shipyard. They plan to do this by opening the floodgates, despite 2,000 people still living there. Under Hamilton's employment, Mr. Stone has already murdered nearly a dozen people, including a Marine investigating the project's shadier dealings, an innocent bystander to distract the team chasing him, and has even convinced Hamilton to kill Congresswoman Michelle Angelou, an opponent of the project, when he himself failed. At one point he sends his men to fight Dwayne Pride in his bar while he plants explosives inside, destroying Dwayne's bar, killing his own men, and nearly killing Dwayne himself before he was able to turn the tables on Stone. Dwayne later finds out that Stone plans to drown the 2,000 people still living there. Though nominally subservient to Mayor Hamilton, Mr. Stone's lack of regard for his boss and human life in general, as well as the Mayor's good intentions for New Orleans in favor of Greed and self-interest, cements Mr. Stone as a greater threat, a more formidable enemy, and among the franchise's most wicked.

JHT Aspiring Writer and Animator Since: Oct, 2018 Relationship Status: Abstaining
Aspiring Writer and Animator
#132735: Oct 13th 2018 at 3:39:52 PM

Cut Xandred!

TommyFresh Since: Aug, 2013
#132736: Oct 13th 2018 at 4:01:05 PM

Cut Xandred. And I guess I'll switch to [tdown] on Sirius now that I know why the EP was deleted.

JHT Aspiring Writer and Animator Since: Oct, 2018 Relationship Status: Abstaining
Aspiring Writer and Animator
#132737: Oct 13th 2018 at 4:02:19 PM

Cut Xandred!

EDIT: Sorry, ignore this!

Edited by JHT on Oct 13th 2018 at 7:03:17 AM

FriedWarthog Since: Jun, 2014 Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
#132738: Oct 13th 2018 at 4:02:43 PM

Honestly, after further review I'm thinking that I'm underselling Sirius. God I don't even know what to do anymore

JHT Aspiring Writer and Animator Since: Oct, 2018 Relationship Status: Abstaining
Aspiring Writer and Animator
#132739: Oct 13th 2018 at 4:04:30 PM

[up]It’s a recommendation on forum, we can just all forget about this smile

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#132740: Oct 13th 2018 at 4:27:01 PM

Fried, I would reocmmend just putting the EP up, putting your doubts in and letting everyone make a decision.

JHT Aspiring Writer and Animator Since: Oct, 2018 Relationship Status: Abstaining
Aspiring Writer and Animator
#132741: Oct 13th 2018 at 4:40:19 PM

[up]Fried? evil grin

KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Shin Megami Tensei IV
#132742: Oct 13th 2018 at 5:13:48 PM

Trying to get a Tommy' entry...

I cut the Hyperforce part. Dunno if is a good idea, I should mention it or not? It wasn't part of his many invations, It was the rangers trying to help Drakkon' world from another villain and Drakkon being a Ungrateful Bastard.

In the crossover with the Power Rangers Hyperforce, Drakkon uses and beheads one of the hostages to force them to help him to get the Serpentera before heavily injuring one of their members while they try to avoid it before escaping.

I saw that Zamasu' entry in the Dragon Ball had more than 250 (282), that is fine for a individual CM?. I ask because both come from large franchises despite having just one Story Arc (two/three actually in the case of Tommy).

Edited by KazuyaProta on Oct 13th 2018 at 7:32:08 AM

Watch me destroying my country
erazor0707 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
#132743: Oct 13th 2018 at 5:46:25 PM

I believe under 300 is acceptable. Besides, Tommy seems very heinous with a load of crimes, so we can understand the length.

KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Shin Megami Tensei IV
#132744: Oct 13th 2018 at 5:54:58 PM

[up] Well. Trying it. Now to post it in the drafts.

Watch me destroying my country
Kylotrope Barb(Its a thread joke you wouldn't get it) from Honolulu Hawaii Since: Apr, 2018
Barb(Its a thread joke you wouldn't get it)
#132745: Oct 13th 2018 at 6:18:39 PM

I guess im alone in thinking xandred still counts

Things are really about to get Fun around here
JHT Aspiring Writer and Animator Since: Oct, 2018 Relationship Status: Abstaining
Aspiring Writer and Animator
#132746: Oct 13th 2018 at 6:24:35 PM

[up]I think he still counts!

Kylotrope Barb(Its a thread joke you wouldn't get it) from Honolulu Hawaii Since: Apr, 2018
Barb(Its a thread joke you wouldn't get it)
#132747: Oct 13th 2018 at 6:48:47 PM

Thanks.

He is responsible for the shoes events and tragedies that happen or the main charachter Jayden. Also what he does to dayu at the end was downright scary and heartbreaking.

Things are really about to get Fun around here
Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#132748: Oct 13th 2018 at 6:49:21 PM

And it's not unique in the franchise. Or even his own series. You see the issue with him standing out?

Kylotrope Barb(Its a thread joke you wouldn't get it) from Honolulu Hawaii Since: Apr, 2018
Barb(Its a thread joke you wouldn't get it)
#132749: Oct 13th 2018 at 6:56:44 PM

Hmmm...I usually like to judge for specific shows when it comes to mass franchises.

Could you re explain why you think he dosent stand out for his series? He is responsible for all the things that happen in the series(besides what serrator did)

Edited by Kylotrope on Oct 13th 2018 at 7:07:52 AM

Things are really about to get Fun around here

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