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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

lrrose Since: Jul, 2009
Knack Since: Mar, 2018
#131652: Oct 2nd 2018 at 5:21:03 PM

@NTG Over the top doesn't necessarily mean bad though, look at 2000 AD. tongue

Edited by Knack on Oct 2nd 2018 at 10:01:48 AM

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#131653: Oct 2nd 2018 at 5:23:12 PM

Yea to Matter Man, who sounds more like a Silver Age superhero than a jihadist baby-eating supervillain.

So, here's one I've been working on for a bit…

What's the setting?

Moon Knight is a Marvel superhero who came to prominence in the 80s… Marc Spector, a mercenary alongside his French friend Jean Paul DuChamp (affectionately named Frenchie) is left for dead in Cairo by his employer after he draws a line at his barbaric methods. Marc dies under a statue of the moon god Khonshu… and is reborn as Moon Knight, defender of the innocent with four identities and multiple personalities with them.

His archenemy, aforementioned employer? Raoul Armand Bushman.

Who is Bushman? What has he done?

A mercenary for hire with a wall decorated with the skulls of his victims, a rapist, slaver, terrorist and mass murderer in his long and distinguished career, Bushman is a nasty Psycho for Hire with a painted skull on his face from the African nation of Burunda. Introduced in Moon Knight’s debut series massacring a rebel camp in the Sudan in search for an archaeological dig and its valuable gold artifacts. Bushman slaughters the small militia defending the town it's in and rounds up the town’s populace at gunpoint… when the professor heading the dig tries to stop him, Bushman tears out his throat with his silver teeth and promptly has everyone in the town massacred, sparing only the women to use as slaves and dances for his gang. When Marc tries to quit in disgust? Bushman guts him, leaving him to slowly perish in the desert.

Thankfully, Marc revives, and... you know the story. Marc stops Bushman’s tenure as a crime lord in Harlem. Bushman later tries to drown Marc and some of his allies, but it’s not until he becomes President Bushman that he becomes especially nasty. Kidnapping the daughter of the professor he murdered and Marc’s girlfriend, Marlene, Bushman reveals to Marc he's become the eternal President of his old country Burunda. And to prove to Marc he's still the same old Bushman? Bushman shoots dead one of his goons Marc takes as a battering chip.

So, President General Bushman? Is a horrible, oppressive dictator whose reign has killed over two-million people ever since he took over. Particularly, everyone with AIDS in the country? Bushman has them all systematically executed, having dozens gunned down at a time by his men while gloating to Marlene “I've found a cure!” Bushman is approached by representatives of a powerful drug cartel offering a partnership, informing him Burunda’s soil is perfect for the harvest of cocaine and heroin… and Bushman promptly slaughters them all, informing them he doesn't need a partnership. Bushman tries to extort ten million from Marc under the threat of cutting Marlene to pieces while preparing his country for an “agricultural reform,” having entire towns and villages wiped out to clear room for his dope fields… and he doesn't particularly care if the populace makes it out. One of his men asks where he evacuated the populace of one town he blasted flat, with Bushman replying “I never said I ordered them evacuated” with a skull pointedly sticking out in the sand beside him…

Marc invades the country and starts burning the fields, causing Bushman to flip out, ordering deserters hanged and shooting one of his admirals dead to give his position to a man who begs for the authority to control fires Marc is setting. Eventually? Bushman directly descends on a rebel village and starts massacring everyone in sight, leading to one more pitched battle with Marc that ends with him tossing Bushman to the rebels. Still? You can't keep a good supervillain down for long. Ousted from power but escaping, Bushman contracts a Soviet hypnotist to brainwash Marc’s loved ones to assassinate the Russian president and destroy the dawning peace between the USSR and America, all out of Bushman’s lust to utterly break and humiliate Marc, planning to force him to watch his friends die before him before killing him. Later? Bushman helps Morpheus try and bring about the end of the entire world by using the powers of Set to ignite a global war, personally placing Set's own statue in the UN meeting room to kickstart the chaos.

After years and years more of conflict, Marc finally kills Bushman by ripping off his face. Still not out for the count, though? Bushman is resurrected by Hood and returns to old habits, contracting the services of Scarecrow to kill the faculty of an asylum and then horribly lobotomize all the patients within into his cannon fodder foot soldiers. Unleashing the inmates to wreak havoc around the city and blowing up a bridge, Bushman draws Marc to him and tries to kill him, almost toppling a building full of screaming innocent people and trying to sic his mob on Marc as he holds it up… still, once again, Bushman is defeated.

In his most recent appearances… sigh. Bushman’s an obese loser of a crack dealer who the new Big Bad, the Sun King, approaches in his quest to defeat Marc. Bushman becomes the Sun King’s funny fat sidekick who overeats, whines about how lame he is now, gets his ass kicked every time he's on screen… Lord, I hope they reverse this. Bushman escapes, still fat but still in commission, so here's to hoping they reverse this awful Villain Decay and use him in smarter material.

Any mitigating factors?

Laughable. Bushman has never showcased a single good quality during his almost 40-year tenure as a supervillain. His Freudian Excuse, as revealed in his official profile? His farmer family was forced to move because of European entrepreneurs. The logical step is to become a mass-murdering mercenary who later kills over two-million of his own home country's populace. Uh-huh. He stops his associate from raping Marlene, once, but it's purely out of pragmatism and he notes as such (plus he's already been established as a rapist himself at this point, so?).

The standard? For a C-list supervillain with no superpowers whatsoever, Bushman blows past it. He's nasty enough as a mercenary with truckloads of onscreen murder, but once you get into him as a dictator depopulating entire towns of his own citizens, lobotomizing an asylum full of dozens of people, almost destroying the entire planet? Bushman punches ten miles out of his weight class and easily, easily stands out even in the greater Marvel universe.

Conclusion?

A rock-solid easy keeper. I'm surprised he hasn't come up here before.

Thoughts?

Edited by Scraggle on Oct 2nd 2018 at 6:30:42 AM

Knack Since: Mar, 2018
#131654: Oct 2nd 2018 at 5:23:56 PM

Yes to Bushman. Sounds like a Mega Man robot master.

Beast from Ontario, Canada Since: Aug, 2012 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#131656: Oct 2nd 2018 at 5:25:47 PM

[tup] Bushman.

"It's like...a cliff, and if I do it, I'm just gonna...fall." "I think we're already falling."
emperors Messenger from another dimension. Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: It's complicated
Messenger from another dimension.
#131657: Oct 2nd 2018 at 5:26:21 PM

Yes to Midnight, Matter Man, and Bushman.

Welcome to the world of greatest media!
therealjackieboy from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
#131658: Oct 2nd 2018 at 5:27:38 PM

[tup] George W. Bushman

It's Spooky Month!
Clown-Face Wild Child from Canada Since: Dec, 2015 Relationship Status: In another castle
Wild Child
#131659: Oct 2nd 2018 at 5:28:30 PM

[tup]Bushman.

Why so serious?
MasterJoseph Frolaytia X Qwenthur of Heavy Object from Not telling. Since: Mar, 2018 Relationship Status: All I Want for Christmas is a Girlfriend
Frolaytia X Qwenthur of Heavy Object
#131660: Oct 2nd 2018 at 5:32:42 PM

[tup]Bush Master

IPP Wick Check created.
ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#131661: Oct 2nd 2018 at 5:42:29 PM

yes to the another man.

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#131662: Oct 2nd 2018 at 5:44:28 PM

Well, with 15 [tup] for the Joker and 14 [tup] for Darkseid, here's my write-ups for I'm a Marvel... And I'm a DC.

  • Marvel Comics/DC Comics fan series I'm a Marvel... And I'm a DC:
    • The Joker retains his twisted sense of humor upon becoming the Big Bad of "Happy Hour". Coming to the realization that a comedian is only a good as his Straight Man, the Joker decided to make every hero more dark like Batman. After having Lance spike the heroes' drinks with nanomachines, he altered their memories so they believed their loved ones were slaughtered before their eyes. Now willing to use lethal force against their enemies, the Joker sent them to capture Spider-Man after his mind proved to be immune to the effects of the nanomachines. He then proceeded to torture Spider-Man until Batman promised to help him. Upon learning that Harley was secretly helping out the Green Goblin, the Joker shot her and tortured the Green Goblin as revenge. He was perfectly willing to use Harley as a human shield and left her to die inside his crumbling base to make a clean getaway. The Joker remained just as cruel under the control of Darkseid, transforming his fellow villains into vicious monsters and fatally wounding Rorschach. Standing out as the most sadistic villain in the series, the Joker tortures and maims others all for the sake of comedy.
    • Darkseid is the ruler of Apokolips and was the only comic-book characters that was unaware he was fictional. Being informed of his true nature by the Joker, Darkseid vaporized him and refused to be reduced to a cosmic punchline. Digging deeper into the comic industry, Darkseid found solace in the sheer nihilism behind the Continuity Reboot and declared it to be the true Anti-Life Equation. He resurrected the Joker and had him sell Apokoliptian weapons that would transform their targets into hideous monsters under his control. He kidnapped Harley Quinn and Rorschach, and left the Joker behind to break the spirits of both the Green Goblin and Deadpool. Arriving at Stan's Place, Darkseid convinced the heroes that their lives were meaningless and subject to the whims of their creators; which gave him enough time to install a device that would reboot every comic universe into a hellscape under his complete control. With a desire to subjugate life across the cosmos, Darkseid refused to be anything less than the most supreme being in the entire multiverse.

erazor0707 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
#131663: Oct 2nd 2018 at 5:47:17 PM

[tup] Bushman.

Scraggle. Did you do that on purpose given our last two candidates?

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#131664: Oct 2nd 2018 at 5:48:23 PM

Well, I saw a pattern and I had him on my to-do, so I figured...

erazor0707 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#131666: Oct 2nd 2018 at 5:53:56 PM

claps the hands in the back to scraggs because why not

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
Looperreallyreallyrocks Since: Jun, 2018
#131667: Oct 2nd 2018 at 6:08:03 PM

Okay, everyone. Me again. So I was wondering if characters from web short films can be accepted. For instance, this one.

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#131668: Oct 2nd 2018 at 6:25:39 PM

Nothing forbidding it (I think we have one or two listed either under Other Media or Web Original) but be very sure there's enough story and characterization to go around. That's the fatal flaw that nips a lot of those kinds of videos in the bud.

Looperreallyreallyrocks Since: Jun, 2018
#131669: Oct 2nd 2018 at 6:27:05 PM

All right then. I'll effortpost it in just a second. Hopefully, there won't be a repeat of what happened yesterday...

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#131670: Oct 2nd 2018 at 6:35:19 PM

Mmmmmm...that's one where I don't think they have enough characterization to keep. Good short, though!

KazuyaProta Shin Megami Tensei IV from A Industrial Farm Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
TommyFresh Since: Aug, 2013
#131672: Oct 2nd 2018 at 6:36:30 PM

[tup] Midnight Man, Matter Man, Bushman.

DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#131673: Oct 2nd 2018 at 6:37:47 PM

[tup] Bushman. Always wondered about Moon Knight rogues, given that he's among the darker Marvel heroes.

Looperreallyreallyrocks Since: Jun, 2018
#131674: Oct 2nd 2018 at 6:44:13 PM

Okay, everyone. Here we are. Another EP from me.

What is the work?

A. Friend is a 2015 horror short film about a woman who discovers the horrifying dark side of social media.

Who is he?

The main antagonist, simply known as "A. Friend," is a sadistic and misogynistic pervert who stalks and kills/kidnaps women.

What does he do?

A. Friend would stalk women and secretly take pictures of them without their consent. Afterwards he would friend them on Facebook, only to ruthlessly scare and torture them by showing them the pictures that he took of them. Afterwards, he would show them that he is getting closer to them before entering their house and murdering/kidnapping them. He has an established pattern and body count, having done this to at least twenty-four women, including the main protagonist, Alice.

Heinous Standard?

A. Friend is the only villain in the video. Sets it.

Motives?

While A. Friend isn't given much of a characterization, his pattern and body count makes it clear that he does what he does because he is a sadistic misogynist. So it's pretty much For the Evulz.

Redeeming Qualities/Freudian Excuse?

No. Just no.

Conclusion

Ultimately, I'm not 100% sure, because he might be lacking some character.

Edited by Looperreallyreallyrocks on Oct 2nd 2018 at 9:44:40 AM

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#131675: Oct 2nd 2018 at 6:49:15 PM

I'm inclined to agree with Lighty, sadly. A four-minute short film dedicated to zip but this creepy serial killer and his victim makes me think it's wanting of sufficient character. Saying "no."

Edited by Scraggle on Oct 2nd 2018 at 7:49:23 AM


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