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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

ReynTime250 Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
#113351: Mar 30th 2018 at 4:46:11 AM

[up] Wait, you said yes to him on Villains Wiki throughout all of the discussion we had.

AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#113352: Mar 30th 2018 at 5:01:22 AM

No, I didn't. I listened to the discussion, but I also watched the gameplay. I'm sorry, I'd have to say no because of the way his Motive Rant is sped up to comedic levels. If he were to be played seriously, I would assume that they would actually give him a normal breakdown speech.

TommyFresh Since: Aug, 2013
#113353: Mar 30th 2018 at 5:27:47 AM

[tup] Prizewell. [tdown] Hyness, the rant seems to make hime a bit too comical imo.

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
MenInGreyToBlak V Since: Oct, 2017 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
V
#113355: Mar 30th 2018 at 5:38:40 AM

Please pay attention to my previous comment, I want real arguments instead of people bandwagoning with all the others. One or two comedic moments can't be enough to disqualify a candidate, when it's played seriously for the rest of the game. Going by that logic, Bill Cipher shouldn't count either.

edited 30th Mar '18 5:39:43 AM by MenInGreyToBlak

ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#113356: Mar 30th 2018 at 5:42:12 AM

[up] [awesome]

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
AustinDR Lizzid people! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
Lizzid people!
#113357: Mar 30th 2018 at 5:55:34 AM

Except with Bill, while I personally don't feel that he counts, his comedic quirks go hand in hand with his villainy. I can't say the same with Hyness.

Don't assume that others are downvoting Hyness because one person downvoted. They may have their own reasons for declining. I'm going to abstain myself.

edited 30th Mar '18 6:36:44 AM by AustinDR

MahStache from Old Jersey, not the bad new one Since: Apr, 2014 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
#113358: Mar 30th 2018 at 6:24:19 AM

The thing is, Hyness' "humor" stems from his insanity, which is also what plays into his atrocious acts. Like Bill Cipher, he's humorous in the way he goes about doing absolutely despicable stuff, in a way you can both laugh at and be disturbed by. Mostly the latter.

edited 30th Mar '18 6:28:52 AM by MahStache

ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#113359: Mar 30th 2018 at 6:44:23 AM

Alright, Offtopic from the Kirby Star Allies discussion.............I just watched the last episode of Death March To The Parallel World Rhapsody. Please PM me for the details if you want to know the work or someone who counts in there or not!

edited 30th Mar '18 6:46:59 AM by ElfenLiedFan90

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
therealjackieboy from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
#113360: Mar 30th 2018 at 7:05:19 AM

Gonna change my vote to a [tdown] for Hyness.

A Kirby game doesn't have a CM anymore. The world has been restored.

It's Spooky Month!
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#113361: Mar 30th 2018 at 7:08:50 AM

Alright I'm going to be busy for a few days. So I'll be taking a break from tgis thread for now. Ill be back though.

Also well I'm here [tdown] to Hyness. That Motive Rant is way to dumb to be an example of not being Played for Laughs

edited 30th Mar '18 7:09:26 AM by miraculous

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
ReynTime250 Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
#113362: Mar 30th 2018 at 7:20:36 AM

The Motive Rant and Motor Mouth is literally him talking about causing the end of the universe, it may be very dark things in a funny way, but that's Black Comedy which we have consistently allowed with Hades from Kid Icarus Uprising, Bill Cipher, Kefka Palazzo and The Dark Knight version of the Joker.

There is no way Hyness is closer to Abridged Frieza or Aku then those lot.

therealjackieboy from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
#113363: Mar 30th 2018 at 7:37:43 AM

So here's Prizewell's entry. As always, any edits or suggestions are welcome.

  • Prizewell City Slicker is an Elite of the Legitimacy Kingdom’s 24th Mechanized Maintenance Battalion, and a raving linguist protectionist. A smug sadist, Prizewell seeks to rid the Legitimacy Kingdom of its foreign languages, as he feels they’re holding his people back, as well as reinstate the Legitimacy Kingdom's abolished slave class. Stealing Object data from the Information Alliance, he attempts to use a battle to slaughter some miners who were planning to defect to the Legitimacy Kingdom, manipulating the fallout to his advantage. Once that fails, he uses the stolen data to create six dummy Objects that lead an attack on Victoria Island, a Legitimacy Kingdom immigrant city, having already destroyed the 37th’s very own Snow Quake and Active Sledge Objects. Once his dummy Objects have been destroyed thanks to an oversight, he tries to kill Quenser, seeing him as the one responsible for their destruction before going after Milinda. While Prizewell claims to be helping his people, in reality, he’s nothing more than a xenophobic hypocrite who doesn’t even care for his own soldiers.

It's Spooky Month!
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#113364: Mar 30th 2018 at 7:48:11 AM

Where will he go on the tree?

Also, 90, is Hildyr's entry still a work-in-progress?

[down] and [down][down]: Cool and cool.

edited 30th Mar '18 7:58:05 AM by ACW

ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#113365: Mar 30th 2018 at 7:50:53 AM

[up] I'll use that entry for now. I haven't see the Lets Play yet but I think the entry should suffice as for now and I'm fine with using that entry for now. When I'm done with seeing the Lets Play. Let me try to update Hildyr's writeup again in the future.

edited 30th Mar '18 7:51:19 AM by ElfenLiedFan90

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
therealjackieboy from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
#113366: Mar 30th 2018 at 7:55:43 AM

[up][up] I want Prizewell to go between Flide and Dimiksy.

It's Spooky Month!
hegelvonaxel Since: Feb, 2018
#113367: Mar 30th 2018 at 9:28:13 AM

I have one question. When is insanity disqualifying and when it isn't?

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#113368: Mar 30th 2018 at 9:30:35 AM

Alright, the entries at RoboCop are all tweaked.

[up] That's somewhat of a case-by-case thing. I THINK the general rule is if the character can still differentiate between right and wrong.

As for Hyness, I'll lean yes, but Hades might not be the best comparison. If I remember, he was EXTREMELY divisive.

edited 30th Mar '18 9:46:09 AM by ACW

hegelvonaxel Since: Feb, 2018
#113369: Mar 30th 2018 at 9:53:26 AM

This is what administrative says

  • Someone who is clinically insane might not be held criminally responsible for their actions, and the same standard applies to this trope. If they would be judged "not guilty by reason of insanity", then they can't be a Complete Monster.

thok That's Dr. Title, thank you! (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Non-Canon
That's Dr. Title, thank you!
#113370: Mar 30th 2018 at 9:58:14 AM

[up] The ability to distinguish between right and wrong is roughly half of the legal definition of insanity (the other half is the ability to appreciate the consequence of their actions).

TheMadCr0w (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Get out of here, STALKER
erazor0707 (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Wishfully thinking
#113372: Mar 30th 2018 at 11:14:28 AM

I'll abstain on Hyness. I'm more confident with Hades and Bill Cypher being keeps because I played their game and watched their show respectively, so I knew when they were dead serious and when they were funny. I don't know a whole lot about Kirby so I can't make that judgment call.

MahStache from Old Jersey, not the bad new one Since: Apr, 2014 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
Tyk5919 Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin Since: Mar, 2011 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin
#113374: Mar 30th 2018 at 11:33:04 AM

[up] I saw that. Abstaining on Hyness regardless.

I write stories and shiz. You can read them here.
emperors Messenger from another dimension. Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: It's complicated
Messenger from another dimension.
#113375: Mar 30th 2018 at 11:50:01 AM

I guess I will tentatively upvote Hyness.

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