During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Edwina
Along with @MasterJoseph, I myself will be proposing various candidates from Heavy Object, mainly from the original light novels.
What Is the Work?
Heavy Object, a light novel series by Kazuma Kamachi, tells the story of soldier Heivia and explosives expert/commoner Quenser as they travel the world to destroy Objects: giant, circular battle mechs that come in many different flavors, all while trying to survive a world in constant battle, this journey isn't an easy one for the two.
We’re looking specifically at Volume 6, which involves the two idiots (the book’s words, not mine) going on an adventure that involves space lasers, lithium being used as a currency, and bikini clad scientists. While there’s no clear villain at first, one appears later on in the form of…
Who Is he?
Dimiksy Nikolaschka, a prince of the royal Nikolaschka family of the Volga District of the Legitimacy Kingdom, desires the throne, doing whatever he can to become ruler. He only appears in the third part of Volume 6.
What has he done?
Having been born to a surrogate mother (his dad cheated on his wife, the queen), he technically isn’t really a member of the Nikolaschka family. Since the Legitimacy Kingdom values bloodline more than anything, Dimiksy tries to keep his lack of royal blood a secret, using false information planted in the Lineage Department and having anyone attempting to investigate his origins killed.
Every 30 years after the queen’s enthronement, a new heir to the throne is chosen. Wanting to rule the throne despite being the oldest and most likely to be picked, he kills his political rivals, aka his own family, in order to easily win. Dimiksy’s last target is his 14-year-old sister, Princess Staivia, who he plans on assassinating. His big plan (about 5 years in the making) is to kill Staivia during the Royal Duel, which will involve the two duking out with their Objects.
In the past, he used his faction to cause a terrorist bombing in order to acquire the Object, Assault Signal (more on that later), which killed many people, including Excelsyla, the Object’s elite pilot, earning him the wrath of scientist Claire Whist. He later attempted to murder the White Bears, Staivia’s guards, in a bombing by having his soldiers disguised as Information Alliance troops; having known this would happen, the White Bears faked their own deaths and rebuilt themselves as Unicorn, a violent, but well-meaning troop that is secretly trying to take Dimiksy down and protect Staivia.
One day, when Staivia tries to leave town due to fear of being assassinated, Dimiksy sends his terrorist troops to blow up buildings in order to alter Staivia’s escape routes. His actions lead Staivia and her maid, Mikfa, to Lexpop, where the two are ambushed by Dimiksy’s faction. Mikfa is imprisoned and used as a hostage to force Staivia into the Assault Signal (a first generation Object, which required someone to pilot it from the inside, and not only is it very uncomfortable, it can’t even counterattack, otherwise Staivia would be crushed), making her watch a livestream of her maid being beaten and tortured until the Royal Duel starts. The Object itself is placed under the float containing Mikfa. Dimiksy's ultimate plan is to kill his sister with his own special Object during the Royal Duel.
At this point, Unicorn have revealed themselves to be the good guys, attempting to stop Dimiksy at the Flightburg Air Force Base, helping Quenser and Heivia. When the Assault Signal is activated and on its way to the stadium to fight, Dimiksy arises out of the water piloting his own Object, the Broad Sly Saber. When Heivia contacts HQ to send their own Object, the Forest Roller, to help them as one final trump card, Dimiksy uses his Object to fire a laser from space that destroys the Forest Roller. He then fires his second laser onto the Air Force Base, almost killing the Unicorn agents; he did this so that his Object’s weakness wouldn’t be discovered. The reason why he doesn’t just kill Staivia when she’s right there is due to not only the rules of the Royal Duel, but also because he wants to savor her fear for when he does kill her.
He tries to fire his third laser onto the float that Heivia, Quenser, and Mikfa are on (which is right next to him). Through some science mumbo jumbo, Quenser ends up making the laser miss the float and almost hit Dimiksy. At this point, Claire shows up and uses the Assault Signal’s remote-control function to fire a laser cannon point blank at the Sky Saber, destroying the Object, and killing Dimiksy, with both sinking into the water (which the book equates to being sent to Hell).
Redeeming Qualities?
Nada.
Heinousness?
He’s not as ambitious in scale as Flide, but he has a higher kill count than the unnamed Officer. While Heivia sees Dimiksy’s assassination attempts as normal, Quenser sees it as wrong, and the book mainly agrees with the latter. Dimiksy’s pretty much this book’s equivalent to Richard III, with the book even stating that he “was as horrible a person as the rumors said”.
Conclusion
I think he counts. Interestingly enough, he never says a single line of dialogue throughout the chapter.
edited 20th Mar '18 8:34:26 AM by therealjackieboy
It's Spooky Month!
Dimiksy
Could somone answer my question :
https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=6vic3f9h1cy5qivsenw8llok&page=4490#112237
edited 20th Mar '18 8:36:26 AM by miraculous
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."Huh, is Marcus the first CM for Nolan North?
I'll file those cuts tomorrow, along with the new Wallander tree:
- Wallander:
- Lassgard Series:
- Alfred Hardeberg, the actual killer from The Man who Smiled, at first comes across as a friendly, philanthropic businessman who helps Wallander find the killer who murdered Sten Torstensson and his father. He hires two assassins who kill Sten and his father after a business deal that didn't go as he wanted, as well as blowing up different places in the process. He is able to hide his true colors for a big part of the story, but once he is revealed as the killer, some even deeper secrets are revealed. His latest project, with his daughter Kristina, is TLL, a way poor people can donate their organs to wealthy people. In order to test the project, he, along with his daughter, kill numerous children.
- The aforementioned Kristina Hardeberg from the same work is as much a sociopath as the above. This person, who seemed somewhat strange even from the beginning, is the primary lead of TLL, and is technically more involved in child murdering, and is also equally as involved in hiring assassins. This person is shown killing a random man from her and Alfred's house for fun, before asking to kill Wallander as well. While younger than other villains, Kristina still stands out as a child murdering sociopath.
- Heinrich Böhle, from "The Pyramid", is a criminal mastermind who is seeking to destroy drug dealer Yngve Holm's entire life after a drug deal gone wrong. Introduced during a flashback scene during Wallander's early police career, a gunshot can be heard inside an old man's house while Wallander is having a fun time with one of his best friends outside. Wallander hears this, and sees Böhle, who manages to escape the scene, killing Wallander's friend in the process. Twenty-five years later, Böhle meets Wallander again, but is even more sadistic and evil this time around. He is this time around introduced shooting an helicopter with two people in it for fun. After one of Yngve Holm's drug dealers accidentally causes an overdose, Böhle, scared that he might get caught by the police, targets Holm's family and friends. He starts out by kidnapping Yngve's sister, and taping her around a chair, he puts a heart rate monitor on her, so that if she tries escaping her heart rate will go up, and a bomb will explode, blowing up the entire house. Her sister comes and tries saving her, but the house blows up, killing them both. Böhle then meets with Yngve's right-hand Frank, and kills him as well. To complete his killing spree, he kidnaps Yngve's daughter who he puts a bomb on. He puts a heart rate monitor on himself this time so that if his heart rate goes below 50 or over 90, the bomb will explode. Despite murder being a very common aspect in the Wallander series, and something to expect coming into the episodes, Böhle truly stands out in being a personal enemy to Wallander and the final villain in the Lassgard series.
- Henriksson Series:
- Originally just another simple drug dealer, Hosse, from "The Container Lorry", becomes something much, much worse and manages to stand out in the end. Hired to deal drugs by smuggling them in a truck filled with immigrants, the plan was to drive the truck and keep the immigrants alive in order to distract the police, something Hosse ignores, so he kills all nine of them anyway. However, at the climax of the episode, Hosse makes his already-high body count even higher. While driving in the customs station with the truck, using the same way as he previously dealt them, Karin, who is now a spy for the police who poses as an associate for Hosse and his leader Oskar, is seen by Hosse. Hosse notices that she's with the police, so when she walks by his truck, he viciously grabs her and pulls her into his truck. He demands her to be silent and hide so that the police doesn't see her, or else he'll kill her. Once he's done with the customs station, Karin asks what he'll do with the immigrants. Hosse just answers that he'll kill all of them, gloating about it. Once the police realize that Hosse is holding Karin hostage, they confront him and start shooting. Hosse is behind the truck, but instead of accepting defeat, Hosse stops hiding and grabs Karin. He puts her at gunpoint, and kills her just before he dies himself.
- Rolf Liljeberg, from "The Secret", at first seems like a really nice guy who is enjoying his retirement after a long career as a police officer. He helps the protagonists find the man who killed a boy named Johannes, the suspect being one of Rolf's friends Magnus. He manages to keep a really good façade, but his true colors are shown when Stefan remembers how he was heavily abused by Rolf as a child, and a flashback scene is shown where Stefan is running away from Rolf and gets his scar. Stefan goes home to Rolf, and constantly points his gun against Rolf and is willing to shoot him. Rolf laughs and wants Stefan to kill him, since he'll never get away with it. He also states that no one else has successfully tried getting away with similar things previously either. A picture can be seen of a young Stefan naked in Rolf's house. All of this is too much for Stefan to handle, so he commits suicide. It is also now revealed that Rolf is behind the murder of Johannes as well. In his last scene, he kills one of his friends for revealing to much information to the police and tries killing her child as well, but fails. Even in a series like Wallander, where all of the main antagonists have murdered at the very least one person, Rolf stands out in the series as the most sadistic and violent pedophile, with most of the others being redeemable in one way or another.
- Leonard Belker, from "The Leak", is a well-known mass murdering terrorist. The episode starts with one of Belker's henchmen shooting an innocent, random old man who was jogging, for fun. The next day, Belker launches a massive terrorist attack, injuring, if not killing, many people. Belker himself is shown a bit later in the movie after trainee Pontus got caught by Belker's henchmen. They trap Pontus in his own car, and Belker finally shows up. He sets the car on fire and leaves Pontus to slowly die, just barely failing to kill him. The next time Belker is shown on screen, he launches another massive terrorist attack in the city, injuring many people, while Belker smugly smiles while innocent people die and the police slowly eliminate every single one of his minions. The leaker, Sven, is shown to have been heavily blackmailed by Belker, and once he is supposed to have his money for his work as the leak, Belker only gives him half the money, and threatens to kill his wife Mette by putting a photo of the two in the bag where the money is in, and then aims with a laser gun on the photo from behind. Belker doesn't lie, and betrays Sven at the climax of the episode, where he shoots Mette through her spine, before getting away scot-free.
- Lassgard Series:
edited 20th Mar '18 8:47:43 AM by ACW
@miraculous I don't know about the Sentai Universe but if you felt that he's heinous enough, go ahead and EP him. Maybe you could ask Lighty too since he is also knowledgeable with the Sentai series.
and a yea on the prince
"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."![]()
I uh haven't actually watched that season. Polar whose familiar with it said he was cut because of some uh comedic stuff that happened in his cameo in Gokaiger which was way after his show finished. So just some curious about finding out why ?
BTW is lighty going to rewrite Abrella as The current write-up is pretty bad
edited 20th Mar '18 8:58:41 AM by miraculous
"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."Has a discussion for Eli Damaskinos from Blade 2 been made on whether he qualifies?
Hey again,things are doing alright now. So yes to the upvoted characters from before. No to Oakwidow, no to Ifrit, no to the storm prince etc. Yes to Marcus, Yes to the fly, yes to Flide, yes to the Alaskan base commander. Cut Towa, cut the twins, cut le tenia etc.
So I have seen the series and it is good so yes to Gilbert but Minatsuki I sort of have trouble thinking as to how much of a choice he had or at the very least he genuinely thought he had. I can elaborate if anybody wants to hear it. I thought it over for ten minutes after he died and I am still unsure.
EDIT: Yes to Dimiksy btw.
And nobody in metal gear survive counts, there are only two villains, one is made evil by a virus, the other was a machine made evil by a virus, agency is a problem and even then the most either villain does is wipe out a camp and take a child hostage. The lord of dust(the main villain and the evil machine) might be a danger to the world if it managed to go to snake's reality but it is still a machine made evil because of a virus.
edited 20th Mar '18 9:33:17 AM by Knack
From dance in vampire bund.
- The Lords of the Three Clans: Rozenmann, Ivanovic, and Li are all nasty customers, with Ivanovic being the most overtly brutal of the lot. In the past, the three destroyed and usurped all the other great vampire clans before murdering their sovereign, Queen Lucretia, and only sparing Lucretia's young daughter Min as a future tool for breeding for one of them. While Li hasn't been seen as much, he, Ivanovic and Rozenmann participate in a contest to determine who has possession of Mina: by sending their best assassins after her love interest Akira with the winner taking the prize, and subjecting Mina to a degrading chastity test so she knows she is the property of the three.
Li have a redeeming quality, can this be cut.
The problem I have is that in the flashbacks and even in the context of all of Minatsuki's crimes, he was doing them based on what Gilbert told him as a child and on Gilbert's instructions,that aside as a child Minatsuki was very lonely(he had no friends) and nobody interacted with him at all so the second he sees this strange man(Gilbert) giving him answers as to who he is and why his eye is how it is of course he would do what he says considering he had next to no interaction with anybody else before meeting him so he had no reason to distrust him, and considering Gilbert molded Minatsuki's personality, motives and even his crimes around the idea that it was destined to happen anyways and he would be destined for greatness no matter what, even though I thought of his crimes as heinous he genuinely seemed to think that he cannot change. When Yuna pleaded with him to stop what he was doing he basically said to her that there was no way he could. Minatsuki is the definition of a fatalist, he thinks that no matter what happens he will have to be the way he is anyways.
Two comparisons, Ego from guardians of the galaxy thought his "purpose" was to make everything him but he himself gave himself that so called purpose.
Another anime by the company that did B: The Beginning that I have seen(you might have heard of it) Psycho pass, Rikako Oryo and Toyohisa Senguji are similar in that they were corrupted by Makishima, the difference is is that they count because they were evil enough from the start, Minatsuki NEVER would have ended up how he did if he never met Gilbert, the last problem is that when he does meet Gilbert he is in a corridor full of Gilbert's soldiers, I do not think he could have said no to Gilbert at all, even his brainwashing of the fake Minatsuki he was ordered to by Gilbert and his soldiers were in the same room, considering he wanted to have SOME idea as to who he even is and the only way to do that is to listen to this psychopath who spends at least the next decade molding his personality? Keith himself sums it up perfectly when talking to Gilbert, "The real monster is not even Minatsuki, it is YOU Gilbert".
All that said I do not mind voting him up because he is heinous enough and has nothing mitigating otherwise but considering how much of who he is is because of Gilbert, I am honestly unsure. This isn't even like Bellatrix following Voldemort or anything like two villains having similar beliefs, he is shown by Gilbert the stone that fortells everything that will happen no matter what and Minatsuki has no reason to not believe everything he says because what happens that is inscribed on the stone happens word for word and his personality is molded by Gilbert putting all these ideas in his mind.
edited 20th Mar '18 9:56:12 AM by Knack

So that's, what, 4 cuts now? Splinter Cell dude, Le Tenia, Cold Case guy, Fox?