During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
So, I have been looking into the SporeWiki Fiction Universe lately, and I am going to be honest.
I am not sure if anyone can count.
The heinous standard is just, really, really high. Like, at one point, 95% of the universe gets wiped out. That high. And the guys who did it don’t count for agency issues.
I am still looking and will get back to you all about this, but man, this is an absurd heinous standard.
Please allow me to introduce myself, I am a man of wealth and taste. Nice to meet you, hope you can guess my name.![]()
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Holy shit. Stay safe, Lighty, and take all the time you need.
Serengheti and Beckett.
edited 14th Feb '18 1:40:04 PM by JoeBlitz
"Now I have a machine gun. Ho ho ho."
Serengheti and Ray, stay safe Lighty, now my writeups:
- 2Dark: Dr. Sergei Krach is a former professor of criminal behavior and the one behind all the chaos in Gloomywood. After mutilating and killing three of his students, Krach follows the lead detective on the case, Mr. Smith, during a camping trip, decapitating his wife and kidnapping his two children, Sandra and Martin. Now wheelchair-bound, Krach heads an orphanage where he abuses the children he kidnapped for years until they develop sociopathic tendencies. Years later, Krach releases six of his disciples in Gloomywood to wreak havoc and kidnap even more children, keeping Sandra and Martin with him to serve as his Co-Dragons. With the return of Mr. Smith, Krach has his cat nailed to a wall and kidnaps the daughter of his only friend. In the orphanage, Krach forces his subordinates to see him as their god and keeps the children locked behind bars so he can make a new set of killers to cause even more death in the future. If Mr. Smith kills Sandra and Martin, Krach wastes no time in rubbing it in his face before being defeated. A self-proclaimed evil genius who sees others as "weak creatures in chains", Krach was the absolute worst criminal Mr. Smith had to face.
- Shadow Man: Legion is a an ancient entity who rules the Deadside with an iron fist. Originally being banished from the Deadside by superior forces, Legion poses as voodoo gods and makes up a false prophecy surrounding the end of the world, so he could manipulate those in the Liveside. Wanting to spread his influence to the other side of the veil, Legion assumes the form of an elegant middle-aged man, and visits Jack the Ripper, recruiting him and four other serial killers, giving them a chance to keep committing murders if they help him invade the Liveside. In the Deadside, Legion builds a vast "Cathedral of Pain", where he experiments on the already-suffering Deadsiders, mutilating them to create a massive army of grotesque monsters. Legion toys with Michael Le Roi by taking the form of his deceased little brother, Luke, and reveals himself by telling a joke about murder, mocking him for not letting his brother rest in peace. A sadistic demon hiding behind a façade of aristocracy, Legion proved to be one of the Shadow Man's most personal enemies.
edited 14th Feb '18 1:54:53 PM by TheMadCr0w
Oh, yikes... please stay safe, Lighty.
Anyways... I'm going to get the rest of my Valiant writeups down and dealt with now. On rereads, I think Ax should probably just be listed generally above all the others. Here we are:
- Archer and Armstrong: Joe Earl and Thelma Archer, the vile parents of Obadiah Archer, are evangelical preachers during Obadiah's childhood who use their positions to gain the trust of troubled young children under the pretense of religion. Once gaining their trust, the Archers kidnap the children and subject them to rape and torture for hours on end, filming their deeds and keeping a dispassionate, hobbyist mentality about it the whole while. When Obadiah finds them in the middle of one of their sessions, the Archers unhesitatingly brain their own son while burning down their house in an attempt to kill him, with full intent to kill him later in the hospital after he survives.
- Ax is a genius hacker and obnoxious young slimeball who's cruelty and ambition proves to be far more than his arrogant demeanor would suggest. Initially recruited into the Harbingers and given the power of technopathy, Ax doesn't hesitate to betray his companions to the villainous Rexo and the spider aliens once they're kidnapped, allying with them for potential to turn Faith into his sex slave and gleefully imploring the spider aliens to eat all of his former allies alive once his testicles are seared off. Once he and Rexo are stopped, Ax gains retribution by trying to torture Torque to death and attempting to sodomize Kris, the girlfriend of Peter Stanchek, with his hammer. Becoming a low-level supervillain afterwards who repeatedly attempts to steal the technologies of Bloodshot's nanites and XO-Manowar's armor for his own ends, Ax murders many people ending with Bloodshot by the time of 2028. In the 41st century, Ax, now an artificial intelligence after having uploaded his mind into the nanites, takes over the body of the current Rai while torturing his friend, attempting to spread his influence all over the Earth to utterly dominate the planet. A smug, disgusting kid with an ego vastly disproportionate to his capabilities, Ax roundly proves himself one of the most twisted recurring villains of the Valiant universe.
- Doctor Eclipse, real name Fred Bender, used to be a cocky investigator who is initially given a taste of power by Solar when he found out that Solar's alter-ego, Phil Seleski, is a reality-warping hero. Using his powers to murder innocent people for pleasure, Bender turns to the service of Master Darque after being stripped of his power and becomes known as Doctor Eclipse. Now a wisecracking, sadistic phantom made of death energy, Eclipse ravages the world while murdering entire towns of people to feed on their death energy, in one case dazzling a bar full of people with his powers before destroying it and everyone inside. Repeatedly returning to hurt Solar and everyone close to him and even trying to betray Darque himself in anger with his new inability to feel anything as a consequence of his new form, Eclipse in other instances kills and feeds on dozens of people in an attempt to reconstitute himself after one of his first defeat, returns to his old town in Ohio to conquer and torment it for his own amusement while pettily killing his old elementary teacher, and, in the culmination of his evil, willingly participated in the attempted destruction of both the Valiant and Image universes during the Deathmate crossover with Darque, sadistically mutilating Supreme to stop his attempts to stop Darque.
- Mothergod, once known as Erica Pierce, is the instigator of Unity and one of the single greatest threats to ever threaten the Valiant universe. Once a mentally-troubled young woman who gained the powers of Solar upon the destruction and recreation of the universe, Erica used her powers to live for centuries, killing her own alternate self and kidnapping her son Albert, sexually abusing her own son to gratify herself and twisting Albert into a monster. Coming into the Lost Land with the new moniker of Mothergod, Mothergod takes over the Lost Land as a cruel tyrant while establishing mass slavery to build a gigantic city to base her operations in, having thousands of people and sentient dinosaurs tortuously converted into cyborgs to wipe out anyone she deems a threat while keeping her "bionosaurs" sated with countless dozens of tribal slaves to feast on. In Unity, Mothergod reveals her intentions to obliterate the whole of time, space and reality to recreate it all to her own design and rule over it as a god. In her conflict with reality's heroes, Mothergod sinks the floating island of Japan and kills millions to spite Rai, has Aric's entire nation massacred while leaving him among a sea of corpses after a failed attempt to steal his armor, uses waves of her own armies as cannon fodder for months on end to stall the heroes' efforts, and finally tries to bring about the destruction of all of existence — with neither her own son or the Lost Land spared — in her final battle with Solar. Even with the excuse of a horrid abusive father in her past, Mothergod is afforded no sympathy and her ultimate fate is one pointed out as one she has condemned herself to, with even her pretense of bringing about an orderly reality simply a pretense to slake her psychopathic narcissism. A destroyer of millions who's actions transcend any potential sympathy that could be netted by her, Mothergod remains one of the most evil, mass-affecting villains to ever grace the Valiant universe.
edited 14th Feb '18 2:03:05 PM by Scraggle
BTW, Scraggle, I've added your writeups to Valiant Comics. Does the order and such look okay (feel free to move it around if you wish)? For Eclipse, I made it " initially given a taste of power by Doctor Solar..."
Excellent. I've started with the potholes (so far, I've only done the first Bloodshot one and started the second).
edited 14th Feb '18 2:06:29 PM by ACW
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Torquemada’s idea of peace is very skewed as in everyone is under his thumb and tyranny. Trying to justify Torquemada is like trying to justify the likes of Judge Claude Frollo, in that he says to himself that he has a just cause while his action really prove that all he cares about is himself.
BTW please stay safe Lightysnake
My sandbox of EPs and other stuff

Yeah for Ray