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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

Knack2baby Since: Feb, 2018
#108776: Feb 12th 2018 at 1:36:32 PM

I do not mind if she stays, but I am unsure.

MahStache from Old Jersey, not the bad new one Since: Apr, 2014 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
#108777: Feb 12th 2018 at 1:38:41 PM

When I brought up Piella again it seemed to overshadow Preston. Anyone have any more thoughts on him too?

Knack2baby Since: Feb, 2018
#108778: Feb 12th 2018 at 1:41:03 PM

Oh, the dog from a close shave? He is too comedic. I never thought of him as that evil.

edited 12th Feb '18 1:41:32 PM by Knack2baby

Vampireandthen In love with an Uptown Girl from Northern Ireland Since: Apr, 2016 Relationship Status: A teenager in love
In love with an Uptown Girl
#108779: Feb 12th 2018 at 1:41:22 PM

Nay to Preston. Agency issues.

Please allow me to introduce myself, I am a man of wealth and taste. Nice to meet you, hope you can guess my name.
FriedWarthog Since: Jun, 2014 Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
#108780: Feb 12th 2018 at 1:43:45 PM

I didn't think Piella counted then, and I don't think she counts now. So yeah, cut her.

And yes to the Purple Man, of course.

Vampireandthen In love with an Uptown Girl from Northern Ireland Since: Apr, 2016 Relationship Status: A teenager in love
In love with an Uptown Girl
#108781: Feb 12th 2018 at 1:47:54 PM

My final statement for this is that I will always say yay to Piella, and will see what everyone else says.

Though, I am thankful there is a certain someone who hasn’t shown up in a while.

Please allow me to introduce myself, I am a man of wealth and taste. Nice to meet you, hope you can guess my name.
Knack2baby Since: Feb, 2018
#108782: Feb 12th 2018 at 1:49:28 PM

So, anybody from Rick Riordan's books count? I am unsure but I thought Kronos and Apep did? And may as well cut Piella considering not many want to keep her.

edited 12th Feb '18 1:50:13 PM by Knack2baby

Scraggle Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: THIS CONCEPT OF 'WUV' CONFUSES AND INFURIATES US!
#108783: Feb 12th 2018 at 1:57:10 PM

Knack, there's an nice thing called the search function that can answer a lot of these questions. And otherwise, if you think a villain from the books counts? We're receptive to an effortpost. I do realize you're still fairly new here, but please understand bogging down the thread with constant questions unrelated to the topic at hand isn't a productive use of our time.

The votes to cut Piella are far against the ones to keep. Further opinions? If nothing for changes, I'll file a report to cut her at midnight tonight.

Knack2baby Since: Feb, 2018
#108784: Feb 12th 2018 at 1:58:02 PM

Sorry Scraggle. It's just that I could not find anybody in the search function related to it. I have been following the thread for awhile so I am not new but am unfamiliar if something was discussed because the search function doesn't always give the desired results.

edited 12th Feb '18 1:59:49 PM by Knack2baby

Knack2baby Since: Feb, 2018
Vampireandthen In love with an Uptown Girl from Northern Ireland Since: Apr, 2016 Relationship Status: A teenager in love
In love with an Uptown Girl
#108786: Feb 12th 2018 at 2:13:33 PM

Knack, don’t double post please.

Please allow me to introduce myself, I am a man of wealth and taste. Nice to meet you, hope you can guess my name.
Knack2baby Since: Feb, 2018
#108787: Feb 12th 2018 at 2:14:50 PM

[up]Alright man. Sorry. I will remember that. Is it alright if I ask one more question? If in a setting there is light and darkness but entities of light and darkness are capable of agency could they count? I ask because the thousand years of war audiobook for warcraft seriously implies that light and void entities can make choices.

edited 12th Feb '18 2:30:06 PM by Knack2baby

TommyFresh Since: Aug, 2013
#108788: Feb 12th 2018 at 2:25:43 PM

[tup] Mothergod, Chameleon, and Kilgrave. And I will also agree that Piella should be cut.

43110 (Striking Back) Relationship Status: Reincarnated romance
#108789: Feb 12th 2018 at 2:32:02 PM

[up][up] Knack, sorry but I really don’t understand why these questions have to be asked? Asking if something with agency can count is like asking if the most heinous character can count—it’s a clear yes, which a glance at the administriva page would have told you.

edited 12th Feb '18 3:03:47 PM by 43110

bobg Since: Nov, 2012
G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
The 47th President
#108791: Feb 12th 2018 at 3:17:24 PM

[tup] to Killgrave, Mothergod, and Chameleon

Yeah after some major thinking I'm going to have to vote [tdown] Pelia.

Say Ravok isn't Cletus Kasady/ Carnage in Spider Man: Unlimited too? Does he do anything in particular to stand out?

edited 12th Feb '18 3:22:31 PM by G-Editor

My sandbox of EPs and other stuff
HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#108792: Feb 12th 2018 at 3:18:08 PM

[tdown] Piella. Sounds like another one for the Grandfather/Maltravers/Dr. Benedict "would count if the setting wasn't so goofy" pile.

ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#108793: Feb 12th 2018 at 3:20:11 PM

[up][up] I asked him about that, and he said that besides Venom being as bad, with Carnage, it's more like the symbiote in control and Cletus being more of a puppet.

ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#108794: Feb 12th 2018 at 3:43:31 PM

[tup] to Kilgrave and Chameleon

And sorry to say this but I also going to vote [tdown] to Piella given my discussion with Mah Stace on P Ms

@Scraggle Nice pfp.....Who is that though? It looks like someone from Fist Of The North Star [lol]

edited 12th Feb '18 3:43:51 PM by ElfenLiedFan90

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
Tyk5919 Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin Since: Mar, 2011 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Your friendly neighborhood stank goblin
#108795: Feb 12th 2018 at 3:43:43 PM

Hey everyone. Been busy doing things and shiz and shiz and things, typing stories, reading stories, and so on. Kinda just been lurking these past several days; not sure I'll be here much unless I'm posting an effortpost.

I'll [tup] Killgrave though, and I guess cut Piella.

I write stories and shiz. You can read them here.
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#108796: Feb 12th 2018 at 3:46:31 PM

[up][up] Probably someone from Valiant; not sure who though.

SatoshiBakura (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#108797: Feb 12th 2018 at 4:17:45 PM

Hey guys, I recently finished Death Note. Out of curiosity, I decided to use the search to see how the Complete Monster discussions went down. While I was not surprised by the cuts that were made (even Higuchi, who as creepy and despicable as he was, didn't seem to actually do enough). However, I find it hilarious that despite all the mentions of Mikami and how bad he was, no one actually seemed discussed him properly.

Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#108798: Feb 12th 2018 at 4:20:09 PM

Personally, I don't think there's much to discuss with Mikami.

Knack2baby Since: Feb, 2018
#108799: Feb 12th 2018 at 4:21:36 PM

So I am going to be gone for awhile it looks like. My grandfather is not doing well and I will not have time to be here.

TheMadCr0w (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Get out of here, STALKER
#108800: Feb 12th 2018 at 5:31:00 PM

Where the Dead Go to Die is a bad, bad animated film, but as i said before, horrible flicks are my passion, so here we go.

What is the setting? Where The Dead Go To Die is an anthology of three short stories: Tainted Milk, Liquid Memories and The Masks That The Monsters Wear. We'll be focusing on what could be considered this movie's Big Bad, Labby.

Who is Labby? Labby is a demonic being taking the form of a black, red-eyed labrador who acts as a "Messenger of God", the one who loves to see humans committing atrocities. In Tainted Milk, Labby follows a boy named Tommy , and had told him to kill his grandfather's sheep because "the devil was inside them", which caused his suicide. Discovering that Tommy's mother is pregnant, Labby tries tricking Tommy into believing that his unborn brother is the Antichrist. At his home, Labby attacks Tommy's parents while they are sleeping, ripping the fetus out of his mother and castrating his father, then mocks Tommy by casually telling him to scratch himself with his unborn brother's underdeveloped fingernails to make it look like he attacked him first. Later, Tommy wishes that his parents were still alive, and Labby returns, saying how God would grant his wish if he sacrificed his virginity to Labby... he sacrifices it. In Liquid Memories, now we follow the story of a depressed Serial Killer who can steal memories from his victims. When he sees the memories of a prostitute he had killed, he soon runs into Labby, who forces him to watch horrific imagery, telling him that he is trapped inside "the mashed up memories of a whore", and basically explains to him that all prostitutes are prostitutes so that they can make God weep and "know what it is like to be raped".

After a few moments of Mind Screw (which is quite common in this film), Labby appears again, this time instructing a boy, Johnny, to stab his sister to "make her feel broken inside". During the final moments of this story, we get the implication that this man is an adult Tommy who deleted the memory of Labby from his mind, and the torment he puts him through drives him to suicide. In the final story, Labby focuses his attention on Ralph, a boy living with his unborn brother's face on the side of his head, this boy is friends with a sweet girl named Sophia, who suffers massive abuse at hands of her father. Labby walks with Ralph through the woods and then tricks him into falling down a well filled with eyeballs, which is apparently some kind of gate to hell, with Labby saying "You need to watch your step, dear Ralphie, you never know where you can end up, you don't wanna go down there, i know what it is like, i've been down there". Ralph is of course transported to hell, and there Labby explains that Sophia only knows the "bad touch", something which will apparently turn her into a prostitute later in life, and can be fixed with Ralph's "magic touch".

Ralph suffers a brutal Mind Rape and Labby shows him what Sophia has to go through at her home. Labby explains what happens when someone loses their soul: "The animals start to reject you. You see, you speak the language of men, but we speak the language of God". Back to reality, Ralph goes to Sophia's house and her pedophilic father forces her to participate in sexual acts with Ralph, and Labby assists him by ordering Ralph to use his "magic touch". After this, Labby convinces Ralph to kill his father (another pedo) and grab a revolver and shoot his own mother while Labby watches from the window. Ralph is obviously shocked with all this, saying "Sometimes i think there is a monster inside of me.", and Labby responds with "That's because there is, but if you make your inside as unpleasant as possible, then the monster will leave". In his final appearance, Labby corces Ralph into removing his unborn brother's face from his head with a broken bottle, telling him to use the blood to "slip and slide".

Heinous? This thing is the reason why this movie is so controversial to begin with. Oh, and Labby also convinces Tommy to indulge in necrophilia with his mother, but for some reason i couldn't find that when i watched it, and i don't want to watch it again.

Excuses? "You can't blame the messenger". Yeah, sure.

Conclusion? What you say?

edited 12th Feb '18 5:32:35 PM by TheMadCr0w


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