Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

Yeah thats why I don't usually reserve discussions. I don't have to worry about on when I have to discuss candidates. I can just bring candidates at my leisure from works that the forum hasn't discussed yet or any that the they might have missed.

edited 29th Jan '18 2:09:46 AM by G-Editor

I'll say yes to the Mage.

Alright I finished watching some playthrough regarding Aria's Story. PM me for the details

Mage.

@acw : Oh by the way Wat Tambor will go bellow Nuvo Vindi in the Star Wars The Clone Wars tree as that's the order of appearence in the show.

edited 29th Jan '18 3:10:30 AM by miraculous

I've been thinking that maybe we can remove Matt Engarde from Ace Attorney. I've played the game and while it's true Engarde is a sick bastard and definitely cruel to the point I might consider him, he doesn't really measure up to the other villains. Compared to Garan and Redd White who use their power to destroy numerous lives through murder and suicide, or even personal and less resourceful villains like Dahlia and Kristoph, Matt's crime pales in comparison. He just hired an assassin to kill his rival, had the assassin kidnap someone to defend him, and drove someone to suicide by heartbreak which by the way wasn't his main intention at first. Horrible, but compared to a serial killer who seduces men to do what she wants then getting them killed, or a lawyer doing numerous crimes out of his pride, Matt doesn't stand out. His cruelty isn't as bad as the acts of Dahlia or even Blaise Debeste who doesn't even count. He gets and mocked, but it's all petty and not really as cruel as Blaise and even Manfred's insults.

Mage by the way

edited 29th Jan '18 3:34:39 AM by TheImmortalAngelNewton

I'm.......Not sure if we will cut Matt given that he doesn't have any Freudian Excuse and all to counter his heinous actions like how callously he treats other people, especially his former manager and ruining her new relationship and his reaction to her suicide is what sealed it to other people. But yea.....Matt is on a pretty low tier compared to other villains like Redd White or Dahlia.

Mage.

So this is another example of me ripping a band aid off. I have been contemplating and procrastinating this candidate due to the complicated nature of the character in question (less so due to this version of the character) but I finally got around to it...Windigo is an online found-footage comedic horror movie, with two versions on You Tube to watch for free with the Recut Version doing a slightly better job at explaining things (that's the version I recommend) that blends in the legend of the wendigo with that of Slenderman.

Yes, Slenderman, a character who usually is so shrouded in mystery and interpretation it's pretty impossible to talk about him, especially when one is mixed in with something like the wendigo, however there's a good reason why I considered this version in the first place - they imply moral agency with this character and even have him talk (in the recut version his dialogue is actually coherent).

Windigo focuses on a small group of college students looking to make a documentary on deforestation for a student project. This includes our camera man Brandon, director Reece, his girlfriend Cassie, among other characters. They go to shoot their documentary in a heavily forested rural area in a small backwoods town in Ontario Canada (Ah fuck...) where they meet Brandon's redneck uncle Steve. Their first night during a campfire, one of their crew, Kwekon tells the story of the Wendigo, of how it drives people into madness, cannibalism and describing it as a monster with long limbs. Kwekon describes a supposed childhood encounter with one that mauled him and killed his parents (although the recut version implies he was joking at that part) with Steven, the "wendigo" is a very real thing insisting that he's seen it himself.

The first half of the movie has next to nothing of value happening besides establishing characters and setting up some of the mood (I mean there's several minutes of a guy with an Angela Landsbury hardon being interviewed that the film could have down without. But at the forty minute mark, one of the actresses, Selina is lured out of her tent with the crew trying to stop her as she goes into the woods by Slenderman finally revealing himself. The second half of the movie focuses on the search for Selina, with Slenderman doing more or less his usual deal as the crew begins to notice a change in behaviour in the locals with several of them entering and exiting the forest and one group being pretty much zombified. It's later revealed that Brandon is slowly but surely becoming possessed by the Slenderman after and with him and his zombies in the woods. Brandon wakes up the next morning on a beach with no memory, but surrounded by small skeletons and vomits out blood.

As it turns out, Steven has been serious about knowing about the "wendigo" and is seeking to cover it up by destroying as much evidence of it as possible ala Alex from Marble Hornets. Brandon finds Steven has killed Selina for learning to much of Slenderman and intends to kill Brandon too. Brandon is rescued/kidnaped by a eccentric local name Alian, who is a paranoid man who attempts to torture Brandon before being lured into the bathroom and killed by the Slenderman.

Later, Brandon's friends catch up to Alian's house, all up to speed with what's happening and armed with guns. Slenderman shows up and tricks them into killing one of their actors, Dean before a swarm of zombies show up and a fight ensues. With the zombies being wiped out, Slenderman quickly enters the fray until Kwekon drives a truck into him causing an explosion that seemingly burns and destroys the faceless fiend...Only for Brandon to become fully possessed and try to kill his last two friends Reece and Cassie. Reece and Possessed!Brandon fight, with Reece knocking him out. As they drive away, Possessed!Brandon emerges in the back of the truck and tries to kill them again only for Reece to fight him again and throw him off the truck.

According to the epilogue, the government was sent to investigate the incident with no survivors in the town but found a wandering and disoriented Brandon. We see an interrogation tape with a possessed Brandon before he begins to cough of blood and shake convulsively before transforming into the Slenderman.

Pretty much sets the heinous standard with it wiping out a whole town, either by killing them, driving them insane, zombifying them or all of the above. Now had this been just another run of the mill rendition of the character I wouldn't be wasting this threads time with him. However, this has got to be one of the more overtly malevolent version of the tall faceless guy since The Arrival rendition, like it showing an apparent For the Evulz mentality while this one actually vocalizes it. I'm not sure if it's enough to imply moral agency due to him being an amalgamation with the wendigo, something you'd expect to be a sadistic cannibalisitic monster, but after its body is destroyed, it speaks through Brandon, showing a human type personality stating "Thanks for coming by, you really brightened my week!" and when Reece was gloating about it burning, during their fight it douses him with gasoline giving a spiteful "Lets see how you like it!" and showing an annoyed and curt attitude while "Brandon" is being interrogated saying "You know who our name, just ask your questions !" I mean it's not like we learn a whole lot about him, but those are all three of his lines that made me consider him. But since they go with the implication that he's the progenitor of the wendigo myth that's where I sort of have my reservations, since I almost always considered them Always Chaotic Evil. And it's not like his character is actually explored, besides those moments where he talks he's portrayed as more of a force or predatory creature - y'know the way he's usually portrayed.

Again this isn't one of the best candidates I brought to the board - felt like one of my noob examples - which was another reason why I procrastinated this, but now that it's out of the way, I've also seen another wendigo related media mixing them in with werewolves who may have someone worth talking about if you want to hear about him, and even then I don't think he's too special.

Slenderman.

However, Engarde doesn't fulfill the evil criteria for Ace Attorney. He's pretty much on par with many antagonists of the series that aren't Complete Monster. Florent L'Belle and Alita Tiala don't have any redeeming qualities and they don't count. Blaise Debeste and Morgan Fey have done just as bad, if not worse actions then him (affecting personal family members no less). And Dane Gustavia another villain with very similar qualities like disregarding the people around him, flaunting the helplessness to convict him, and even wave around his power over the protagonist while taunting them.

I'll need to think more about Slenderman.

I actually agree with you about Matt, as vile as he is I don't really think he stands out all that much.

For the record, I've always felt that Matt didn't meet the heinous standard and he just seemed worse because his actions affected Maya.

ok. Just cut matt.

Honestly Im for cutting Matt.

Matt ultimately kills one person and threatens to kill another and well that is bad it is well below every single other villain on the Ace Attorney page.

I'll give an aye to Slenderman.

edited 29th Jan '18 11:18:48 AM by miraculous

I honestly can't say that I agree with cutting Matt. But I get the feeling that arguing for him is a lost cause so whatever. If he's cut, he's cut I guess.

Yea.....Felt the same way. If Matt's a cut he's a cut anyways (Though I still dont excuse on what he had done to my waifu Adrian )

Anyone else on the wendigo/Slenderman combo ? Really this is an example where I can take it or leave it.

So, by chance I stumbled upon the Yu-Gi-Oh! page and was surprised to still see Tragoedia listed there. My original proposal to cut him from a year ago or so must have fallen through the cracks. So once again I make my case: He is the GX Mangas version of Thief King Bakura. Literally. His backstory is exactly the same. He even comes from the same village. Sure, he turned into an utter bastard, but not out of his own free will. He turned evil after learning◊ about the massacre of his people◊. Sure, he laters kills out of boredom, but that was after being imprisoned for 3 millennias!◊. And even then, he brings up◊ his slaughtered brethren again.

So yeah, I think it is pretty much unambiguous that he did care for them and that he didn't turn evil simply for the heck of it. Anybody objecting the cut?

edited 29th Jan '18 8:54:57 AM by Forenperser

Wow, how'd that one slip through the cracks? Cut Tragoedia.

I think I'll give a to Slenderman as well. Makes me wonder how the 2018 film will play out.

I agree with cutting Engarde as well.

We did decide to cut Tragodeia, this is so.

to Slenderman and no issues cutting Tragoedia.

To Slenderman, and cut Matt

So it's now two weeks since the season finale for The Gifted, meaning its waiting pattern is now over. In short... no one counts.

Kinda frustrating too since there was one character, Dr. Campbell, that was looking like a keeper going into the finale. Alas, the finale revealed he had a brother he genuinely cared for who suffered (and eventually died from) cystic fibrosis. His genuine love for his brother disqualifies him from CM Status, so what about the other villains? The Frost Sisters and Polaris are Well Intentioned Extremists who want to protect fellow mutants and Jace is clearly an Anti-Villain who lost his daughter as a result of a battle between the X-Men and the Mutant Brotherhood, while all others such as Carmen Guerra fail the franchise's heinous standard. We'll see if there are new candidates in S2 now that the Hellfire Club has been fully introduced and set up, but (at least for S1's villains) no one qualifies.

PS, I give to Slenderman, Mage, Dorothy, and Lord Pumpkin.

edited 29th Jan '18 11:13:59 AM by sanfranman91

Dorothy and Slendigo

Edit: I'm for cutting Matt & Tragoedia (now there's a name that didn't scamp on vowels).

edited 29th Jan '18 11:24:22 AM by 43110

Since we now seem to have 3 separate villains who are a cut : Matt, Ultimate Red Skull and Tragodeia (I don't care if it's misspelled. My phone keeps using autocorrect on it) and one more probable cut in the form of lore maybe acw should make a cut list and submitt along with next week's batch.

edited 29th Jan '18 11:32:46 AM by miraculous

I already took care of Skull (I submitted the tree of this Skull and my Skull without including Ultimate Skull).