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Subpages cleanup: Complete Monster

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During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.

Specific issues include:

  • Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
  • A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
  • Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
  • Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
  • Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.

It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.

Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:

     Previous Post 
Complete Monster Cleanup Thread

Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.

IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.

When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "[tup] to everyone I missed").

No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.

We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.

What is the Work

Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.

Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?

This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.

Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?

Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.

Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?

Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard

Final Verdict?

Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.

Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM

FriedWarthog Since: Jun, 2014 Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
#105801: Jan 9th 2018 at 7:06:32 PM

Scraggle: Honestly? Faba is a character who I at least can see getting the DPA!Charon treatment where his unpleasant traits are cranked up to eleven and he gets hit hard with Adaptational Villainy in say, a spin-off or something. Though with that being said, it seems that so far Faba being treated like a joke is a universal constant, unlike Charon who was never that goofy. So I dunno.

Anyway, for something more on-topic: yes to Sho'Tohk. Kinda funny that there seems to be a decent amount of Klingon CM's when they're real sticklers for honor.

edited 9th Jan '18 9:09:42 PM by FriedWarthog

HamburgerTime Since: Apr, 2010
#105802: Jan 9th 2018 at 7:08:03 PM

[tup] Sho'Tokh since his backstory seems to have nothing to do with his later crimes.

DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
bobg Since: Nov, 2012
#105805: Jan 9th 2018 at 7:38:21 PM

I may have found another candidate, one for webcomics. I need to ask though, can webcomics from Deviant Art have examples?

jjj
YamiVizziniX Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
#105806: Jan 9th 2018 at 7:40:04 PM

We've got Gralo from The Night the Magic Died, so I suppose.

There is no beginning. There is no end. There is only... Hooty.
FriedWarthog Since: Jun, 2014 Relationship Status: Crazy Cat Lady
nrjxll Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Not war
#105808: Jan 9th 2018 at 8:08:27 PM

Actual running webcomics hosted on Deviantart are no different from any other webcomics, troping-wise.

[tup]Sho'Tokh. I actually think there's a fair amount of Klingon CMs because their hat is a warrior honor code, since it makes it easy to indicate "this guy is really bad" by having the villain disregard it.

ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#105809: Jan 9th 2018 at 8:36:45 PM

@bobg Sure.....You can propose a villain from fan webcomic especially the likes of Deviantart or Smackjeeves.....I saw that Godzilla NEO was mostly made in deviantart for the storyline so I don't see why not

Oh and a [tup] to Sho'Tokh

edited 9th Jan '18 8:46:11 PM by ElfenLiedFan90

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
Overlord Since: Mar, 2013
#105810: Jan 9th 2018 at 8:57:58 PM

[up][up] Yeah, that sounds right.

I wonder if you could have a Ferengi CM, considering they were meant to be serious villains at first, but quickly became comic relief.

I actually remember years ago reading a short story where Quark's sleazy cousin Galia caused a civil war on a planet in order to make money selling weapons to both sides and the civil war devolves into genocide. Even other Ferengi were looking down on him for that. There was one episode of DS 9 that treated him kinda like joke, but there was another that treated him pretty seriously, with him trying to biological weapon to a dictator who was going to use it to kill millions of people.

edited 9th Jan '18 9:44:53 PM by Overlord

MenInGreyToBlak V Since: Oct, 2017 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
V
#105811: Jan 9th 2018 at 9:01:53 PM

Being comedic isn't the problem with Faba. The problem with Faba is heinousness. Look at Cyrus. How would Faba ever compare to him?

ChaoticQueen Since: Mar, 2011
#105812: Jan 9th 2018 at 10:01:11 PM

I gotta say, there are two characters in El Goonish Shive that I really look forward to discussing in the future. Of course, with the story's pacing, it probably won't be another three or four years until we learn their full motivations and goals.

edited 9th Jan '18 10:01:39 PM by ChaoticQueen

G-Editor The 47th President Since: Mar, 2015 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
The 47th President
#105813: Jan 9th 2018 at 10:10:00 PM

[up][up] Aside from not meeting the heinous standard he also seemed to have a genuine Heel–Face Turn which is a disqualifier as well

[down] Demon[tup]

edited 10th Jan '18 12:33:18 AM by G-Editor

My sandbox of EPs and other stuff
therealjackieboy from Austin, TX Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
#105814: Jan 9th 2018 at 11:14:02 PM

Late night post, so I don't know how many are gonna see this, but I'm impatient, so here goes nothing.

What Is the Work?

The Last Bucelarii is an ongoing series of dark fantasy novels (up to three books at the time of this writing) by Andy Peloquin. It stars The Hunter of Voramis (an amnesiac assassin who blurs the line between Anti-Hero and Villain Protagonist whenever the situation calls for it), a half human/demon hybrid (the titular Bucelarii, having a serious weakness toward iron) searching for his missing past after having his memories wiped a long time ago, while also being on the run from the Beggar Priests who attempt to kill him for being a Demon. He also struggles with the demonic voice living in his head, who encourages him to kill, despite Hunter not wanting to.

On his quest, Hunter runs into the Abiarazi, eons old, demonic, shapeshifting minions of the franchise’s currently mysterious villains, Warmaster and Sage. Their plan is to collect enough souls (either human or demon) in order to bring back Kharna, the dangerous war god who killed loads of other gods. Once Kharna is revived, the Abiarazi plan to rule the world with Kharna by their side as he proceeds to exterminate humankind. The Abiarazi are a nasty bunch, having a major grudge against humans for hunting their kind down and killing them, but there are some who manage to surpass others in terms of evilness. Such as this fine fellow from the first book, Blade of the Destroyer.

Who Is he?

The unnamed demon aka “The Demon of Voramis” (a nickname he loves so much) is the main villain of the first book. He’s an eons old, incredibly sadistic Abiarazi who hates humans, despite working with them.

What has he done?

A long time ago, he fought with the god of war, Kharna aka The Destroyer, gleefully slaughtering humans left and right. Kharna was then cast off into oblivion, and all the demons who fought with him were slaughtered and killed by the humans who saw them as pure evil. His ultimate goal is to bring back Kharna by using the Hunter’s blood, as Hunter is one of the Destroyer’s many children, and the last Bucelarii. When Kharna is released, he plans to use him and the other surviving demons to take over the world (of course!). He disguises himself as Lord Cyrannius, an old, crippled man who tasks Hunter to kill Brother Securus, a Beggar priest who was the only one keeping Kharna at bay.

One of his main forms is Lord Jahel, the corrupt Chief Justicar of the Heresiarchs (the Voramis police squad), and its subsidiary, The Dark Heresy, who torture and spy on innocents. He uses his position to allow The Bloody Hand, an evil underground cult, to get away with committing crimes. After he tortures a captured Hunter, he allows him to escape. Knowing that he escaped, Jahel orders his men and the Bloody Hand to kill every innocent person that Hunter cares for, succeeding in depressing Hunter.

But his ultimate form, the one seen the most, is that of The First, the leader of the evil cult The Bloody Hand. The cult rules over the town from underground, where they murder, torture, and even participate in human sex trafficking. His first appearance has him help torture Hunter when he is captured, using his right hand man, The Second, to dish out the pain. He later tortures and fatally wounds Farida, a child who was Hunter’s Morality Pet, burning his insignia on her neck. This causes Hunter to go Kill Bill on the Bloody Hand’s asses, killing them off one by one. When Hunter gets to The First, he tries to kill him, only for The First to capture him and reveal his plans to him. He then offers Hunter the chance to join him as they commit genocide on the human race, since the Bucelarii served the Abiarazi back when they were around. Hunter refuses, causing The First to leave him behind and attempt to kill him to bring back Kharna. When Hunter escapes his clutches, The First summons a serpent creature to kill him, but when that doesn’t work he orders his bodyguard, Thane, aka The Third, who is also an Abiarazi, to kill Hunter, seeing the Bucelarii as having served his purpose after escaping his clutches. When Thane is killed, Hunter goes after The First. Despite stating how much he loves his kind, The First doesn’t seem to care when he hears of Thane’s death. When Celicia, The Fourth, comes in to kill Hunter for harming The First, Hunter puts her in a choke hold and threatens to kill her; The First doesn’t care, seeing her as a pawn in his game, and immediately tries to kill her himself. He is then finally murdered by Hunter, pitifully trying to make an offer to Hunter in order to spare him, but Hunter kills him before he can complete his sentence.

Redeeming Qualities?

There’s a part where, when talking to Hunter as The First, he brings up how he laments seeing the Bucelarii as his children, hating how they were all killed. This moment lasts only a few seconds, as he immediately returns to his usual psychotic self. Note how he doesn’t mind killing Hunter, who he knows is the last of the Bucelarii. I even contacted the author via Twitter about this, where he confirmed that The First only saw the Bucelarii as willing servants, shock troops, and peons, and that he was only wanting to make the Hunter his ally in order to achieve his goal of global destruction.

Heinousness?

Easily the worst figure in the first book, even in a world filled with evil cult leaders, demons, torturers, sex traffickers, and more. While the demons themselves are a nasty lot, Hunter, while half-demon, learns to control his dark side as he tries to do what’s right (think of it like a Devil May Cry scenario).

Compared to the other Abiarazi throughout the other released books, he’s the most gleefully evil of the bunch, not even trying to hide how dastardly he is, and is proud of how sadistic he is, licking his fingers while he reminiscences killing humans alongside Kharna. And as mentioned above, he doesn’t care when demons die, making him the only hypocritical of them all.

In regards to him serving Sage and Warmaster, according to Peloquin, while the Abiarazi are tasked to bring back Kharna, how they do it is up to them. The DoV spent most of his time making the town of Voramis suffer instead of doing his job, only releasing Kharna after finding out that Hunter's the key to bringing him back.

Conclusion

I think he counts. His actions cause Hunter to leave the town of Voramis, due to the town giving him bad feelings and memories from the DoV's actions. He remains Hunter’s most personal enemy, having dealt a lasting impact on his psyche, with his actions still being referenced as the plot progresses.

edited 10th Jan '18 7:31:37 AM by therealjackieboy

It's Spooky Month!
DemonDuckofDoom from Some Pond in Hell Since: Sep, 2015 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
bobg Since: Nov, 2012
#105816: Jan 10th 2018 at 1:14:41 AM

Alright than. Here is the proposal:

What's the work?

Liquid Mercury, a Deviant Art webcomic by ibenz009, with help from Seibara. Ibenz did a comic which can be found here. For the first few pages, he did not have any text. Seibara later did commissions for him, writing out a collection of volumes which explained what happened in the comic. They can be found here. Ibenz later started to include plot summaries in the pages to help Seibara get an understanding of what was going on. To truly get the full picture, you have to read the commissions while following the pages. It's complicated. Ibenz stated he didn't do the text himself because he was lazy. The story is rather short, and can likely be read in an hour. Another user made their own commissions for the comic, but they are not considered canon, as they give our candidate a different name, and toward the comics end, Ibenz would start using the name used in Seibara's commissions (originally just referred to as the blue haired girl), establishing that as the true version.

Who is the candidate?

Angela Khyrie is the Villain Protagonist, a sadistic Mad Scientist who had her funding cut by her employers because she tortured her test subjects, showed joy in their suffering, and requested for human subjects. Amazingly, her employers didn't fire her for this. She was allowed to continue working for them in a lesser role.

What does she do?

Angela eventually started going back into the sectioned off lab to try and continue experiments without her employers knowledge. After a year, she created a goo substance that could shape itself into weapons and transform people into liquid metal androids. Shortly afterward, her employers learn that a woman (her) has been using the sectioned off lab, and a team of mercenaries is sent to neutralize her.

Angela kills the mercenaries with her goo after it transforms into spikey weapons. A second team is sent afterward. Angela kills some of them with her goo, but captures one of them named Ryan and has the goo transform him into a female android assassin named Riley to serve her. After painfully reprogramming Riley's mind, Angela sends her to kill off the surviving mercenaries. This results in a total of 44 deaths.

With her new android servant, Angela decides to take revenge on her boss for cutting her funding and take over the corporation for herself. She confronts her boss Monica, Ryan's fiancee, and reveals what she did to her fiance before having her painfully transformed into an android as well.

With Monica transformed, Angela later has her kill her own father, the previous C.E.O before Monica, and makes herself the new C.E.O.

Angela takes over the corporation, with no one the wiser to her villainous actions due to the woman who took over the lab having never been identified. Angela meets with a woman, and briefly considers transforming her as well, but decides against it since she doesn't want to draw attention to herself. After the woman leaves, Monica and Riley turn on Angela, having overcome their programming. They impale her, but instead of having her die, they decide to give her a Fate Worse than Death as punishment for what she did to them and everyone else. The two use the substance to transform her into an android like them, programming her to be their servant instead. The webcomic and it's commissions were discontinued before it could be shown what they would due with her.

Heinousness?

She kills 44 people, painfully transforms someone into a liquid metal android, shows what she did to them to their fiancée, has them painfully transformed too, has them kill their own father, and briefly considers transforming another woman. Easy pass.

Mitigating factors?

She wanted to take revenge on Monica for cutting her funding and take over the corporation herself. Her excuse is pathetic. Her funding being cut is hardly what should have happened to her considering her cruel experiments on animals and her desire to use human test subjects. They couldn't arrest her since their work was supposed to be secret even from the government, but it's mentioned that they could have still fired her without anyone on the outside hearing about what was going on. Probably because without evidence no one would believe her. The fact that they kept her employed is astounding. Monica's father states that if he was still in charge he would have fired her, so his daughter was being very generous. Her response to having her funding cut is to transform Monica into an android and have her kill her father so she can take over. Very disproportionate.

Conclusion?

An easy keep. It is weird how this webcomic is handled by having a third party explain what is going on through commissions, but those are regarded as canon by the creator later using the same name for the character as the commissioner. If Deviant Art webcomics can have examples, she belongs in my opinion.

jjj
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#105817: Jan 10th 2018 at 3:11:41 AM

I'l read the effortposts later, but on Faba (Sauboh sounds so much cooler than Faba BTW)? I don't know if you watch the anime, but they made him a REAL jerkass who tortured Nebby among other things.

Piterpicher Veteran Editor IV from Poland, for real (Series 2) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Veteran Editor IV
#105818: Jan 10th 2018 at 3:28:11 AM

Hey, Monster.Film A To E is getting too long. I think we should split it to Monster.Film A To C and Monster.Film D To E. Does anyone else agree?

edited 10th Jan '18 3:28:28 AM by Piterpicher

Currently mostly inactive. An incremental game I tested: https://galaxy.click/play/176 (Gods of Incremental)
ElfenLiedFan90 Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression) from Jakarta,Indonesia Since: Aug, 2017 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
Me in a nutshell (Coping with Depression)
#105819: Jan 10th 2018 at 3:28:15 AM

I'll give a [tup] to Angela and the Demon

"Making screw-ups and mistakes was I ever really good at. Because everything I touch went to hell."
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#105820: Jan 10th 2018 at 3:35:52 AM

[up][up] Yeah, I saw that. I'll have to play around with the films this weekend. We currently have 5 pages; no other medium has more than 3.

Piterpicher Veteran Editor IV from Poland, for real (Series 2) Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
Veteran Editor IV
#105821: Jan 10th 2018 at 3:42:25 AM

There's nothing weird with films having the most examples, since they are the most common type of media. We should just split them, since there's no works on that page that would deserve their own pages.

edited 10th Jan '18 3:54:45 AM by Piterpicher

Currently mostly inactive. An incremental game I tested: https://galaxy.click/play/176 (Gods of Incremental)
miraculous Goku Black (Apprentice)
Goku Black
#105822: Jan 10th 2018 at 5:21:37 AM

[tup] to Sho'Tokh, Demon, Angela

"That's right mortal. By channeling my divine rage into power, I have forged a new instrument in which to destroy you."
Clown-Face Wild Child from Canada Since: Dec, 2015 Relationship Status: In another castle
Wild Child
#105824: Jan 10th 2018 at 6:57:20 AM

Found this on YMMV.The Gamers Alliance.

  • Complete Monster: Arawn sends a starving elven slave family into a house which is full of food and burns the house and the family to ashes. Leraje eats people while raping them and loves to torture his still-living victims as long as possible, even pretending to be weak during duels to offer them a Hope Spot before utterly skewering them.

I don't think these were approved.

Why so serious?
Lightysnake Since: May, 2010
#105825: Jan 10th 2018 at 7:06:57 AM

mmm....can't really tell what he's doing there.

As for a Ferengi CM. I mean, it's possible, but the Ferengi have really, really warped systems of morality due to their capitalism=ALL mentality, so I'm not sure Quark's cuz would make the cut because he's taking that to a...logical extreme, Especially heinous-wise. That said? Yes to Sho'tokh. As Nrj said, Klingons' whole thing is "we are a proud warrior race and we will engage in fair battle with our enemies!" ....when you have a guy who goes against it to massacre the entire children of a planet? well...

Yes to Angela and the Nameless Demon, btw.


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