During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
I've seriously considered bringing that up in TRS before, because I have no idea whatsoever what it's actually supposed to be.
to Euron.
I'm interested to see if any movies I'm aware of come up among these planned EPs.
to the Emperor on principal (though I did read the EP for that fanfic).
Hans treated his men fine too, but didn't care about them though as demonstrated by blowing the roof when Karl was there.
My friend and I saw IT last night and it was really good. And Pennywise/It was indeed as nasty as I'd read. Reaffirming my
.
edited 23rd Oct '17 2:19:59 PM by futuremoviewriter
Hey just a question when Palps is accepted, what page will he go to since the fanfic he's from has no page here? And I reccomend both fanfics to read.
Also, I would like if someone here looked up other fanfic versions of palpatine that were C Ms since the dude's worse than frieza for heck sake.
So, here is what I can do for Euron.
The Open Way: Euron Greyjoy manages to be far more villainous here than in the books. During the Ironborn's attempt to become independent, Euron is first introduced torturing a captured lord, using the skulls of his two eldest sons, now little more than skulls following Faircastle's capture, to taunt him and threatening to have his remaining children, who are being forced to watch, raped by his men unless he begs for death. He manages to capture Casterly Rock by having his mute daughters pretend to be whores so they can infiltrate it, fondling one of their breast beforehand, and taking Tyrion Lannister and several children hostage, forcing the Lannister forces to stand down, having them all killed. He then sends the severed heads of the hostages to Queen Cersei Lannister and King Rhaegar Targaryen. During negotiations with the Golden Company, he reveals he has sent Balon's sons and his brother Aeron into battles they cannot hope to win as distractions, knowing they will die. When confronted about this, he states that even if he had a thousand nephews he would still send them to their deaths as long as it served his cause. After capturing Asha Greyjoy and her thrall/lover Robb Stark, he has them beaten savagely, making sure they can watch so they will tell him what is in a chest Asha has. After learning it is a dragon egg, he admits that he killed Balon and has been giving orders in his name, then orders Robb thrown into the sea to keep him quiet. Now with two dragons eggs, he goes to the Dragon Pit, intending to sacrifice Asha and several children so as to hatch them. When several of his men manage to capture Princess Visenya, the only reason they don't rape her and instead try to rape her septa is because they fear that Euron will be upset he didn't get to go first. When Robb is captured once more by his men, he gives him a choice of either burning with Asha or watching her die, after which Euron will slit his throat. Before that, however, he orders his men to ignite several caches of wildfire across King's Landing, destroying large portions of the city. A power hungry Psychopathic Manchild who thirsts for godhood, Euron wasn't afraid to kill anyone who stood in his way, including his own family.
Bit of an effort post, I admit. Anyone want to gut this down?
edited 22nd Oct '17 4:31:02 PM by Vampireandthen
Please allow me to introduce myself, I am a man of wealth and taste. Nice to meet you, hope you can guess my name.I'll give a yea to Mac.
Alright, so for the first of mine...
What's the setting?
Film of origin is Open Fire, starring Jeff Wincott (who appears to be a relative unknown on the action B scene). So, for the plot itself... well, I'll give you a guess. It involves Wincott's character playing an ex-cop who's partner died when he disobeyed direct orders from Da Chief, causing him to quit in disgust, only to be forced back into action as a one-man army to kick terrorist ass, get the girl...
Yeah, we've heard this a million times. Our villain today? Stein Kruger, played by Patrick Kilpatrick (a kickass name if I've ever heard one).
Who is Kruger? What has he done?
A smooth-voiced criminal serving numerous life sentences for the murder of eight US servicemen and the robbery of millions worth of weapons, Kruger is introduced gouging out the eyes of one prisoner who attempts to shank him in prison... smugly telling one of the guards who apparently set the situation up he'll have to try harder than that to kill him. Kruger, at the same time, is arranging for his own escape; through a group of mercenaries who murder several innocent people on his direct orders, Kruger's gang takes over a power plant in Los Angeles, taking everyone there hostage, and the officers are given a tape containing his demands. If he's not released within a few hours? Kruger's men will massacre the hostages. Under pressure, Kruger is let out... unfortunately for him, though, Kruger's hostages also include the father of our protagonist Alec McNeil, who begins a one-man crusade to stop him as the officers are left at a standstill with Kruger's threats still in play.
Forcing the workers at the power plant to start making a new solution with the use of it to be revealed later, Kruger's informed that Alec — his identity unknown to Kruger at this point — is making his way through the power plant and killing his way through the mercenaries. Executing one of the hostages himself to blow off some steam, Kruger orders his goons to sweep the area and kill or capture Alec before revealing his demands; he wants thirty million worth of pure, shimmering diamonds brought to his location. Once he's given the diamonds as Alec continues to move through the planet, Kruger lets some of the hostages go... but then tells the cop he's dealing with his new threat.
That stuff he was making? Is nerve gas — if they try to pursue him, Kruger will blow up the plant and release the gas all over Los Angeles, tortuously killing its entire population. Ordering one of the other hostages to drive off as a decoy lest he be blown up and having Alec's father comply to fly him out by threatening to murder the remaining hostage in front of him, Kruger escapes through the tunnels and flies off, intending to make his way to Brazil and retire with the money... however, Alec's right on his tail. Right on the border, our final battle ensues as Kruger ends up shooting through one of his own men in his attempt to get at Alec, before Alec finally overpowers him. Defiant to the end, Kruger smugly tells Alec to pull the trigger, as Alec brings the gun up to his head and...
...alright, I won't lie, the one surprising twist on the usual formula we've got here? Alec keeps Kruger alive and actually turns him in instead of the usual over-the-top death, with the implication he's interested in taking back his old job as a cop on a later date, closing off the movie as Kruger's led back into bars.
Any mitigating factors?
Nope. No redeeming moments, excuse, and I think he clears the heinous standard. A bit of his villainy is fairly generic action baddie stuff, but Kruger makes it perfectly clear he's willing to have millions of people agonizingly killed by nerve gas should his demands not be met. Pass, I think.
Conclusion?
Keeper here.
Thoughts?
edited 22nd Oct '17 4:36:18 PM by Scraggle
Euron probably needs to be cut by 1/4-1/5.
Patrick: Is there any indication he would keep his word if his demands were met, or does it never get to that point? If the latter, I vote yes; if the former, I'd be more hesitant.
Patrick Kilpatrick's played a CM before: Sandman.
edited 22nd Oct '17 4:52:58 PM by ACW
@ACW: Pragmatic Villainy. Keep in mind once he actually prepares his getaway his threats go from "kill some hostages" to "horribly murder an entire city" — and I think actually doing the latter even if he gets away would bring a lot of heat down on him and screw up his entire plan, wouldn't it?
edited 23rd Oct '17 9:08:32 AM by Scraggle
@ACW: I wanna give some updates regarding on the CM description of the respective series. I'll just put it in your sandbox, alright:
Kamen Rider Kuuga: While the Gurongi Tribe is a race of Serial Killers of this series, two of them stands among the worst of their kind:
Kamen Rider Kiva: : While the Fangire race are the major antagonists in the series, there are 3 specific members who crossed the ultimate lines:
Kamen Rider Gaim: In a series that takes the franchise back to its Darker and Edgier roots, there are two heinous villains who cross the ultimate lines:
edited 22nd Oct '17 5:09:53 PM by n3xus
This is all Zi-O's fault!
