During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Found this on the Maoh King's character page:
- Even Evil Has Standards: Maoh King kills a girl in cold blood for being an Alpha Bitch, not caring that she was very attractive and actually willing to give him children.
That's not an EEHS moment, at all. He was simply disinterested in mating with her because he thought she was "trashy" regardless of her being willing to bear his children. It's more "Even Evil Has Good Tastes."
Anyway, I found this on Criminal Case:
- Similar to Ayush is Anbu Devanesan, who appeared only in World Edition's Case 32 but managed to do a lot of harm in that one case. At first, he comes off as heavily traumatized by his girlfriend's murder, and spends most of the case acting suicidally depressed or hiding behind his defense lawyer. Then it turns out that he's the one who murdered his girlfriend, his reason being that she came across the word SOMBRA in his files once, and didn't care if she knew the organization or not. Right after that, when Elliot brings in proof of his crimes of murder and money laundering, he loses it and kidnaps the boy, threatening to kill him if the Bureau did anything. He then shoots Jack for trying to stop the kidnapping, badly injures Elliot and even implies that he was going to hand him over to SOMBRA to regain their favor. When the Bureau finally catches up to Anbu, he tries to kill Elliot in front of them, only being stopped by Jonah's Big Damn Heroes moment. It's worth noting that his actions shocked even his defense lawyer (who had been fiercely protective of him throughout the case), and might've been one of reasons she defected from SOMBRA herself afterwards.
As I am finished with the game for the time being, I cut the unapproved entry and PMed the troper.
edited 13th May '17 5:34:33 AM by AustinDR
@Supper Saiya Man, I think Scraggle's waiting for the season to end.
Was directed here via PM.
Anyway:
Dominico Scarpa in the Criminal Minds: Beyond Borders episode "Il Mostro." In his prime as a Serial Killer, his A God Am I and Sex Is Evil, and I Am Horny mindset led him to kill many couples, then even rape and beat his own sister almost to death. And when his "career" was (thankfully) cut short by a Your Days Are Numbered disease, he manipulated his approval-seeking nephew/son — the product of said rape, no less — into continuing that legacy, all so Scarpa could at least Go Out with a Smile by reliving said prime. And in the end, Scarpa and his Heavy nephew/son abduct and almost torture Carmela Tafani — the local lead investigator whom almost caught Scarpa once and is currently making another, IRT-backed attempt — to death, all while he vows she'll beg for Hell itself compared to what he'll put her through.
Was Leigh Emerson voted cut?
Also, do we wanna move Feng Shen Ji and Shin Angyo Onshi to Other Media? And what about the light novels (or are those close enough to Manga?)?
edited 13th May '17 12:51:01 PM by ACW
Write-ups:
- The Iron Tower: Modru is Gyphon's right-hand man and most active agent in Mithgar, nearly bringing the world to ruin during the War of the Ban. Five thousand years later, Modru instigated the Winter War as part of a plot to free Gyphon, sending Vulgs to raid the Boskydells, and a horde of his Spaunen to raze Challerain Keep. Controlling his armies by projecting his will through brain-damaged mind slaves and executing any minions who defy him, Modru spread warfare to every corner of Mithgar, from the Boskydells (where his Ghuls torch dozens of towns and butcher numerous families, including those of protagonists Tuck and Merrilee) to the far south, and makes it clear to the captive Princess Laurelain that in the event of his victory, he will exterminate the Warrows, enslave the Elves and Dwarves, and burn her father and all his subjects in a single great funeral pyre. When Elven Lord Vanidor tries to rescue Laurelain, Modru has him racked to death, forcing Laurelain to watch. When Tuck attempts to free her, Modru beats him near to death with an iron bar. In the end, Modru attempts to sacrifice Laurelain to ensure Gyphon's return, gloating that while he could have used anyone's blood to feed his master, it amused him to use that of "a royal damosel".
- Harakan, alias Lord Mengha, is one of Urvon's underlings, and the most treacherous Grolim in the whole of The Malloreon. Posing as the leader of the Bear-cult, Harakan twice sent assassins to murder Queen Ce'Nedra, mind controlled her into nearly murdering her own son, and after his plan to trigger a war between Garion and King Anheg failed, raised the Bear-cult in revolt in Drasnia and Cherek alike. When this plan, and a subsequent one to worsen the war between Cthol Murgos and Mallorea both resulted in disaster, Harakan made contact with the Demon Lord Nahaz and cut a deal with him, whereby Nahaz would drive Urvon mad, make Harakan ruler of the world and by seizing the Orb of Aldur and the Sardion destroy both the Light and Dark Prophecies and make the King of Hell the new Lord of the Universe in place of UL. He also resurrected demon-worship in Karanda, turned the Malloreon Civil War into a Mêlée à Trois, used Nahaz's demons to sack multiple cities and massacre their populations and convinced young Karandese women to let Nahaz impregnate them, a process that would not only kill the girls, but would unleash demons that were of this world and could not be banished. Never quite as clever or in control as he thought he was, Harakan was nevertheless fully aware of what he was doing when he unleashed Nahaz, and was prepared to risk the destruction of the multiverse for the sake of personal power.
How do those look?
edited 21st May '17 8:59:09 AM by AmbarSonofDeshar
A reminder: The Guardians Of The Galaxy Vol 2 discussion has been reserved by Lighty for 19th May.
Any discussion of it other than "loved it, can't wait for the discussion!" or "hated it, can't wait for the discussion!" WILL result in a mod getting Hollered.
I was hoping we'd get less instances of it, but I have seen more than desired violations of the spoiler policy.
Also, Injustice 2's US release is on the 16th May. I have reserved discussion of that for the 30th, despite the UK release being the 19th. I am confident I can finish the story, get whatever pertinent Arcade/Ladder endings that are needed and produce an Effort Post-IF there is at least one candidate- before the 30th. But, again: NO. SPOILERS.
No "Man, this villain was really nasty!"
No "I can't wait to talk about this evil Batman!"
No "I can't believe Joker doesn't count anymore!"
These are hypotheticals, of course, but, you know
DON'T.
If I see you breaking the policy, I will not hesitate to Holler a mod.
This is my final warning.
Ambar: Those look good. Please add to the drafts (they may go with next week's batch; there's already 37 entries with this week). So the indentations would go like this?
- Mithgar:
- The Iron Tower: Modru
- Stoke
- The Belgariad:
- Magician's Gambit: Ctuchik
- The Malloreon:
- Harakan
- Zandramas
edited 13th May '17 3:24:59 PM by ACW
Alrighty, doing my part in these kung fu film CMs, I present my latest candidate.
Who is he?
The White Lotus Chief/Priest of the White Lotus is the Big Bad of the Shaw Brothers martial arts film Cult of the White Lotus/Fists of the White Lotus.
What has he done?
The film opens with dozens of prisoners being released from their (Mostly) wrongful confinement in an Imperial prison.
One of these such prisoners is known for having killed the legendary evil martial artist Pai Mei alongside his brother, our hero Hung Wen-Ting.
Unfortunately for the prisoners, they are ambushed on the way home by the evil White Lotus Cult, a criminal organization that promptly massacres the lot of them, with Wen-Ting and his brother narrowly evading this slaughter.
Though staying in a Shaolin temple, Wen-Ting and his brither are attacked by the White Lotus Cult, who kill anyone in their way as they try to murder Wen-Ting and his brother.
And then in walks the White Lotus Chief, who reveals that he is a former classmate of Pai Mei's, seeking revenge for Pai Mei's death. The White Lotus Chief also completely inexpicably looks JUST like Pai Mei, but eh.
The White Lotus Chief duels several Shaolin men, hitting them in their pressure points then informing them they can leave....the men proceed to drop dead while trying to flee due to the pressure points the White Lotus Chief hit.
The White Lotus Chief goes on to murder Wen-Ting's brother and his fiancee, leaving an injured Wen-Ting to flee.
As Wen-Ting begins training to try and combat the White Lotus Chief once more, the White Lotus Chief informs his nephew to begin systematically disposing of other Shaolin men across the region.
Then....for absolutely no reason...the White Lotus Cult goes on to massacre a CHARITY EVENT. I kid you not, more then a dozen people are working on rebuilding a shelter/temple, at which point the White Lotus Cult strolls up, stabs a monk blessing the people for assisting to death, then cuts down the many workers.
I don't know if this was a SHAOLIN temple they were rebuilding or something, but it was freaking hilarious how they just massacre a seeming charity event for no apparent reason.
Wen-Ting, after a few months of training, confronts the White Lotus Chief, and promptly....loses horribly. During the duel, the White Lotus Chief accidentally murders one of his own men, who he promptly shoves out of the way with complete indifference.
Later, after training some more, Wen-Ting returns to duel the White Lotus Chief one final time.....and loses again, this time being hit in the pressure points by the White Lotus Chief, who, not wanting to "dirty his floor", uses his 100 Pace Palm attack, a move that will kill whoever is hit by it after they take 100 paces.
Wen-Ting survives this by only taking 81 paces befire collapsing, at which point he is nursed back to health by his teachers using acupuncture. Luckily, this also gives Wen-Ting the idea to use acupuncture in his next duel with the White Lotus Chief.
Ambushing the White Lotus Chief while he is in the bathtub, Wen-Ting fights with the nude White Lotus Chief while the White Lotus Chief slowly gets dressed throughout the duel.
Siccing his minions on Wen-Ting, the White Lotus Chief ultimately duels Wen-Ting one final time after his minions are killed, and after using numerous acuouncture needles, Wen-Ting finally kills the White Lotus Chief by stabbing his acupuncture points....through his hands, ending his life once and for all.
Freudian Excuse or other redeeming features?
Eh.
While his opening attack on Wen-Ting and his brother is out of a desire for revenge for Pai Mei, he says this with a SMILE on his face, treats the whole thing like a game, and the revenge comes off more as a "I was trained in the same way as he. Must restore the prude in power like mine!" than anything else.
He also has a decent-enough relationship with his nephew, but this never goes beyond...
"Wow uncle White Lotus Chief, you're the greatest!"
"Aren't I JUST? Now, bask in the awesomeness of my kung fu!"
- Both of them break into evil laughter*
So yeah, not really seeing anything there.
Heinousness?
Worst in-story.
Handily over the baseline. Massacres over a dozen prisoners just to try and kill TWO people, orders other slaughters to take place, one of which was seemingly of a CHARITY event, and personally kills a heckton of people himself.
Final Verdict?
I'd say Keep him. Another hilariously awesome kung fu baddie for the record books.
edited 13th May '17 7:19:51 PM by Ravok
No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!Hi guys what's up, btw I just watched the latest episode of KR Ex-Aid. BTW speaking of Kuroto Dan, who finally made a Heel–Face Turn as of now, can we remove him from CM page completely?
This is all Zi-O's fault!

@83557: I still oppose altering his entry since we are in the middle of the block's story season. I don't in any way think Bolas will be disqualified, but there's a lot of mystery surrounding his true motive. We still don't know why Amonkhet and the Worthy are even important to him (beyond a vague "he wants to become even more powerful"), but it's bound to be something big and something that's bound to be revealed within the next month or two.
@83564: He could die in Hour, sure, but most lore people I know of are expecting this to be the Gatewatch's first big defeat. Bolas is literally powerful enough to make gods afraid and he's maybe a day away (in-universe) from arriving on Amonkhet, with the protagonists not actually having any idea about how to fight him (plus, it's been pointed out in-story that going straight to Amonkhet to fight Bolas without strategy or backup might not have been the wisest choice).
edited 13th May '17 4:55:35 PM by LordXavius