During the investigation of recent hollers in the Complete Monster thread, it's become apparent to the staff that an insular, unfriendly culture has evolved in the Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard threads that is causing problems.
Specific issues include:
- Overzealous hollers on tropers who come into the threads without being familiar with all the rules and traditions of the tropes. And when they are familiar with said rules and traditions, they get accused (with little evidence) of being ban evaders.
- A few tropers in the thread habitually engage in snotty, impolite mini-modding. There are also regular complaints about excessive, offtopic "socializing" posts.
- Many many thread regulars barely post/edit anywhere else, making the threads look like they are divorced from the rest of TV Tropes.
- Following that, there are often complaints about the threads and their regulars violating wiki rules, such as on indexing, crosswicking, example context and example categorization. Some folks are working on resolving the issues, but...
- Often moderator action against thread regulars leads to a lot of participants suddenly showing up in the moderation threads to protest and speak on their behalf, like a clique.
It is not a super high level problem, but it has been going on for years and we cannot ignore it any longer. There will be a thread in Wiki Talk
to discuss the problem; in the meantime there is a moratorium on further Complete Monster and Magnificent Bastard example discussion until we have gotten this sorted out.
Update: The new threads have been made and can be found here:
Please see the Frequently Asked Questions and Common Requests List before suggesting any new entries for this trope.
IMPORTANT: To avoid a holler to the mods, please see here for the earliest date a work can be discussed, (usually two weeks from the US release), as well as who's reserved discussion.
When voting, you must specify the candidate(s). No blanket votes (i.e. "
to everyone I missed").
No plagiarism: It's fair to source things, but an effortpost must be your own work and not lifted wholesale from another source.
We don't care what other sites think about a character being a Complete Monster. We judge this trope by our own criteria. Repeatedly attempting to bring up other sites will earn a suspension.
What is the Work
Here you briefly describe the work in question and explain any important setting details. Don't assume that everyone is familiar with the work in question.
Who is the Candidate and What have they Done?
This will be the main portion of the Effort Post. Here you list all of the crimes committed by the candidate. For candidates with longer rap sheets, keep the list to their most important and heinous crimes, we don't need to hear about every time they decide to do something minor or petty.
Do they have any Mitigating Factors or Freudian Excuse?
Here you discuss any potential redeeming or sympathetic features the character has, the character's Freudian Excuse if they have one, as well as any other potential mitigating factors like Offscreen Villainy or questions of moral agency. Try to present these as objectively as possible by presenting any evidence that may support or refute the mitigating factors.
Do they meet the Heinousness Standard?
Here you compare the actions of the Candidate to other character actions in the story in order to determine if they stand out or not. Remember that all characters, not just other villains, contribute to the Heinousness Standard
Final Verdict?
Simply state whether or not you think the character counts or not.
Edited by GastonRabbit on Aug 31st 2023 at 4:14:10 AM
Okay, so...Toriko is almost done and...it turns out Acacia doesn't count. All of that was an act and he was a secret good guy the whole time (including when he sadistically murdered his own adopted son. That's some devoted method acting right there.)
So, that leaves one potential candidate: Joie.
Who Is He?
Joie is a food spirit. A deceased being who returns through the appetite of powerful beings through their Gourmet Cells. After the goddess of Chefs, Froese died, Acacia ended up summoning a food spirit into her deceased body to assist him with his plans....now, it turns out Acacia is attempting to save and stop his demon NEO by rescuing everything NEO had eaten...to do so requires NEO to be defeated...and the one emotion NEO cannot stand is 'rage', hence why Acacia is acting the evil villain.
Joie, however, is not acting, and wishes to reach the 'Furthest Lands' to discover all new flavors and tastes, while assisting with the 'cooking' of earth.
In present, Joie's origins are shrouded in mystery. Known as The Dark Chef, Joie is a brilliant chef who won the world-wide cooking festival centuries prior but was disqualified for violating a...certain taboo. Joie ends up taking leadership of a group known as NEO after the demon...
What's He Done?
Joie, as a master chef, is also a master of changing the flavors of human beings. A cut from Joie results in them becoming the slaves of Joie and NEO, so he brainwashes high-level people and uses them as spies in a multitude of organizations.
This aside, Joie is the mastermind behind the final major arc of the first part of the series: centuries past, one of Acacia's Three Disciples sealed away a monster known as The Four Beast in the Gourmet World. Joie uses one of his pawns to revive the Four Beast and promptly sics it on the human World, knowing it will devour everything. The Four Beast eats humans in the millions of not billions and could well devour everyone in the human world., Joie uses this as a distraction so he can retrieve a book on human cooking he wanted.
After this, Joie participates in an attack on the annual cooking festival, activating his pawns to kill multiple high ranking figures in the world's governments and fighting with several of the good guys before fleeing. With no further need to hide, Joie initiates, with the Gourmet Nobles, the 'cooking' of earth, intending to prepare the planet so that it is destroyed and every living thing fed to NEO, while also facilitating the feeding of human captives to NEO in lines miles long.
Joie then ends up fighting with Midora, the first villain of the series and the youngest of Acacia and Froese's sons. Joie uses Froese's body to mentally torment Midora, playing at being Froese to cause him to drop his guard and then seals Midora away, leaving him to die when earth is destroyed before rejoining Acacia. Joie then participates in the final battle, killing two opponents by painfully melting them with his special fungus and fights Midora's right-hand man and Toriko's twin brother and former rival Starjun. Joie wins the fight and prepares to help Acacia/NEO eat everyone else in the area so they can get to the Furthest Lands, when Midora arrives again.
Joie attempts to pull the same nasty Mind Rape plan on Midora, who isn't having any of it and while reciting all his best memories of Froese, Midora utterly stomps Joie, who screams and begs for Midora not to destroy him as his body is Froese's.
At the last second, Acacia interferes and saves Joie by stopping his body's destruction...though it turns out that Acacia, not wanting for Midora to destroy his beloved mother figure's body, performed the killing blow on Joie himself.
Heinous by the standards of the story? Other Mitigating Features?
Joie has no redeeming qualities whatsoever. He initially seems to like, respect and get on with the Gourmet Nobles/Blue Nitro, but he doesn't even react when they're killed. In heinousness, Joie shares most of his crimes with others, but unleashing the Four Beast on earth, and his assistance in cooking the world will result with a death count in the billions. Acacia takes a more proactive roll in trying to destroy the world (Granted, he's faking all of it, and intends to be stopped, so he's not actually trying), but Joie sure as hell isn't acting and facilitates him doing this, all to reach the Furthest Lands and the 'paradise' of appetite.
The only other thing is Joie is less personally hateable than Acacia's....faking, and kind of pathetic in the end when he turns into a cringing Dirty Coward begging for Midora to spare him, but this's never been a bar.
Conclusion?
I'd say keep, though this twist really, really sucked.
Jeebus Cripes the Acacia twist was horrible. I only recently binged through Toriko, so I wasn't AS invested in the whole "Acacia is a douche" thing as those who have been reading through it for years, and I was STILL ticced off severely. Lighty said it best: There were evil things he did when no one else was around that would have NO BEARING on others hating him....yet he still did them. WHERE IS THE SENSE???
I honestly don't even know why the twist existed. Was the mangaka trying to make us feel something for Acacia in the end? Because that didn't work. All it did was make use angry that we were supposed to now "forgive" the most hateable character in the story because of some Ass Pull freaking stupid character twist.
Ugh. Just...UGH. Regardless, 'Yes' to Joie. While he's not AS hateable as Acacia, he's darn-near just as bad in crimes, and he's got jack squat in redeeming features.
edited 11th Nov '16 10:20:44 PM by Ravok
No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!So, despite being a good guy, he killed a his son despite not even needing to do so...seems legit.
This lame twist kind of remind of Itachi. Alright, he had to kill every one last of his clan, and even then spared Sasuke. But dude, was it necessary to Mind Rape your little brother by forcing him to see the memory of his parents's death for 3 freaking days ? Then, years later, breaking his arm, beating him to a pulp and Mind Raping him again? Somehow, he won the poll "which Naruto character would you want as you want as your big brother". I'd want him too...if I'm feeling suicidal. In fact, Sasuke would have been much more sympathetic if he wasn't in the same universe as Haku and (especially) Gaara.
Regardless,
Joie and a slight yes to Plaxus.
edited 12th Nov '16 1:06:18 AM by MiraiYuji
There is no solid, believable way the writer would've been able to pull off something like that with the mountainload of shit Acacia has done and scenes like gloating in front of his murdered son in mind. Like, I'm seriously baffled how this could've ever been thought as a good idea.
Oh, and yes to Plaxus.
edited 11th Nov '16 11:15:18 PM by Scraggle
Cooking people I believe, humans seem to be taboo to eat if you're human yourself.
Acacia is probably the worst written and most disjointed Shonen antagonist ever. And this is from a guy who read Naruto and saw all the shit with Obito! And given that Toriko was written to be a tribute to classic Shonen, such as Fist Of The North Star or Dragon Ball, you'd expect the author to go all the way in making the big bad stay as evil as possible so there's no pity when he dies. One has to wonder if one of his editors suggested "Hey, Naruto got popular by making even its most horrible villains sympathetic, why not do that for Acacia too?"
Yeah, but Fist of the North star did that sometimes as well though. Not the fake-outs, but rather This evil villain has a totally tragic and good backstory which we'll hit you with in the final moments so they're more sympathetic: Souther's genocidal child slavery and graveyards of dead children were all done in memory of his master, Yuda's serial rapist schtick was all done because of his jealousy over Rei's more beautiful style, etc. I'm almost disappointed they never did it with Jagi.
It only really worked with Raoh because the reveal of his good qualities wasn't at the end of his arc so the story could do more with him.
Hell, if Jackal didn't have the thing where he tried to kill those kids then I'd say he'd be disqualified because there's tons of raiders that do similar stuff.
Also: Joie get's a
edited 12th Nov '16 1:52:01 AM by DrPsyche
I tried to rewrite Anathos from Les Légendaires
Original entry:
- Complete Monster: Anathos is an Omnicidal Maniac with absolutely no code of honor. His actions include: crushing and savagely crippling the protagonists; mocking Jadina about her relationship with the now "deceased" Danael; ordering his Hellions to physically and mentally torture Tenebris for information; and creating a plague to exterminate people he wouldn't bother killing himself. Whereas Darkhell at least cared for his daughter and Skroa never went further than slapping his, Anathos killed his own Dark Mistress by blowing her head off just after pretending to forgive her defeat.
My rewritte:
- Complete Monster: Anathos is an Omnicidal Maniac with absolutely no code of honor. Imprisonned in the Bearer by his kind for destroying the original planet of Alysia, Anathos seeks to free himself by manipulating the elf Shimy into receiving his mark so that he could use her as his host. When the Legendaries prevent him from using Shimy, he takes possession of Danael before crushing and savagely crippling the protagonists and mocking Jadina about her relationship with the now "deceased" Danael. After killing Elysio, Darkhell and the Guardian who tried to stop him, he leads a rampage with his Hellions across the world to annihilate humanity by wiping out the major cities, sicking the Vulturs on the survivors and creating a plague to exterminate people he wouldn't bother killing himself. He orders his Hellions to physically and mentally torture Tenebris for information and when his Dark Mistress Dark Jadina begs him forgiveness for failing to kill the original Jadina, he blows her head off just after pretending to forgive her. Humiliated by the Legendaries, he attempts one last time to destroy Alysia before Kalandre stops him.
Is it better? As usual anyone with better writing skills or familiar with the work is free to make corrections.
I hesitated mentionning the fact he would possibly have killed his son Eternity by destroying the world (as we later learn is sealed on Alysia) but it isn't brought in the story so...
edited 12th Nov '16 4:22:16 AM by Silverblade2
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This Yuda fellow...is said jealousy why he doesn't count? I don't think any of the other Fist CMs are a Serial Rapist.
Please add to the Drafts.
edited 12th Nov '16 4:25:43 AM by ACW
Here's what's pending, BTW:
- For Drafts Page:
- Current Writeups:
- Joie? (Lightysnake)
- Alien Bat (CyberXIII)
- General Vykar
(Ekimmak)
- New Tricks (MGD107)
- Harry Skinner?; Sister Sigrid? (Morgenthaler)
- Governor Plaxus (Ravok)
- Current Writeups to Be Expanded in the Future:
- Prime Minister Honest manga (Lightysnake? Clown-Face?)
edited 12th Nov '16 6:31:02 AM by ACW
- Eternal Sonata: Count Waltz is the 16 year old ruler of Forte City who is responsible for all of the suffering throughout the game. Aspiring to dominate the world, Waltz oversees the manufacturing of a mutagenic substance he dubs mineral powder. Marketing it as a miraculous cure all for illnesses, Waltz aims to create super soldiers to wage war with Baroque. Extensive use of the drug drives its user to madness after which their soul is trapped in a perpetual purgatory unable to move on. Concluding that beings known as the "glowing agogos" should increase the potency of the concoction, he tasks his henchmen with acquiring the creatures. Waltz becomes displeased upon realizing that his spy — Claves — had fallen in love with the leader of Andantino (a rebel group out to overthrow him), and he sends Rondo to kill her, a fact that he mocks Jazz with later on. Learning that the agogos only glowed in Polka's presence, Waltz slaps her to the ground, and turns his dragons onto the group despite him saying that he'd spare them. Always a sore loser, he forces his advisor, Legato, to drink the unfinished mineral powder, transforming him into a horrid monster called the Ruined Body. Refusing to accept defeat, Waltz orders Legato to destroy everything, saying if he couldn't rule the world, it may as well shouldn't exist. Power hungry and alarmingly casual in his atrocities, Waltz saw experimenting on his own subjects as a necessary step towards total domination.
edited 12th Nov '16 6:18:48 AM by AustinDR

Alright, couple of things. First of all, expect an effortpost from X-Men the Animated Series tonight or tomorrow.
Second, 'Yes' to Waltz. Epic name, by the way. XD
Next up, here's a new proposal from the Choice of Games series. This'll be a short one, but still.
Who is he?
Governor Plaxus is the Big Bad of the game Mobile Armored Marine, a Space Marine story where you travel to a planet known as "Far Hope", a settler's planet where the thousands of colonists have mysteriously vanished.
Plaxus is the leader of the planet Far Hope, and a true scumbag.
What has he done?
Plaxus makes contact with a race of lizard-like aliens known as Lacertians, and makes a deal with them to supply them with whatever they want in exchange for their immense riches.
Eventually though, Plaxus gets even greedier, and the Lacertians reveal that they would now like to start trading their wealth fin exchange for being allowed to research the colonists' biology and such.
Plaxus decides to oblige the Lacertians, and gets a few of them to cooperate the Lacertians and be taken away for research.
When these people don't return (CAN'T IMAGINE WHY), the other thousands of colonists' refuse to cooperate with the Lacertians. Thid doesn't last very long, as Plaxus then works with the Lacertians to kidnap the hundreds upon hundreds of colonists.
With the Lacertians taking over the planet, Plaxus uses their biology to enhance himself, hoping to make himself "immortal" with their regeneration properties.
The truth is then revealed, the truth that Plaxus has known since the beginning: The Lacertians eat humans, and that's why they wanted the colonists. Yes, that's right, Plaxus gave away his entire colony of thousands of innocents to be devoured by dinosaur monsters in exchange for their regenrative abilities. Wat.
When you confront him, Plaxus just oozes Faux Affably Evil smugness, stating that only the "chosen few" who are loyal to him will be spared the fate of being eaten, before you, disgusted by him, either execute him or turn him in to the authorities. You are then able to save the thousands of colonists and go home as a hero. Woo-hoo, yay....
There's also an ending where you take a bribe he offers and let him go, but yeah, we'll ignore that one.
Freudian Excuse or other redeeming features?
Erm...no. The guy is scum who served his fellow man up on a silver platter for immortality that, when discussed with science division, is revealed to be extremely unlikely to work.
Heinousness?
Now, you can play as a douchebag, with the crowning moment being given the choice to execute a small child to spare him the "trauma" of what Plaxus has done...but even with your ability to choose some murderous actions, Plaxus will still disgust you in the end, and his attempted bodycount is in the thousands for.
Now, true, he only has one real crime, but it's so godawful and will hurt so many peoplw that I think it's enough, especially seeing as this is one of the shorter Choice of Games stories.
Final Verdict?
Keep.
No! That is NOT Solid Snake! Stop impersonating him!